5 Speed Owners: Engine Bog Down?

BetaDnB · Sep 19, 2011

downincircles said:
I don't think anyone without a 5 speed really know what we're experiencing.

Having a car run/accelerate at 25% of its normal functionality isn't a fuel saving or mechanical prevention feature. It's a malfunction.

Luckily, I haven't had it happen since.

I agree...

25%? I don't know if I'd even give it that.

Oddly enough it hasn't happened to me either since you started this thread. It's gotta be our crazy Buffalo air. I mean the Bills are 2-0 for crying out loud!

mikeJones · Sep 20, 2011

Ive had this problem too. I have also had a couple times where its hard to shift to first from a stop. Third also feels a little "crunchy" sometimes.

elwood125 · Sep 20, 2011

have not ran into this yet on mine, but will keep an eye open on the ford dealers discussion boards and the tsb's.

PratoN · Sep 20, 2011

mikeJones said:
Ive had this problem too. I have also had a couple times where its hard to shift to first from a stop. Third also feels a little "crunchy" sometimes.

I've set up an appointment to have it looked at on Thursday, I'll let you know what they say/do.

nateyo · Sep 21, 2011

This is my first manual so I'm not sure I may be experiencing what you guys are, but I've noticed that you really have to give it the beans if you want to get a good start in 1st. I can get going at 1500k into first but its like I have to let the clutch out really slow (slip it?) in order not to jolt into first. If I give it more gas I can let the clutch out in a quicker manner. It seems there isn't a lot of torque in low RPMs which really sucks. Also, it seems the throttle control is definitely not tuned for response, but for mpg's. Anyone tried programming their Fords in the past? Perhaps with the right equipment you can tune the throttle response to something more sporty.

downincircles · Sep 21, 2011

nateyo said:
This is my first manual so I'm not sure I may be experiencing what you guys are, but I've noticed that you really have to give it the beans if you want to get a good start in 1st. I can get going at 1500k into first but its like I have to let the clutch out really slow (slip it?) in order not to jolt into first. If I give it more gas I can let the clutch out in a quicker manner. It seems there isn't a lot of torque in low RPMs which really sucks. Also, it seems the throttle control is definitely not tuned for response, but for mpg's. Anyone tried programming their Fords in the past? Perhaps with the right equipment you can tune the throttle response to something more sporty.

You're correct, this is just a lack of low end torque. The max hp is at 4000 rpm on our car, more sport tuned cars will ahve the hp kick hit max much lower near 2000-2500 to get that "jump" everyone desires.

If this happens to you you'll know it, because at that 1500 rpm where you lock into 1st gear, you'll almost stall out because no power is coming from the engine. That's how you'll know.

Jdog913 · Sep 21, 2011

downincircles said:
You're correct, this is just a lack of low end torque. The max hp is at 4000 rpm on our car, more sport tuned cars will ahve the hp kick hit max much lower near 2000-2500 to get that "jump" everyone desires.

If this happens to you you'll know it, because at that 1500 rpm where you lock into 1st gear, you'll almost stall out because no power is coming from the engine. That's how you'll know.

You mean torque right. I really beginning to wondering if this is "ENGINE BOG" is just a combination of things driver skill, electronic throttle response, and the torque of four cylinder.

cuke2u · Sep 21, 2011

Hi, more than likely it is due to the 'peaky' ouput of a twin cam 16 valve engine..
Chris

BetaDnB · Sep 21, 2011

Jdog913 said:
You mean torque right. I really being to wondering if this is "ENGINE BOG" is just a combination of things driver skill, electronic throttle response, and the torque of four cylinder.

Considering I've been driving manual transmission cars consecutively for 9 years, all of which had far less torque, and I've never had this happen, I think we can eliminate driver skill and torque.

BiggerBoat · Sep 21, 2011

I believe I have seen a couple folks on the boards end up with an AC compressor replacement that was ceasing/high loading on their engine causing major power loss. Just a guess based on reading through threads over the summer. Do you recall if AC was even running at the time?

BetaDnB · Sep 21, 2011

BiggerBoat said:
I believe I have seen a couple folks on the boards end up with an AC compressor replacement that was ceasing/high loading on their engine causing major power loss. Just a guess based on reading through threads over the summer. Do you recall if AC was even running at the time?

We're having this issue without AC running.

DougC · Sep 21, 2011

This issue has been rearing its ugly head for me too. The Focus I test drove did not have this issue at all. It is at its worst with the AC on but it can and does happen at any time. There is neither rhyme nor reason to it. Occasionally the throttle reacts as if I'm not even pressing it.... end up having to clutch it and depress the throttle a couple times to get it sorted out. It is an odd issue for sure.

Jdog913 · Sep 21, 2011

BetaDnB said:
Considering I've been driving manual transmission cars consecutively for 9 years, all of which had far less torque, and I've never had this happen, I think we can eliminate driver skill and torque.

