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Discussion Starter #1
My car started running wierd this morning.
After starting, rpms would rise and fall several times but then lower to idle rpms.
At lower rpms it seemed to bog kind of but ran fine about say 2000 rpms.

I am also experiencing a charging issue. Replaced the alternator twice in two days. Both remanufactured. Also replaced the battery. The battery and alternator both repeatedly test good. But while using the torque app to watch the voltage, it fluctuates a lot more than the original alternator. It will drop from 14.0 to around 13.6/13.7 while driving. Idling it had dropped to 13.0 when I hold the car with the brakes and have headlights, heater, and flashers on. The volts will rise back to 13.8 to 14.0.


This all started after replacing the valve cover gasket. I've checked all connections several times.

The codes I'm getting from the torque app scan are
P0107
P0452
P0122
P1000
P1125
U1900

I hate electrical problems. I have no idea what is going on.
The first two are new. The p0122 showed up two days ago.

I need some help/guidance.

Thank you in advance
 

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Discussion Starter #2
After looking at it again and checking all of the connections...again.
If the power wire to the alternator is touching something like the engine block, could that cause issues?

Or maybe if some wires cracked while moving them around to replace the valve cover gasket?
I noticed all of the parts that are having issues are all on the same harness
If the harness cracked somewhere, can I use a harness from a 2.0l duratec?

I know of one 2.3l auto sedan at a local u pull it yard.
They also have a couple of 2.0l autos. Not sure if they have any manual trans 2.0ls though.

Mine is base 2.3l manual.
No power windows/locks/a.c..
I think the only thing it came with was a CD player. But that doesn't work. Lol

If it helps, The order of issues
1. Changed valve cover gasket.
2. Alternator failed, replaces
3. Replaced alternator for the 2nd time in 2 days (bad diode)
4. Multiple codes

I hope someone can maybe give some suggestions
 

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U1900 FORD - CAN Communication Bus Fault
Possible causes
-Faulty / intermittent ignition switch connections
-CAN Bus wiring intermittently open/shorted to power or ground
-Faulty / intermittent connection at PCM
-Faulty electrical connections at ABS Control Module Faulty electrical connections at the instrument cluster

P1000 is just a drive cycle indicator

P0452 - EVAP Pressure Sensor/Switch Low
P0107 - Manifold Absolute Pressure/Barometric Pressure Circuit Low Input
P0122 - Throttle Position Sensor/Switch A Circuit Low Input
P1125 - Accelerator Pedal Position Sensor Fault

all of these codes are following the same thing as your alternators blowing up.. it honestly sounds like theres a major wiring fault somewhere on the harness

to pop all those codes all of a sudden is very very uncommon unless the entire car was seriously voltage surged.. or a bad ground somewhere all those codes are all over the car and not limited to one spot

as for the power wire to the alternator against the engine block go to autozone and pickup corrugated wire sleeving/loom and sleeve the wire


my 2.0 duratec's alternator wires are in a loom attached to the back of the block
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Kind of an update here.
Thanks for the reply arcticmynx.

Today I swapped out the harness on top of the engine.
It had connectors for the alternator, coil packs, injectors, tps, iac, etc. And I also swapped the throttle body/tips.
both came from the same 2.3l auto car. But the hood was off so it was all exposed to the elements. So I'm note entirely positive that everything is good.
Was running great for about 30 minutes of driving. The charging issue seemed to be cured too. Then the p1125 came back. And a few hours later the charging issue came back but different.
The battery and alternator tested good. However the alternator tested good at 13.6v. 13.5v with the lights on and blower motor going.
It was at 14.0v previously to today.
Driving around it will show 13.6/13.7v on my torque app which read the same as the test voltage.
Could I have another bad harness?
Could the computer be bad and not show a code possibly?
Bad battery cables?
Could heat be a factor? It was a little warm today. 90's here.
I'm not sure if it matters but the alternator is a remanufactured unit. I mention this because ive heard of remanufactured parts not holding up well in other cases.
I'm at a loss here. But I have to fix it. Its my only car. It's been great so far. She takes a beating better than my trailblazer or envoy. And surprisingly does better in the snow too with winter tires on it.

Any help is appreciated.
Thanks
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I need some help here.
Can someone tell me if there is a common wire or some sort of common link between the alternator, fuel rail pressure sensor, and throttle position sensor?
The voltage stays around 13.5v it will climb to around 13 7v-13.9v when driving.
The code that pops most often are the p1122 and p1125.
There is a code for the fuel pressure sensor that pop every so often.
The car will run rough until I clear the codes, then it will run like normal.
Could an issue with the pcm cause issues with the tps fuel rail pressure sensor, and alternator?

The alternator tests good repeatedly as well as the battery.

