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turbocharging...

1.1K views 16 replies 6 participants last post by  Pitch Black216  
#1 ·
okay. I've been looking around, researching, calculating, etc. I was thinking about getting a PW s/c kit for my car someday, but I've been thinking about a junkyard turbo kit. Basically, I'm looking at utilizing either a IHI RHB52 off a 2.2 turbo probe or 626, a garrett or mitsu turbo off a 2.3 turbo volvo, or going big with a Holset HX35 off a turbo-diesel cummins. I only plan to run something like maybe 8-12 psi, running 91-93 pump gas. I have several questions.

-What are the options for manifold's? are the OBX ones really worth 400 bucks? or would it be easier to score a junkyard zetec manifold and have a shop weld a mounting flange on?

-Which setup is easier to set-up...a draw-thru or blow-thru? I've been trying to figure out the advantages of both

-I'm still figuring out various things. Based on my rough calculations, I'll need around 42 lb/hr or 450 cc/min injectors. This is based on hoping to get about 250-ish horsepower.....or maybe like a mid 30 lb/hr would work too?

-wastegate...I was told something like a 38mm Tial would work pretty good for this application...

-Blow off....probably a Greddy S type...they seem to be popular...

-intercooler. Haven't figured that out yet. Probably a small FMIC I imagine....I"ll have to look around for that.

-Piping. What's a good size to run? probably 3" on the intake side? I"ll probably end up running a 2.5" or 3" exhaust.

-fuel system. Will the stock fuel pump flow enough? I've heard of people using a Kenne Bell "boost a pump" with good results.

-MAF....sizing and type?

-tuning. Most important obviously, but I haven't figured out what I'm going to do about that yet....SCT maybe?

I'm still looking at compressor maps and figuring out stuff, so I'm open to any suggestions..


any thoughts or advice is helpful....[driving]
 
#2 ·
Ok.

-What are the options for manifold's? are the OBX ones really worth 400 bucks? or would it be easier to score a junkyard zetec manifold and have a shop weld a mounting flange on?

A: On a budget, scrapping a stock headder, and having a turbo and wastegate flange welded on would be ok.. You get what you pay for with e-bay. check out. http://www.jgstools.com/turbo/ to get flanges etc to have a manifold fabricated for your purpose.. It would be better..

-Which setup is easier to set-up...a draw-thru or blow-thru? I've been trying to figure out the advantages of both

A: Draw through is pointless, and dangerous.. Blow through is the way to go.. Drawl through would require some type of injection system before the inlet on the intake side of the turbo to spin the incomming fuel into a mist using the turbo as the device.. dangerous.. stick with just compression air in a blow through and letting the tune decide the fuel to add..

-I'm still figuring out various things. Based on my rough calculations, I'll need around 42 lb/hr or 450 cc/min injectors. This is based on hoping to get about 250-ish horsepower.....or maybe like a mid 30 lb/hr would work too?

A: 42 is good for 220, 250 on a stock motor might be destruction.. depends on tune.. 60 is a little high.. Get Matched 42's..

-wastegate...I was told something like a 38mm Tial would work pretty good for this application...

A: 35 AKA Delta Gate, or 38 MM Would be Fine.

-Blow off....probably a Greddy S type...they seem to be popular...

A: Whatever you want... As long as it functions.

-intercooler. Haven't figured that out yet. Probably a small FMIC I imagine....I"ll have to look around for that.

A: 25"x5"x2.5" Would be fine. Fits in the stock bumper with minor cutting.

-Piping. What's a good size to run? probably 3" on the intake side? I"ll probably end up running a 2.5" or 3" exhaust.

A: 3" Into the turbo, 2.5" from the turbo to IC, to TB.

-fuel system. Will the stock fuel pump flow enough? I've heard of people using a Kenne Bell "boost a pump" with good results.

A: Stock Pump will work fine for 220.

-MAF....sizing and type?

A: Depends, Compressed air, is compressed air.. I would get a flange welded to the IC pipe (2.5" from IC to TB) for the stock MAF and use a Diablo MAF.ia

-tuning. Most important obviously, but I haven't figured out what I'm going to do about that yet....SCT maybe?

A: Yes.. SCT. Get a Base Tune to start it and check for vaccume leaks, etc... The Get it tunned at a dyno.



My 2 cents...
 
#3 ·
Im in the same boat as you are PARKINGLOT, in terms of what i wanted to know about building a junkyard turbo kit. I am intrested in what this will cost to source all the parts. Also can i get a turbo flange put on a 4-1 race header?

thanks.
 
#4 ·
so say, aiming for 200-220 on a stock motor is okay. I plan to pick up a short block sometime (I know someone parting out a Zetec escort) and build that, but that's after the fact...
 
#5 ·
-Which setup is easier to set-up...a draw-thru or blow-thru? I've been trying to figure out the advantages of both

A. Draw-thru is easier to tune but blow-thru is most accurate

-I'm still figuring out various things. Based on my rough calculations, I'll need around 42 lb/hr or 450 cc/min injectors. This is based on hoping to get about 250-ish horsepower.....or maybe like a mid 30 lb/hr would work too?

A. i would go up to 60lbs injectors

-wastegate...I was told something like a 38mm Tial would work pretty good for this application...