Let me make this more clear for YOU. I said I was beginning to wonder if this "ENGINE BOG" is just a combination of things such as driver skill, electronic throttle response and torque of a four cylinder. I never said you couldn't drive a stick. So quit jumping to conclusion that is extremely immature and rude. I was trying to the note the drivers skill and electronic throttle maybe link. We all have our natural routine when driving a manual transmission. If you are use to a cable driven throttle, then go to a electronic throttle you may not be use to lag which can result in lazy take-off, as well as other things. Plus being a manual transmission there is always room for human error. As far as the torque, I am not sure why everyone refers to advertised torque. Engines don't make advertised torque at all RPM's. Some engines have nice flat torque curves, and some are exponential. Though an engine may have less torque that doesn't necessarily mean the low-end torque is low. The engine with low torque may have a very flat torque curve. Having 9,000+ miles on my P3K I can tell you that it definitely doesn't have a flat torque curve. This being said I am sure that the following plays a factor into the "ENGINE BOG" driver skill, electronic throttle and torque. I highly doubt there is anything wrong with any of these vehicles. First because I have one of the earlier "problematic foci" and have not experienced this "ENGINE BOG" ever. Second it is specifically to manuals which is kind of odd in its own. As someone said it is going to be extremely hard for a technician to diagnosis a problem that occurs once in a while.

BiggerBoat said:
I believe I have seen a couple folks on the boards end up with an AC compressor replacement that was ceasing/high loading on their engine causing major power loss. Just a guess based on reading through threads over the summer. Do you recall if AC was even running at the time?

This happened on the earlier foci. It is because when they manufacturer the car they did not put oil in the compressor pump just in the AC lines. So the initial time the air compressor is turned on it doesn't have any oil. Some of us had some locked up AC compressors. They have corrected this problem though. Plus if your AC compressor locks up your car wouldn't idle with the AC clutch engaged.

BetaDnB · Sep 21, 2011

Jdog913 said:
Let me make this more clear for YOU. I said I was beginning to wonder if this "ENGINE BOG" is just a combination of things such as driver skill, electronic throttle response and torque of a four cylinder. I never said you couldn't drive a stick. So quit jumping to conclusion that is extremely immature and rude.

Jesus, take it easy. I was just eliminating YOUR "possibilities" for you. You want to talk about rude, look at how you're completely misinterpreting what I said and how your replies read. I'm guessing you didn't even read the whole thread to find out this is happening with 2000rpm launches, so that also eliminates your electronic throttle lag theory. Amazingly I know how to read a tach as well and always use it when launching. NEXT. Just because YOU aren't having the problem and you have an early problematic Focus doesn't mean it's not happening to others. I also have an early build Focus and this is the only problem I'm having.

dasilvarsa · Sep 21, 2011

I cannot find official Ford Power vs torque vs RPM graph for this engine.
I wonder where this info is available.
Does anyone have this info ?

My car is responsive going through the gears,
no problem getting to 160 km/hr (100 mi/hr) fast.
If you let it drop to say 80 km/hr (50 mi/hr ) in fifth gear and then floor it, it takes forever to pick up speed again. A drop to 3rd 4th 5th makes it fly again.
Engine only done 1000 miles so far but it seems to be improving slowly.
The 5th gear seems to be ratioed too low, definite overdrive at 0.8 to 1
I'm finding myself driving more and more in 4th to have some power under foot
4th gear ratio is 1 to 1, Ford seems to have put too much into fuel economy and not too much into fun driving. Even the second gear seems a bit tall for nice fast cornering.

Jdog913 · Sep 21, 2011

dasilvarsa said:
I cannot find official Ford Power vs torque vs RPM graph for this engine.
I wonder where this info is available.
Does anyone have this info ?

REDFOCZ is the only member that I know who might have one. Maybe PM him.

downincircles · Sep 21, 2011

Jdog, read the whole thread.

User error can't be attributed to something that happens throughout a series of shifts, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, not just launch. No matter what throttle it is, when a car is in gear and the gas pedal is to the floor, you shouldn't be begging for the car to move. If it's in gear, its in gear. If the car is barely moving while its in gear, then the car is barely moving.

It seems like there's 3 or 4 people in this thread that know what we're talking about experiencing and should be talking, and 10 people that just want to be part of the conversation using speculation.

Everyone seems to think we just want more power, which is far from what this is about. We want the car to move, period, without getting honked at from behind or t-boned in an intersection.

PratoN · Sep 21, 2011

downincircles said:
Everyone seems to think we just want more power, which is far from what this is about. We want the car to move, period, without getting honked at from behind or t-boned in an intersection.

+1 on the avoiding T-bones. This only happened to me once - but I was trying to get through a gap of traffic on a road with a significant uphill grade.

dasilvarsa · Sep 21, 2011

PratoN said:
+1 on the avoiding T-bones. This only happened to me once - but I was trying to get through a gap of traffic on a road with a significant uphill grade.

It seems like you have to use the gearbox on this car.
Depending on speed downshifting to 2nd or 3rd makes it fly again.

nateyo · Sep 21, 2011

dasilvarsa said:
It seems like you have to use the gearbox on this car.
Depending on speed downshifting to 2nd or 3rd makes it fly again.

Yup. On my drive to work there is a very hilly back road. If I'm on a flat section I'll have it in 4th, but when a hill comes up I'll put it in 3rd otherwise I'd lose speed going uphill.

5 Speed Owners: Engine Bog Down?

BetaDnB

mikeJones

elwood125

PratoN

nateyo

downincircles

Jdog913

cuke2u

BetaDnB

BiggerBoat

BetaDnB

DougC

Jdog913

BetaDnB

dasilvarsa

Jdog913

downincircles

PratoN

dasilvarsa

nateyo

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