Otherwise I'm guessing the is a short/wiring issue in the harness some where like arctic mynx said.

Any ideas or thoughts are appreciated.
Thanks
 

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Discussion Starter #6
After reading another members post about alternator issues, I went out and unplugged the 3 wire connector and started the car. The voltage stayed around 13.1v-13.2v.
Should the voltage go up to 14 volts if it was something other than a alternator issue?
Is that pointing to yet another bad remanufactured alternator or something else like a wiring issue or pcm issue?
 

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Discussion Starter #7 (Edited)
Well I ran over to O'Reilly today. Used their scan tool.
I came up with more codes now.

B1318
B2433
B2438
B2434
B1869
C1947

I have no idea where to start.
I don't know if everything is related or seperate issue.
These codes weren't there when I scanned it with the same scanner at the beginning of the month.

I don't know if I should try adding/replacing/cleaning the battery cables or if the would even help?I
I know things carode over time.

Any help or advice is definitely appreciated
 

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...This all started after replacing the valve cover gasket. I've checked all connections several times...
I believe that is your biggest clue into what is wrong now. Valve cover gasket replacement does force you to twist & turn the upper engine harness into a position it has never been during the life of the car. This can damage wiring inside of the harness and/or damage the physical relationship of female-to-male connector contact pins within any connector to another connector.

Could you please post a picture of your car engine? I am especially interested in seeing the passenger side of the engine, near the front strut. Looking for the wiring of the Ignition/RF filter capacitor.

...Then the p1125 came back. And a few hours later the charging issue came back but different.
The battery and alternator tested good. However the alternator tested good at 13.6v. 13.5v with the lights on and blower motor going.
It was at 14.0v previously to today...

...Could heat be a factor? It was a little warm today. 90's here....
You and I both own the same car, but mine is a wagon & an auto trans.

The charging system voltage on this car does change the voltage output based on outside temperature. Colder weather = higher voltage. Hotter weather = lower voltage.

Please check your system voltage again based on this info. You should notice it is 14.x volts in the early morning and lower in the afternoon; even 13.5V when hot outside.

(( Note: my car also has a special problem where it goes LOWER than 13.5 when hot outside. This is another subject and another thread. ))

Nothing you have posted indicates a charging system problem; especially based on what I have seen on my car and the unique behavior this year/model has. I have confirmed this odd behavior on a neighbors 2004 2.3 PZEV... about two years ago.

...Can someone tell me if there is a common wire or some sort of common link between the alternator, fuel rail pressure sensor, and throttle position sensor?...
There is no common wire. At least not based on your situation, your symptoms. The Alt 3-wire pigtail DOES share a Hot wire. The other 2-wires of the Alt 3-wire goes ONLY to the PCM. The only thing in common, is the entire system power, which the Alt output provides to all systems/sensors.

After reading another members post about alternator issues, I went out and unplugged the 3 wire connector and started the car. The voltage stayed around 13.1v-13.2v.
Should the voltage go up to 14 volts if it was something other than a alternator issue?...
That is a good & a very unique test. I have never done that. That test would essentially take the Smart Charge system off-line. I would guess the voltage would have been higher. 13.5 to 14.

...I don't know if I should try adding/replacing/cleaning the battery cables or if the would even help?
Definitely CLEAN any/all of the major power wires Hot and Ground. Adding an extra ground or two will not hurt. I have added two grounds on my car engine using store bought 4-gauge(?) battery cables (each about 8-inch and 12-inch) and each cheap at $10 or less. One is at the battery negative post to-> the car frame. The other is at the Alt body to-> the passenger side front strut mount (car frame ground).
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Marde, thanks for chiming in.

If someone can tell me how to post a picture, I'll post one.

I suspected the wiring harness right away which is why I picked up another one. But it came from the same 2.3l car that I got the valve cover off of. I might go back and get a 2nd wiring harness. Will one from a 2.0l d-tec work? For future reference, Will a 2.0l alternator work on my 2.3l? To me, everything appeares to be the same.

I did notice that my voltage was 13.7-14.0 when it was cooler in the mornings. It seems like it does go down as the air temp goes up and if my car has been running for a while.
Maybe an issue specific to the 2.3l PZEV?
Do you hace a factory alternator or a replacement (new or remanufactured)
From reading on here, remanufactured alternator don't seem to do well.

Maybe You can elaborate a little more on the special problem you referred to?

I will definitely be cleaning and possibly adding in a similar fashion as you have.

Btw, I'm a total sucker for wagons for some reason. Wish mine was a wagon. But I love the manual transmission and lack of options. It's less complicated.
No power windows/ locks, no a/c, no abs/ traction control
Basically no frills.

Thanks again
 

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...If someone can tell me how to post a picture, I'll post one...
I have no time or very little time. I will post back later.