A. i have a Turbonetics Evolution and it works great

-Blow off....probably a Greddy S type...they seem to be popular...

A. thats what i have and i love it. its not real loud but not as loud as the Greddy RS

-Piping. What's a good size to run? probably 3" on the intake side? I"ll probably end up running a 2.5" or 3" exhaust.

A. if you go draw-thru, intake side of turbo should be 3 in. then after the turbo 2.5 in. i had toms full kit, and it came out of the turbo at 2 1/4 in (i think) to the IC. then from the IC to the TB it was 2.5 in

and with a blow-thru i would run 3 in on the intake side of the turbo. 2.5 in from turbo to IC. and 2.5 most the way to TB and open it up to 3 in for the MAF.

-fuel system. Will the stock fuel pump flow enough? I've heard of people using a Kenne Bell "boost a pump" with good results.

A. stock will be fine for 230 hp

-MAF....sizing and type?

A. stock with a 3 in piping and a MAF.ia

-tuning. Most important obviously, but I haven't figured out what I'm going to do about that yet....SCT maybe?

A. talk to the local tuners and see what they tune. or if you are going to places like FS, Focus-power, or McNews see what they think.


Hope this helps. sorry i dont know much about sizing turbos.
 
#7 ·
yeah, you are right. i was just thinking about the addictive part of boosting. you know, you will hit 230 hp and a week later you are going to want 330 hp.
 
#8 ·
60's work fine its all in the injector pulse... hell Tom runs 96's in the Black SVT.
 
#9 ·
well, I came up with some numbers on excel to compare on a compressor map. Shooting for around 200-220 for the moment. Turns out the MX6/Probe turbo is watercooled, so I don't think I'll use one of those. I'm comparing to a Volvo right now.....okay, that ain't gonna work either...way off past the right side of the choke line...Let's try the holset next...still looking for a map...still trying to find a map, but got caught up reading a story on a guy running one on a 2.3 Lima engine...

well...very nice, he ran a 12.7 with it at like mid-20's psi...all stock motor with only a mildly ported head....I'm liking what I'm reading here..
still looking for the elusive compressor map though...
 
#10 ·
okay...Do those of you with turbo motors that have BOV's, is the just dumped out or re-circ'd back in by-pass valve style? any problems with running rich when shifting?

Boost Controller. How could I forget about this? I'm thinking something like a manual HKS VPC unit or something similar...I don't mind popping the hood to change it manually..

And now the fun part. I found a turbo map for the holset. Turns out it's a tad....big...for running 10 psi on a 2.0...my solution? run more boost [:D] I guess I'll need that spare block....what's a good way to build for boost? I've got to look up pistons and stuff now...
 
#11 ·
well thats the probably with draw-thru. when your bov releases the pressure into the air, because that air has been through the maf, yes you will run rich for a sec.

but with blow-thru you can place the bov before the maf. so when your bov goes off that air has yet to go through the maf. and because of that it will still run beautifully.

i have ran both setups and i had no probably when running draw-thru but now i have blow-thru i love it.

as for BC, i love my Greddy Profec B spec 2. with it i can just push a button and swich from high boost to low.
 
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#12 ·
well....I think I may have been really bored.....I just made a 7 cell by 30 cell data spread sheet, figuring out pressure ratios and mass flow rates for the 2.0 from 8 psi to 20. I'm in the process of comparing the data to different compressor maps, trying to come up with something useful.

I don't think a holset will work. Too big for anything but like a 30psi race motor....


well thats the probably with draw-thru. when your bov releases the pressure into the air, because that air has been through the maf, yes you will run rich for a sec.

but with blow-thru you can place the bov before the maf. so when your bov goes off that air has yet to go through the maf. and because of that it will still run beautifully.

i have ran both setups and i had no problem when running draw-thru but now i have blow-thru i love it.
Is it enough to foul the plugs up eventually or anything like that? or just a minor issue....
 
#13 ·
What is a good sized turbo for our engines? I was thinking about maybe a 1G DSM TD05H-16G unit...it seems to be a good one...
 
#14 ·
either that or a 1G DSM TD05H-14B turbo...looking on ebay, you can get an EVO "big" 16G for like 250....

how does a water cooled center work? would it get cooled off the rad?
 
#16 ·
yea that's what I just mentioned. However, looking on ebay, you can get a nice 57 trim T3/T4 hybrid for like 200-300 bucks. I looked at the compressor maps for one and it's a very good match for the focus at almost any boost pressure, i.e. 8 psi, 10 psi, 12 psi, etc....so, I think I may buy one in the next week or so (depending on if I've got the spare cash)

next question. With proper tuning, how much boost can a stock zetec motor take safely? 8, 10, 12 psi? Do you need to lower the stock compression ratio or is it okay to leave it?
 
#17 ·
if you are looking around 200-300 i would look into the T3 Super 60, gt28r or the gt28rs, the T3/T4 is a tad big for low 200s. if its not a CBB the T3/T4 will take some time to spool.

and with the boost question. its not so much the boost but its the HP. most people would say 250ish. but there are a few people running over 300 with stock block. but i deffenatly would run that much. id stay around 230-250