[feta_mgp]

Cool, another fanboy thread.

+1 for the minority with issues side. Go enjoy your Mazda, sir. We're here to stop people like you and estoyloco from turning everyone away from what's in all honesty an amazing car. Stay away from MFT if you don't want to chance the issues, but all the rest is golden if you know what you're doing.

 

[Strix]

I just think it's a quirk of the PowerShift cause it's an automated manual and not a traditional automatic. So far I've felt some shudders and shakes similar to my Mazdaspeed 3 with it's 6-speed manual, but I haven't had any issues while driving so I just ignore it, if it gets worse than I'll take it back again.

Agreeing with this. There's a vagueness introduced by having computers operate the engine and transmission. It makes the car feel slow off the line. Pushing harder on the accelerator doesn't seem to help because the clutch and throttle are being controlled largely by software until the car is well in motion and the clutch is fully engaged.

It does not give the feeling of immediacy you get with a traditional torque convertor automatic.

That said, I don't think it feels much different than a manual transmission, which has to be engaged with some finesse if you want to avoid squealing away from every stop. But since you are controlling the clutch, it doesn't feel vague at all, as it does with a computer doing all the work.

As for the 'shudder', I could say I have that, too... but again, a proper understanding of how the transmission operates makes me think there is nothing really wrong, it's just a short-coming of the design. What's happening, in my opinion, is that the car is only downshifting one gear when it should be downshifting two. This causes the engine to 'lug' and a momentary shudder to be felt.

Ahhh... but a dual-clutch transmission cannot easily downshift two gears. By design it has to engage the gears in a sequential manner. This sometimes leads to the engine lugging for a moment because it's in the wrong gear. It doesn't feel like anything is seriously wrong... only that the car would prefer to be in a lower gear. I can push on the throttle more to force another downshift, or I can wait about 750 milliseconds and it will pass as the car accelerates.

If you've never driven a manual transmission... and I'm not assuming you haven't and I'm not trying to sound condescending... but if you've never had the opportunity to put a car into much too high of a gear, you may not be familiar with the sensation of an engine 'lugging' because of it. That's all this 'shudder' is.

There are also a number of noises made by this transmission that are quite unlike those made (or not made, rather) by a torque convertor automatic. These noises sound exactly like the noises made by manual transmission when pushing the gears around.

If people want to get upset that their automatic transmission is sometimes in the wrong gear (like every automatic ever made), and that it makes different noises and that it feels different than a completely different type of transmission... I can't/won't stop them. I think they are frustrating themselves for no reason, though. Personally, I'll get upset when the car won't move anymore. Until then, it's all good.

TL;DR: powershift transmission has quirks, some down to software, some down to design, and all of them are related to the fact that it's really a manual transmission. None of these quirks are serious enough to diminish the utility or enjoyment I get out of the car. Your mileage may vary.

 

[Montana]

As for the 'shudder', I could say I have that, too... but again, a proper understanding of how the transmission operates makes me think there is nothing really wrong, it's just a short-coming of the design. What's happening, in my opinion, is that the car is only downshifting one gear when it should be downshifting two. This causes the engine to 'lug' and a momentary shudder to be felt.

I certainly hope the trans will down shift into first when sitting at a stop light for several minutes. I have zero issues after I get the car moving and in between shifts. But you are correct in that it feels the same as when starting out in second gear on a manual trans vehicle, Has that shake to it.

Montana

 

[Tumdace]

I just got my Focus today and havent really noticed any issues. Put about 120km on it today.

The only really problem I have is a bit of worn off chrome off the door trim (where the window meets the door).

Gonna call the dealer and see if they can do anything about it.

 

[Strix]

I certainly hope the trans will down shift into first when sitting at a stop light for several minutes. I have zero issues after I get the car moving and in between shifts. But you are correct in that it feels the same as when starting out in second gear on a manual trans vehicle, Has that shake to it.

How many miles on yours? Mine shuddered a tiny bit when first taking off, but it went away relatively quickly as the clutches wore in.

I believe you are mostly complaining about the sluggish 'off the line' performance. I can agree that it feels sluggish... I'll even admit that it annoys me sometimes, but I don't think it's a serious problem.

It's just that the computer is trying get the car moving without lurching or squealing the tires.

 

[Montana]

How many miles on yours? Mine shuddered a tiny bit when first taking off, but it went away relatively quickly as the clutches wore in.

I believe you are mostly complaining about the sluggish 'off the line' performance. I can agree that it feels sluggish... I'll even admit that it annoys me sometimes, but I don't think it's a serious problem.