Here is some info about posting pictures.

Hit the REPLY button and then a new window appears. This reply window includes tool widgets with icons at the top on the window. Use the tool icon that shows "a paper clip" and it will pop-up another window called "manage attachments". Then Navigate to the location of where the picture is stored on your device. Then Upload your picture from your computer or phone.

There is also another way to add pictures. Almost every single picture on the web has a URL. Copy this URL. Now use the tool icon that is a "Yellow Square" (insert image). Enter the URL of the picture. You can also share your personal pics when they are hosted by a hosting service such as Imgr.

New users can not post links or post pictures (insert image) with the URL method. You must have x-amount of posts (15 to 30?) prior to being allowed to post links.

Here is a picture added using the "paperclip" tool (an attachment). The pic is an example of the connectors found at our PCM.
 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
20180531_195013.jpg

20180531_195036.jpg

Sorry, i dont know why the pictures flipped. They arent flipped on my phone. Anyway, It's a little dirty.

I assume you were referring to the little black box thing on a metal bracket?
What does this do? There is only one wire coming out of it and it's grounded to the strut tower.

Marde,
Since you seem to have a similar issue as far as voltage goes anyway. Have you experienced any codes/issues with the tps or anything to do with the fuel rail, Or does your car run as it normally should?
 

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Here is a picture added using the globe URL method.
http://images.gtcarlot.com/pictures/39166813.jpg


For some unknown reason this URL method is not working correctly for me at the moment. I will look into this more, -some time later.
I posted a new thread (here) and asked others for help. It turns out I was using the wrong widget, I was using the "insert link" (aka the Globe with a paperclip). The proper widget to use is the "insert image" and is shown with a "yellow square" icon.

A simple case of brain-fart.

@Mnfocuszx3 - I will post back here later tonight.
 

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...I assume you were referring to the little black box thing on a metal bracket?
What does this do? There is only one wire coming out of it and it's grounded to the strut tower.
Yes, that's cool, and normal. But the one-wire version is very unique to our car, and maybe only found on a few other models. I believe that type is never found on 2005+ cars.

It is called many different things. I typically call it the Ignition RF Noise Filter on Thursday or Friday, and other similar names on any other day. The one-wire type is passive (needs no external voltage). The other & typical type is active (needs an external Hot wire) and has two wires. The two-wire type will often cause problems when one wire is broken.

...Since you seem to have a similar issue as far as voltage goes anyway. Have you experienced any codes/issues with the tps or anything to do with the fuel rail, Or does your car run as it normally should?
First off, I do not have a similar issue AND you have no charging system problem at all, -based on your reports. We both have a charging system that has lower voltage than "normally expected" during warm/hot weather. This is normal based on my findings & research of 2003/04 2.3 engine Foci... at least with the PZEV cars. I also believe this unique charging system behavior extends outside of our car type, and it extends into a larger group of Foci with this smart charging system -verses- the PCM firmware that we have. I have no facts or knowledge about how wide this net falls. I am only positive about my car and my neighbors 2004 2.3 PZEV when I tested that car about 2 years ago. Your car seems to be doing the same (normal) thing.

You asked about my charging system problem, so here is a summary:

The Alt output will sometimes drop below 13V. Only happens when warm/hot outside. This is near, or at, or below battery voltage. This is a real problem.

During this low-voltage situation, the only DTC I get is a P0411, which is a ghost or real fault in the Secondary Air Injection system (SAI) <<SAI is unique to PZEV cars>>. This code turns-on the CEL.

It is not the Alt, or the 3-wire pigtail, or the Alt pigtail connector on the Alt, or the Alt wiring to the PCM. I am 99.9% sure of this.

The PCM Smart Charge System (SCS) is largely influenced by other engine sensors. These sensors can and will change the output voltage of the Alt. This is normal operation.

Here is a list of sensors that effect the PCM vs SCS on my car/your car:

"TPS, ECT, IAT and VSS are among the inputs considered when calculating the voltage set point." <quote from my 2004 Focus wire diagram book>

Note: my SCS voltage only falls into/below battery voltage when my car is at idle, at a stop, and in Drive (auto trans) with my foot on the brake pedal. As soon as I release the brake and roll forward (with gas?) the voltage comes out of the stupid-low zone. My "issue" is to find which one or which combination of two sensors might be influencing my SCS to operate so low during this set of conditions. Lastly, please remember that you do not have this type of problem and I do not want to derail your thread with my SCS problem. I am asking you and others to reply to my SCS problem only after great consideration to your situation, not mine.
 

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Your engine picture makes me want to reply about two issues.

The red circle is a modification, and is a PCV top-hose breather filter. That is not stock. BTW your lower PCV hose might also be modified... into a catch-can type of system.

