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on thin air
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3,671 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I see adaptive learning mentioned in threads here and there and I know that some tuners prefer to leave it off while others will turn it back on.

What the arguments for and against? Why would you want to leave it on/off? Esp in the case of a FI set up.

Thanks
 

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2focusedracing
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1,799 Posts
i hear they leave it off also from searching, but i would like to here from tom & the gang cause I'm about to load my tune up too.
my base tune from tom still has the adaptive learning turned on??do i need to shut it off tom??

I don't mean to thread jack, but do ya know where to get the best price on a Xcal 2 or 3, some lowlife sold me a locked one and i just want to get a new one next month.[thumb]
 

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FF Affiliate
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31,089 Posts
I turn it off , Keep in mind that WOT fueling is in open loop and no ECU fuel corrections are made to the fuel in open loop

Short turm fuel trim (STFT1) is done right now quickly

Long turm fuel trim (LTFT) is done over time week to weeks in most cases, if you turn adaptive off it just means that the LTFTs will not be generated or stored.

Tom
 

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on thin air
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3,671 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
^^ Yes, I think John actually had a post on FJ about how he watched his AFR's over the course of a month and they were slowly nudging their way towards 14.7 I could see this being dangerous, for sure.

Reason I ask is that I am trouble shooting issues with my car, and have been for quite a while. So, I have started talking to a few guys locally and the topic of adaptive learning has come up. I would like to come to the table armed with a bit of knowledge as to why or why not you would want it on/off.

Any other input would be greatly appreciated.
 

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on thin air
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3,671 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
I turn it off , Keep in mind that WOT fueling is in open loop and no ECU fuel corrections are made to the fuel in open loop

Short turm fuel trim (STFT1) is done right now quickly

Long turm fuel trim (LTFT) is done over time week to weeks in most cases, if you turn adaptive off it just means that the LTFTs will not be generated or stored.

Tom
Thanks, Tom[:)]

Are you saying that with adaptive on it will take the car a little bit to find a steady average w/ it's LTFT's? vs. just having them locked in at 1.0?

If so, then is considered a "band-aid" to tuning? Or are people turning it off and putting more faith in their tune? I guess that's where I am confused. Whats the loss in doing this?

Thanks for the info. Just trying to get my head around some of this stuff.
 

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Token Engin-nerd
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3,414 Posts
Well as ive said in other places on the internet (ahem...) if you spend the time to dial in your transfer function then there is no reason to use ltft... I guess this would be "putting faith in your tune" but really there is no faith, either the tune is good and it works or the tune sucks and you need long term trims.

obviously if you have learning off you will have to check the fuel trims from time to time but IMO even if you have learning on this should be done on ANY FI car, every 3-6 months, just check for timing pulls and check the fueling. Things change, and thats why ltft is there, but if you keep up on your new high performance engine like you should, then theres no need for the ECU to be going behind your back and changing things for you (it might have very BAD consequences).
 

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Registered
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Basically.... after you get your tune dial in to where you want the fuel to be (esp in FI) if you turn adaptive back on it tries to lean out your fuel tables to make the car more efficient.

Personally I thought that was a load of bull when I first heard it, so I did my own experiment... after getting my tune dialed in, I turned adaptive back on..... over the next month I slowly watched my WOT AFR go from the 11.3 where I put it to 12.5 (where I decided it was time to turn it back off)............
 

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755 Posts
^^^ Sanme here, I just cant seem to get mine to STAY turned off.
 
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