It's just that the computer is trying get the car moving without lurching or squealing the tires.

I am at about 950 right now. It isn't so much that it is sluggish off the line as there is a definite hole sometimes, It is enough that when you step on the throttle it will go for a millisecond and then fall on it's face and then decide it is time to go, It is bad enough when it does this that you will actually lean forward from the change in the vehicle like you stepped on the brake quickly. If you have ever driven a vehicle that has a carb and a faulty accelerator pump and it falls on it's face it is the same feeling.

Also from a dead stop and having sat there for a bit that is when I get the chatter, I do not get the chatter between shifts, Only when taking off from a dead stop.

Montana

 

[Strix]

I am at about 950 right now. It isn't so much that it is sluggish off the line as there is a definite hole sometimes, It is enough that when you step on the throttle it will go for a millisecond and then fall on it's face and then decide it is time to go, It is bad enough when it does this that you will actually lean forward from the change in the vehicle like you stepped on the brake quickly. If you have ever driven a vehicle that has a carb and a faulty accelerator pump and it falls on it's face it is the same feeling.

Yep. I know the feeling well. It's because of the disconnect between your foot and the actual workings of the throttle. The computer will only launch the car so fast... as I said in a previous post, pushing on the accelerator won't make it launch any faster. This can be disconcerting and makes it feel like the car is running poorly. It's not. It's just ignoring your input, LOL.

The solution is to drive it like the manual transmission that it is. Take it gingerly off the line and then mash the throttle.

You don't take your foot from the brake and directly mash on the throttle with a manual transmission. You work the throttle carefully while you let out the clutch, and then, if you want, you can stomp on it.

Punching it right off the line will result in disappointment. It will not act like a conventional torque convertor automatic and take right off. The car will ignore the fact that you are pushing on the accelerator until it gets moving and the clutch is fully engaged. Only then will it make the engine do what your right foot is telling it to do.

My advice is to get used to the sensation the car gives when the clutch fully engages and wait until then to really step on it.

If you have to have a hard launch because you are drag racing (tsk, tsk), use launch control. Turn traction control off, put the transmission in S, left foot on the brake, and floor the accelerator. It will rev up to about 2800 RPM and hang there. Then just take your foot off the brake for a nice tire-squeaking launch without the normal sluggishness.

Also from a dead stop and having sat there for a bit that is when I get the chatter, I do not get the chatter between shifts, Only when taking off from a dead stop.

That could be things wearing in, still. It took about 1,000 miles for mine to improve. Good luck, I hope that's all it is for you.

 

[estoyloco]

1) I never said that the Focus wasn't a great car. Find me a post where I have said to anyone not to get the focus? And obviously you rather have ignorant buyers than anything else. I knew well aware ahead of time that MFT was new tech and that it would have growing pains... but not to the extent that some of us had to put up with. It took 2 months and alot of headache before I got my MFT to a consistant working state... It would be one thing if it was just a quirk and MFT would continue to function but it is entirely systematic failures that ruin it, that is a difference between growing pains and a bad product or rather support of it.

2) You talk about JDP power knocking down Ford due to MFT, but you fail to realize that it is Fords plan to integrate high tech into their car lines. In addition JDP is run but CUSTOMER surveys. You say that the issues with MFT are in the minority yet obviously you fail to realize that this minority seemed to have affected Ford's IQ standing. So obviously this minority has huge voting power or JDP just managed to cherry pick owners with cars with bad tech only.
And just FYI the JDP IQS did not include the Focus 2012, the poor MFT ratings was all based on Edge/Explorer owners; the Focus would not have been able to even establish a foothold for it to be rated in the timeframe of the IQS.

3) To say the rating was unfair when the company behind it wants to enter that market segment and fails at it... but you can't rate it because its "unfair" is just laughable.

4) And I would like to remind you that IQS stands for "Initial Quality Survey"... it is not lets rate and estimate what your car will perform 1 year later after a crap load of firmware updates. It's what is the quality from day one of ownership through the 1st 3 months.

5) So you are right customers have no right to gripe about optional features that don't work right... they should just bend over and accept the fact it was optional so it was their fault and media should not mention a word about it because it was all optional so people can keep viewing doctored falsely advertised company videos and keep buying these broken optional features. Makes perfect sense, if you are the company that sells it.

This doesn't only apply to MFT, that's not what this thread is about. The press would have been a lot more adamant about making sure the Focus was criticized if so many people had issues with MFT, the transmission, misaligned body panels, etc.