The blue circle is a dangerous chafing point. The fuel line might be contacting the metal bracket under the fuel line. This can cut-open your fuel line and start a fire. I had to slightly move this fuel line, because my fuel line was damaged and thankfully not cut thru before I found the problem. I used a zip-tie and some electrical tape to prevent further damage.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Marde, thanks for explaining you issue. If/when you do find a solution, please post it.

Red circle:
That's my "walmart parking lot at 12am band aid fix".
My car started running really rough, and stalling every now and then. It took a little while to realize the air silencer box thing that sits next to the tb was cracked so it was sucking in air behind the maf. Replaced my intake system with a HPS cai+k&n filter. At some point after that the hard tube that runs from the intake to the valve cover cracked also. I had to improvise. Caped the intake tube and stuck that breather in place until I remember to get some tubing to fix it.
There was a fair amount of oil inside my tb and intake tube. More than I would imagine to be ok.
I doesn't seem to be hurting anything as is.
NOTHING on this car was modified before I picked it up.
The intake is the only thing I have really changed. Aside from sanding and painted the steelies black

Blue circle:
Good catch. I never saw that. I will be dealing with that asap.

My car never had the lower voltage deal going on. It produced 13.8v-14v always. Even with lights, rear def, and blower motor going. Even at idle.
With these replacement alternators is the only time I've had this happen.
I can live with the lower voltage thing if others experience this same conditiom. The tps and fuel rail pressure sensor issues are what I need to fix then.

Does anyone know Why the '05 2.3l use a 130 amp alternator while the '03-'04 2.3ls use the 110 amp alternator? The casings are different, although it looks to be mounted the same.. I'm not sure if the pig tail is different as well though.

Thanks for all this info Marde. It's appreciated.
 

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Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
After a trip to the salvage yard. I discovered (id guess almost everyone else knew this already) that the 2.0l duratec and 2.3l duratec wiring harnesses are different.
I know of one other 2.3l focus in a scrap yard. I don't know what is left of it though.
Where do the wires go to after the large plug near the battery? To the pcm?
If so, if the two sensors share a wire and go directly to the pcm, could I possibly run a wire from the pcm directly to the harness on top of the engine? Basically bypassing the large harness and plug, just as a test, to see if the problem lies in the large (main?) Harness?
Would their be more signs/codes/issues if it was the pcm itself?

I do have a cheap (red harbor freight) volt meter. Would it be easier/better/possible to test these two sensors with that at all?
Not into electrical problems. But no time like the present to learn.
I just want to eradicate these electrical gremlins and catch back up on other worn out parts.
I don't want to pay a shop $95/hr (that's the best rate I've found so far) just to diagnose the issue or just to be in the same spot as I am now.
 

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Even the first Focus alts get the charging dropped a bit when hot, my '00 and '02 do it. Why I always check alt output at just warm off a cold start to get a 14.0 or higher number. Later after driving in the heat it can drop. Part of the PCM software.
 

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Discussion Starter #19 (Edited)
Yesterday, After driving on some rough roads I noticed the throttle % gauge in the torque app would off and on read 5% or less but jump up to 18%(normal).
I noticed a few days ago that the issues were only happening in 2nd and 4th gear. 1st, 3rd, 5th, and even reverse had zero issues.
This morning I didnt have a lot of time, i just got curious. so pulled the battery and tray all my issues were caused by the wiring harnesses all resting on my shifter linkage and the top of the transmission. I used one thicker zip tie to secure the harnesses to the metal bracket next to the fuel lines on top of the engine. Put everything back together, left for work, not a single issue.
It looks like maybe some sort of clip use to be holding everything up near the battery but broke off at some point after the clutch was replaced. But I'm not sure.
Has anyone else had a similar issue?
I'm going to secure everytging better when I get more time. At least I found the issue.

Thanks to everyone for the help on any problems I've had.
 

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...Has anyone else had a similar issue?...
Probably, and I can not remember that exact problem. However, that area in general is a problem-child because of dirt & heat & gunk & oil exposure (over time) AND there are those large multi-pin electrical connectors within that area. Gunk + Those connectors can sometimes = Problems. A couple years ago I cleaned-up that wiring and wrapped most of the wiring harnesses/connectors with electrical tape... but only in that spot; I did not do this to the whole engine harness.

I have seen many car engine bays that have the whole engine harness wrapped in custom tape; man that stuff is really cool and inspiring to me. I have some other engine wires-spots that need some TLC. I'm wasting too much time on FF as opposed to improving-working on my Focus.

...I'm going to secure everytging better when I get more time...
When you do that, make sure you take a few extra minutes to closely inspect for any damage to the wires/wire insulation.

Congrats on your find & fix! -Cheers!
 
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