Focus Fanatics Forum banner

1 - 19 of 19 Posts

·
__________/\__
Joined
·
2,183 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
The producers want the federal government to raise the federally mandated blending amounts:

EPA is now 10 months late in finalizing the 2014 rule. If EPA raises the volume requirements, the supply chain is unable to retroactively generate additional compliance credits for the first nine months of 2014. This problem will grow in 2015 as EPA continues to delay release of the 2015 proposed rule, compounding compliance challenges for obligated parties managing volatile and uncertain RIN markets,” according to the refiners’ letter. … Our industry does not oppose renewable fuels and is one of the largest investors in renewable technologies. However, technological and market limitations exist and consumers, not the federal government, should determine what goes in their cars.

http://247wallst.com/energy-business/2014/10/19/why-it-matters-that-ethanol-prices-are-collapsing/
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,475 Posts
I personally hate what ethanol does to the performance of my cars. And how it damages the mpgs.
I used to be able to travel out of my county to find 100% gasoline gas, but for years this has been made impossible as all the surrounding counties now are alos required to use 10% ethanol.

I can only hope the government sees fit to get rid of this boondoggle.
And at least not keep the total, so the percentage per gallon does not have to be increased.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
289 Posts
I personally hate what ethanol does to the performance of my cars. And how it damages the mpgs.
I used to be able to travel out of my county to find 100% gasoline gas, but for years this has been made impossible as all the surrounding counties now are alos required to use 10% ethanol.

I can only hope the government sees fit to get rid of this boondoggle.
And at least not keep the total, so the percentage per gallon does not have to be increased.
I agree completely. Gains from mixing ethanol into reg. gas are marginal at best and problematic at worst. Most people aren't aware that ethanol-gas blends have about a 3 month shelf life and that you always run the risk of having too much moisture in the Ethanol phase of the mix. If the acetic acid-producing bacteria don't ruin your system, the excess moisture can do the job.

The goal with EtOH was never to have better performance, but instead to reduce greenhouse gas emissions. Yet, when you reduce gas mileage and increase consumption, where are the true gains?

The worst part about it is the destruction of viable farmland. By incentivizing corn production for years and driving up demand for non-food use corn, farmers (especially inexperienced farmers) are encouraged to destroy their fields and ignore standard crop rotations by growing corn year after year simply because it's worth so much more than anything else.

Of course, now the EPA has allayed concerns by saying that we've advanced beyond corn and are now capable of using cellulose from many other sources but nonetheless the damage has been done.

From the get-go it was never a prudent idea.

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/secret-dirty-cost-obamas-green-power-push-1



http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1088365_automaker-group-says-e15-ethanol-damages-cars-epa-approval-was-rushed
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,366 Posts
If "they" are going to do it, might as well go E-100. Then again, would any vehicle run on E-100? (Is ethanol the alcohol racing fuel, or it is methanol?)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
289 Posts
If "they" are going to do it, might as well go E-100. Then again, would any vehicle run on E-100? (Is ethanol the alcohol racing fuel, or it is methanol?)
This is one of those instances where Wikipedia does a good job of briefly touching on all the important topics regarding a certain subject (this particular one is very broad. If you care to read in depth, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethanol_fuel#Environment will kill some time.

To answer your question:Yes, Ethanol is the racing fuel (Methanol used to be). You gain more power using 50% to All EtOH but lose fuel efficient when compared to gasoline. Your true energy savings lie in the source of the Ethanol which is really the fundamental problem. (Also certain benefits are negated the longer your engine is exposed to Pure Ethanol.)

Basically, Brazil has been using Ethanol since the 70's. With carbureted engines, many modifications were required as volatility issues and premature degradation of internal components proved to be an issue.

Today, Brazil has a substantial fleet which is designed to run on E100 (technically, E96 since not all water can be removed) but the engines are even more modified over the flex fuel capable ones we see on the roads today. Where they have gained success is in decreasing greenhouse gasses ,the ultimate goal of the endeavor. Nearly all of Brazil's etahnol fuel is sourced from Cane Sugar byproducts which are more abundant and less envrionmentally impactful to grow.
 

·
Infidel
Joined
·
3,307 Posts
The goal was a hidden agriculture subsidy to corn farmers. Everything else is just a distraction.
Actually, corporate corn farmers, A.K.A. Archer Daniels Midland, Cargill, and Monsanto, to name a few.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
81 Posts
In my old Mitsubishi it made a bit of a difference, nothing you could feel, but i measured about 2-3 % less MPG with E10 fuel. Was still using it in the Long run since it's about 5% cheaper in Germany.


Funnily with my Ford it is less of a Problem - MPG-wise. I guess it's the better engine, maybe it is optimized for E10. With E10 i get effectively about 1% worse MPG, so for 5% cheaper fuel that is fine by me. But yeah German 1.6L Ecoboost engine here. I guess with U.S. engines it might be very different.


Do i like Ethanol in my fuel? Not really, but i like the price...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
382 Posts
In my old Mitsubishi it made a bit of a difference, nothing you could feel, but i measured about 2-3 % less MPG with E10 fuel. Was still using it in the Long run since it's about 5% cheaper in Germany.


Funnily with my Ford it is less of a Problem - MPG-wise. I guess it's the better engine, maybe it is optimized for E10. With E10 i get effectively about 1% worse MPG, so for 5% cheaper fuel that is fine by me. But yeah German 1.6L Ecoboost engine here. I guess with U.S. engines it might be very different.


Do i like Ethanol in my fuel? Not really, but i like the price...
Maybe it's just the gasoline/ethanol blend at your station.....or maybe mine but in my focus I tend to get 5-6% better mileage with e0.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
154 Posts
Can't say I've ever used the E85 stuff, and all I ever hear is people complaining about E10. If you're going to take something from Brazil it should be the giant butts not horrible corn gas.
 

·
Rubber Side Down
Joined
·
2,415 Posts
Maybe it's just the gasoline/ethanol blend at your station.....or maybe mine but in my focus I tend to get 5-6% better mileage with e0.
Same here. I'm lucky enough to have a station a couple miles from my house that offers 0% ethanol in their 91 octane. I've run E10 fuels and whenever I do a see that kind of MPG decrease.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,191 Posts
Same here. I'm lucky enough to have a station a couple miles from my house that offers 0% ethanol in their 91 octane. I've run E10 fuels and whenever I do a see that kind of MPG decrease.
I ran some real-life test with 87 and 91 (10E and 0E).

The 91 with 0% ethanol gave better results on highway. In city it's wrost. (compared to 87).

I saw no difference what-so-ever on the engine (same noise). Except after long trip (when hots), the engine is running with less vibration.
 
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
Top