MFT is only one part of the equation, and for JDPaA to knock them down over what is merely an OPTION is a ridiculous move on their part, and entirely unfair. You don't HAVE to buy the MFT equipped Focus, and therefor criticizing the car so harshly over an option is really a stupid thing to gripe about, if it's that bad, don't buy it, get the standard radio, or the standard MyFord system.

Most other reviewers criticized the MFT but not against the whole car, they mention almost unanimously that the Focus is an amazing car and a solid entry in the segment, but the MFT needs some work.

Please don't come at me without doing your homework first.

EDIT: press also isn't limited to automotive reviews. If the car was running rampant with issues like so many on this Forum preach, it would be covered on major news networks as well, as a heads up. Much like Toyota was covered when they had issues with their cars failing to stop, and much like when other cars have major issues and need recalls. Transmission issues, if they were truly issues, wouldn't be taken lightly.

+1 for the minority with issues side. Go enjoy your Mazda, sir. We're here to stop people like you and estoyloco from turning everyone away from what's in all honesty an amazing car. Stay away from MFT if you don't want to chance the issues, but all the rest is golden if you know what you're doing.

 

[jocamryn]

I'm glad I ordered a base model with the only option being AT. IMHO, Less features = less problems.

 

[RDJTX]

Cool, another fanboy thread.

I would not call myself a "fanboy" since I don't even have mine yet. This thread was actually a simple call to reality for those that are bitching about their car and making broad accuastions and how awful MFT and, in some cases, the enitre car is.

You have every right to bitch about your car, and those that have shit that works have every right to post their experiences without being called a "fanboy"

 

[jake1]

Will one of the folks on this thread who likes the focus transmission tell me whether or not you think shifting with the toggle switch is slower than shifting with an ordinary clutch or faster or the same. To me it seems that when using the toggle switch, it should result in a faster shift. Does it? Jake1

 

[SydneyRoo]

this thread derailed waaaaaaaaay off track

 

[Strix]

this thread derailed waaaaaaaaay off track

My bad. [:I]

 

[Skippy905]

I disagree a little.

While the obvious is that people that come to a board mainly arrive to find how to fix a problem, or complain, most people don't actively search out a forum just to say "my car works great".

However, there is still some merit to the amount of complaints being stated, no matter the amount of members. It is still like a survey, where the only thing that can change is the accuracy of the results the more people are polled.
The percentage of complaints compared to problems is not relative though.

What I mean by this is that if on a forum 50% of people complain about a problem, it doesn't mean 50% of the cars have that issue. It probably means that maybe 10% of the cars have that problem.

But if many people are complaining about certain issues on a forum, there probably is a problem. You can't use that chart you made to say the people are complaining about the MFT, but in reality there is no issue. We all know (FORD included) that there is a major problem. It may not be 90% of the vehicles like it seems when you read the threads, but I'll bet it is still around 50%. That is by far an unacceptable number (10% is unacceptable).

 

[jcarlilesiu]

The biggest issue that I have is that manufacturers are getting into the terrible habit of releasing things before they are ready. This act is a direct result of being the first to the market with X technology. I understand what is driving it, and I understand that it is consumers who are encouraging manufacturers to release products not ready for mainstream.

As far as peoples attempts to label a product bad across the board or blow things out of proportion, that's common. People are emotional, especially when dropping their hard earned money on something.

But lets talk about MFT for a moment. It simply isn't ready. They put it out there in a condition that in my opinion barely works, and when it does is very frustrating.

If this thing was a heart valve, people would be dead. If it was a bridge, it would have collapsed by now.

My point being that we as consumers have become complicit with allowing these manufacturers to release products to us which for all intents and purposes we believe to function as advertised, only to be let down. Whether that be an Ipod or MFT. Doesn't really matter.

The way to stop this from happening is to reduce the manufacturers motivation for putting it on the streets before its ready. Profitability being the first to the show. Many people aren't buying MFT, and even long after its fixed to the point it should have been before release, people will still avoid it.

Why? Because we all bitch and moan. And we should.

 

[Mattdoommaster]

There are some quality issues. MFT often works poorly and should not have been released in its current state. Also, there's the headliner issue. Some people are talking about paint quality, though paint quality paints seem common on all variety of cars.

I don't think the automatic transmission stutter is a quality issue, though a few owners may be having issues beyond what is normal. Other owners may simply dislike how the transmission functions when compared to a "normal" automatic.

