[TboneZX3]

Ford "Honey" - XT-M5-QS is a comparable 75w90 gear oil dork there is a HUGE thread on this.

First of all, there is no reason to call anyone names. Consider this a warning.

Second of all, regardless of what Ford has stated in the past, XT-M5-QS has been independently lab tested and found that its formulation is closest to synthetic diesel engine oil, 15W-40 not 75w90 gear oil. Gear oil does not contain the same anti-wear additives that are present in XT-M5-QS and synth diesel engine oil.

Many gear oils contain additives that will ruin brass synchronizers (especially GL-5 and higher). Gear oils can be used in the MTX75, but you must be very careful when selecting one.

 

[qweesy]

^^^You are wrong too,did you even read the thread? here you go again.... Its comparable to a 75w90

XT-M5-QS is the specified lubricant for the MTX-75, it specifically references this in the Standard ZX3 Ford Focus Owners manual, So why does the SVT guide book say "Ford Synthetic Manual transmission fluid." Turns out this was a misprint, Ford never stated what the true weight of the factory gear oil actually is or even a part number in the SVT book; but if you contact a Ford service tech they tell you "XT-M5-QS is the suggested fluid for proper operation of the Getrag MTX-285." As does the Ford service CD (I know people ).

The irritating part is, the bottle and nearly nowhere else states what the actual viscosity rating is for this fluid. I decided this is where I needed to dig deeper, any company that makes fluids is required to release technical data about the fluid to the general public, Motorcraft has a full website on all of the specifics about their fluids, MSDS, as well as application chart, which can be found here>>> https://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubrica...sp?product=Full Synthetic Manual Transmission Fluid&category=Transmission Fluid. If you will direct your attention to the first paragraph.... "Motorcraft® Full Synthetic Manual Transmission Fluid is a premium-quality SAE 75W-90 gear oil recommended by Ford Motor Company meeting warranty requirements. ".


----------------Kinematic Viscosity---------Visc
Fluid -----------cSt 100-------cSt 40-------Idx-----------4-ball wear-------Falex
WSD-MC2(XT-M5-QS)15.4-----------76 ---------211--------------?-------------? <---The Ford Stuff

Amsoil
Synt Man Tr------14.7-----------84.5---------151-----------.45------------ ?

Amsoil
Severe gear------16.7-----------109.1--------165------------?----------- 2500

Amsoil
Long Life Gr------16.6------------129.7--------137------------?----------- 2000

Royal Purp
Max Gear---------19.1------------132-----------?-------------?-------------?

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Amsoil
Synchromesh -----9.6 -------------47.1 --------194 ----------.40-----------?

Royal Purp
Synchromax -------7.7 ------------35.3 --------196------------?------------?

 

[TboneZX3]

Yes, I did read the thread. Have you bothered to read the thread that was linked above from Terry Haines, the foremost authority on the MTX75 transmission? To me, it is more noteworthy than your quoted post above.

Independent lab tests have proven that synthetic diesel engine oil is the closest formulation to XT-M5-QS. I don't see anything in your chart above about additives. You are only showing viscosity comparisons, not formulation, and you should be aware that lubricant manufacturers aren't always completely forthcoming about their product. Lab tests will reveal formulation data that the manufacturers aren't willing to release.

Also keep in mind that engine oils and gear oils are not viscosity-rated using the same standard. The actual viscosity of 15W-40 engine oil and 75W-90 gear oil are very close, but rated by separate guidelines, and thus show different numbering standards on their labeling. IT IS THE FORMULATION THAT IS THE IMPORTANT DIFFERENCE.

Independent testing is the reason why Royal Purple no longer recommends the use of Syncromax in the MTX-75, but rather HPS 10w-40--because it is closer to the viscosity and formulation of XT-M5-QS.

 

[qweesy]

Yes, I did read the thread. Have you bothered to read the thread that was linked from Terry Haines, the foremost authority on the MTX75 transmission?

Independent lab tests have proven Diesel engine oil is the closest formulation to XT-M5-QS. I don't see anything in your chart above about additives. You are only showing viscosity and wear comparisons, not formulation. You should also be aware that lubricant manufacturers aren't always completely forthcoming about their product. Lab tests will reveal data that the manufacturers aren't willing to release.

Independent testing is the reason why Royal Purple no longer suggests the use of Syncromax in the MTX-75, but rather HPS 10w-40--because it is closer to the formulation of XT-M5-QS.

Keep in mind that engine oils and gear oils are not viscosity-rated using the same standard. The actual viscosity of 15W-40 engine oil and 75W-90 gear oil are very close, but rated by separate guidlines. IT IS THE ADDITIVES THAT ARE IMPORTANT.

You want to give out wrong information go for it.

You can run what you want, but Ive ran over 100k miles with multiple 75w90 gear oils without issue in the MTX75 and the Getrag 285.

Yes I did read what Terry had to say.Post the Terry Haines Info of his lab results i cant find them...

 

[TboneZX3]

You want to give out wrong information go for it.

You can run what you want, but Ive ran over 100k miles with multiple 75w90 gear oils without issue in the MTX75 and the Getrag 285.

Thank you for your blessing. You also have my blessing to take Ford's word on the subject, if that's what you want to do. There are owners I know who have run ATF or Syncromax in the MTX75 for over 100,000 miles with no issues also. That doesn't necessarily mean it's the best lubricant to use.

Yes I did read what Terry had to say.Post the Terry Haines Info of his lab results i cant find them...