If you want to see major problems, go surf the Ford Mustang forums. Buying a manual transmission is basically a gamble - will you get a car that you can drive? Or one that will be missing a few gears in 5,000 miles? Who knows!

It's important to keep tabs on quality issues but as this time, the Focus launch has been as smooth as could be expected.

 

[Kabigon]

IMHO, Less features = less problems.

That hasn't been my experience.

IMHO, less features = less enjoyment.

 

[feta_mgp]

1) I never said that the Focus wasn't a great car. Find me a post where I have said to anyone not to get the focus? And obviously you rather have ignorant buyers than anything else. I knew well aware ahead of time that MFT was new tech and that it would have growing pains... but not to the extent that some of us had to put up with. It took 2 months and alot of headache before I got my MFT to a consistant working state... It would be one thing if it was just a quirk and MFT would continue to function but it is entirely systematic failures that ruin it, that is a difference between growing pains and a bad product or rather support of it.

2) You talk about JDP power knocking down Ford due to MFT, but you fail to realize that it is Fords plan to integrate high tech into their car lines. In addition JDP is run but CUSTOMER surveys. You say that the issues with MFT are in the minority yet obviously you fail to realize that this minority seemed to have affected Ford's IQ standing. So obviously this minority has huge voting power or JDP just managed to cherry pick owners with cars with bad tech only.
And just FYI the JDP IQS did not include the Focus 2012, the poor MFT ratings was all based on Edge/Explorer owners; the Focus would not have been able to even establish a foothold for it to be rated in the timeframe of the IQS.

3) To say the rating was unfair when the company behind it wants to enter that market segment and fails at it... but you can't rate it because its "unfair" is just laughable.

4) And I would like to remind you that IQS stands for "Initial Quality Survey"... it is not lets rate and estimate what your car will perform 1 year later after a crap load of firmware updates. It's what is the quality from day one of ownership through the 1st 3 months.

5) So you are right customers have no right to gripe about optional features that don't work right... they should just bend over and accept the fact it was optional so it was their fault and media should not mention a word about it because it was all optional so people can keep viewing doctored falsely advertised company videos and keep buying these broken optional features. Makes perfect sense, if you are the company that sells it.

Skimmed your post. Stop talking about JDP if that doesn't even pertain to the Focus. No use talking about it if it's not the same exact system in our cars. Which it isn't.

You just have to make a big scene out of MFT everytime something happens instead of consolidating all your issues into one thread like I've suggested before. Why make people read through 10 threads to get information when you could just be smart and consolidate it into one? The ignorant one is you when all you do is complain and start a million different threads to do so. Complaining to us doesn't get you results.

Regardless, I don't know why you and I are always butting heads, I try to give some constructive criticism and you fly off the handle, at least that's how it started. You didn't even know what a TSB was the first time I mentioned it to you. Now I just plain don't like you, but I still play nice because this is a forum for enthusiasts, not a fighting ring.

You raise some valid points and have from the start but the bottom line is MFT isn't as big an issue in the Focus as it is on the other platforms as made evident by the fact that we aren't hearing or reading about all these major issues nearly as much as we would be from auto reviewers/news blogs. All these reviews are from the 2.10 iteration the car launched with and the only review I've seen of 2.11 states that a lot of it is vastly improved, while still not perfect.

Let's stop beating a dead horse (2.10) and start focusing on 2.11. It didn't fix all your issues, but it fixed plenty of others.

The main idea of this thread was to point out that this forum leads people to believe this car has several issues, which it doesn't. It's the initial launch of the car, they're rushing production because we're at a shortage, so there's bound to be a few bad eggs in the bunch, Ford will fix their mistakes. That doesn't mean that the majority of Foci have these issues. The trans shudder doesn't necessarily even seem like an issue, my car has run with no issues thus far, and when diagnosed I was told that was normal operation for the car.

While I'm on the fence believing that, I won't make a fuss about it until it becomes a big issue and renders the car unable to drive.

Let's just drop the back and forth arguing and agree to disagree here. The car is great, JDP's findings don't pertain to the Focus, and those reading it in regards to the Focus need to take it with a grain of salt. While some of us experience the same issues, a lot of us, myself included, have yet to experience issues.