15w-40 engine oils fit right into your viscosity chart above, right next to 75w-90 gear oil. Perhaps if either of us can come up with more than just viscosity information, we might further add to the discussion. As it is, I won't outright say someone is wrong (and call them names) about the subject as you do, until there's more data available to prove someone is actually wrong.

 

[Highball116]

Guys, it's transmission fluid. You must have better things to do.

Toby

 

[Romans5.8]

Guys, it's transmission fluid. You must have better things to do.

Toby

Well, for one, I don't understand why people argue or get emotional about it.

BUT; it is a good discussion. We all want our cars to perform their best and last a long time. Some people take it through the auto car wash, change the oil at the quickie-lube with whatever is cheapest, and ignore the transmission. Other guys wash with a 2 bucket method and premium equipment, change the oil themselves with a high quality synthetic, and stress over what the best juice is for their transmission!

Different strokes for different folks! (Or 'blokes' for our English friends )

 

[1turbofocus]

I use synthetic Mobile engine 50wt oil in My MTX-75 and SVT Getrag and have in over 200 other Foci with no issue at all , If it holds up to 300+ HP to the wheels for 14 years should be fine to keep using

Tom

 

[BrApple]

You are wrong

Ford "Honey" - XT-M5-QS is a comparable 75w90 gear oil dork there is a HUGE thread on this.

Ive ran Redline MTL, Amsoil 75w90 and RP Maxx gear 75w90 in Both the MTX 75 and the Getrag 285 SVT now for a combined mileage of over 100k NO ISSUES shifts way better in both transmissions. RP Maxx gear feels the best.

I change the fluid every 30,000

Synchromax is too thin, enjoy all the brass in your trans from jacked up synchromax...

Besides you drive a 2012 so your input is nil enjoy your DCT


Here is the definitive thread on trans oil

http://www.focusfanatics.com/forum/showthread.php?t=278437

I was just trying to share the information that I had available to answer the question, no need to attack me about it.

I know of and have meet the person that started the thread you linked to. I trust the information that Terry Haines has proved over that person, which is the same information that I provided.

I have run the factory fill of atf, mobil1 atf with friction modified, ford honey, and synco max for well over 200k miles in 4 different vehicles with the MTX-75 without any issues.

Just because something works doesn't mean that it is correct, this goes for any fluid referenced in this thread.

Gear oil is not for a sycronized manual transmission. Perhaps the Ford Honey and 75w90 gear oil have the same weight, however, imho, they aren't meant to be used for the other application.


BTW, just because I also drive a 2012 doesn't automatically mean I have a DCT. I completely enjoy the MTX-75 on all three of my current cars, which includes the 2012 Focus.

 

[TboneZX3]

5w-40 Rotella T6 is working great in my old MTX75.

 

[1turbofocus]

Just because something works doesn't mean that it is correct, this goes for any fluid referenced in this thread.

So we should all keep our Foci stock ? Just because you can make it a performance vehicle it works doesnt mean you should

Just because it didnt come turbocharged and it works means we shouldnt , just because the SP463 / AR103 (depending on engine) works we shouldnt use then ?

Come on .... thats silly

Terry told me over 10 years ago that synthetic engine oil in the MTX-75/getreg wouldnt last yet its been running in many for hundreds or thousands of miles and 10 years when you add in boost making 3-5 times the stock HP thats even more load and abuse on the gears and trans bearings , I have no faith in things from terry , he said the MTX-75 wouldnt hold over 300 wheel hp yet we know it holds over 600Hp
So use the oil you think works best in the end thats the oil that will work best for YOU

Tom

Tom

 

[VillageT]

MTX75 Lube

Elizabeth has it backwards-the trans is designed to use that fluid. The bearings, syncros and other parts are all tested using that lube. Why would you use something else?

My trans works fine with 160K and the only thing in it has been the factory spec Motorcraft lube. I fully expect to go 250K and I do not drive it easy.

 

[GhostTribute]

I have been using Lucas 80w/85w 100% synthetic trans oil for well over 100k. Smooth shifts and after two fluid changes. I have yet to find any particles in the pan or a hint of burnt fluid. This trans oil drains almost as clean as the day it went into the case. Can't say the same for the OEM Ford stuff that was in there when I first drained it out... It f#@king smelled like cancer and was full of grit.

Yes I know it is a motorcycle oil....all that been said. It covers the same API viscosity range as the usual GL4 $25-30/L vs $15/L.

Now all things being fair. I bought the vehicle with 70k on it and I'm not sure if the original fluid had ever been changed. All I can say is that when I changed it at 100k it was funky!

 

[BrApple]

So use the oil you think works best in the end thats the oil that will work best for YOU

That is what I was trying to get at .... and I was not indicating that a Focus shouldn't be modified. Look at my Contour, that should clearly show that.

I do run the Ford Honey in that car, for what it is worth.

 

[TboneZX3]

Elizabeth has it backwards-the trans is designed to use that fluid. The bearings, syncros and other parts are all tested using that lube. Why would you use something else?

Well, no... The fluid that is specified for the MTX75 today is not what was originally specified for it, so it was not designed to use it. It was not even available when the MTX75 was designed.

 

[SoKalFocus]

I just hock a lugie in mine, works great!!

 

[a car nut]

If it is a customer's vehicle, stock is always best from a liability stand point. I've used both the stock Ford fluid (bought locally for $18.00 a quart), but in my SVT (long gone) which had shifting problems, I put 15w-50 Mobil 1 in and the shifting issues were gone.

Stock can be a safe choice, especially if the vehicle is under warranty, however, stock may not always be the best.