 

[Elizabeth]

When I tell SYNC to: "Drive my car" it doesn't. [idea]
In fact i cannot get a single command to work... [:I]

ADDED: (it does not understand me. I do not know if i do not say the commands correctly, my speaking voice is to 'soft' or if it the system is just screwed up. the system asks me did I mean this: and no that is not what i wanted..)
Should i be angry? [!] [nutkick] [!]
Take it back and demand a refund? [ninja]
Try asking it 'nicer'? [hah] [poke]
I did not buy the car to talk to it. I bought it to drive it. So far, good deal... [8D]
ADDED: And I love driving a manual tranny, and the Focus is a good tranny. Nicer if it was a six speed, but as is OK by me.

 

[estoyloco]

Ofcourse you skimmed the post, just like how you made comments on my video without even watching it.

I'm sorry but the only ignorant person here is you. I said nothing in this thread until you decided to chime in and mention my name out of context that was totally incorrect.

1) I guess my 4 posts that I started complaining about MFT equates to 10.. which equates to a million different threads... looks like you need to go back to middle school to learn to count. If you are also going to make crap up atleast make sense and keep it in perspective, maybe it will be more believable then, one person starting 1 million threads out of the total 3.5 mil threads here just isn't that realistic. Yes that was some sarcasm for you, incase you got a little confused, don't hurt your brain on it; just move on.

Edit: I also like to add ofcourse you would encourage a thread that mocks fun of threads with legitimate complaints. But god forbid someone dare mention an actual problem without fanboys jumping down their throats. I know you were complaining about bandwidth utilization in another thread, this is at its best huh?

2) You were the one that brought up JDP buddy. I mainly pointed out the fact that well you were clueless on what you were talking about.

3) I simply owned you on the fact that you repeatedly state that MFT problems are insignificant and in the minority, yet it is enough to drop a rating down to 23rd place from 5th all based on owner feedback. In which you return to complain about that rating.

4) Ofcourse complaining to you doesn't help, why? because you do nothing but instigate arguments. I've learned plenty of other tricks from other users even from complaint threads. Why? because they actually contribute and offer advice that offers a solution to a complaint that was posted.

5) In fact in my post I no way made a personal attack, I believe you were the first one to call names... I guess it is always easy to resort to name calling when you have nothing smart to say. Obviously you are someone who doesn't know how to take "constructive criticism".

6) Where the heck do you get that I am beating a dead horse on 2.10? I'm lost on this one. If anything I keep saying 2.11 was a failed fix and obviously supported by the fact that Ford is aware that the issues this patch was supposed to fix still exist and they are still working on it with timeline of Jan 2012.

7) You are right about one thing, I'll agree to disagree with you. There is nothing I can learn from ignorance.

Edit: 8) Wait I take it back, I'll agree with you on another thing. "Please don't come at me without doing your homework first."

Skimmed your post. Stop talking about JDP if that doesn't even pertain to the Focus. No use talking about it if it's not the same exact system in our cars. Which it isn't.

You just have to make a big scene out of MFT everytime something happens instead of consolidating all your issues into one thread like I've suggested before. Why make people read through 10 threads to get information when you could just be smart and consolidate it into one? The ignorant one is you when all you do is complain and start a million different threads to do so. Complaining to us doesn't get you results.

Regardless, I don't know why you and I are always butting heads, I try to give some constructive criticism and you fly off the handle, at least that's how it started. You didn't even know what a TSB was the first time I mentioned it to you. Now I just plain don't like you, but I still play nice because this is a forum for enthusiasts, not a fighting ring.

You raise some valid points and have from the start but the bottom line is MFT isn't as big an issue in the Focus as it is on the other platforms as made evident by the fact that we aren't hearing or reading about all these major issues nearly as much as we would be from auto reviewers/news blogs. All these reviews are from the 2.10 iteration the car launched with and the only review I've seen of 2.11 states that a lot of it is vastly improved, while still not perfect.

Let's stop beating a dead horse (2.10) and start focusing on 2.11. It didn't fix all your issues, but it fixed plenty of others.

The main idea of this thread was to point out that this forum leads people to believe this car has several issues, which it doesn't. It's the initial launch of the car, they're rushing production because we're at a shortage, so there's bound to be a few bad eggs in the bunch, Ford will fix their mistakes. That doesn't mean that the majority of Foci have these issues. The trans shudder doesn't necessarily even seem like an issue, my car has run with no issues thus far, and when diagnosed I was told that was normal operation for the car.

While I'm on the fence believing that, I won't make a fuss about it until it becomes a big issue and renders the car unable to drive.

Let's just drop the back and forth arguing and agree to disagree here. The car is great, JDP's findings don't pertain to the Focus, and those reading it in regards to the Focus need to take it with a grain of salt. While some of us experience the same issues, a lot of us, myself included, have yet to experience issues.