Focus Fanatics Forum banner

21 - 40 of 70 Posts

·
Trying to Focus
Joined
·
1,881 Posts
i went ahead and rebuilt iy but removed the grills, i might have to test them again and see if the sound changes any with the grills removed
First, let me compliment everyone on their contributions to an interesting audio thread, especially the OP for actually using test procedures instead of relying solely on subjective impressions. I also used to "do this stuff" pretty hardcore back in the '70s, studying with the techs at Seattle's Speakerlab and building some pretty high-end home systems, including custom speaker cabinets, custom cross-overs, Phase Linear amps, blah, blah.

So here's my small contribution, relating to the quote. Well-designed speaker grilles may improve dispersion of upper-midrange and treble frequencies. You should be able to hear a difference between the grill on and off. With a good grill, the higher frequency sound will be more consistent as you move your head around or change seating positions in the car or other listening environment. This helps in the localization or sound-staging of instruments.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,365 Posts
To me im not as concerned with bass or treble i want a good midrange sounding speaker.
You can try overstuffing the enclosure. In this case, use batting (or fiber fill. whatever you want to call it) made for quilting. It comes in a 'blanket'. Using the Ford component setup as an example (assume that factory batting is not there for clarity), trim the batting in layers (you don't want a huge buildup at the edges) and layer it in. Then start making layers with a hole for the magnet to clear. This is not a 'loose' fiber fill so less worry about hitting the cone or spider. What should result is a little less 'thump' on the low end, but the mids should be smoother by comparison. Or, as some would describe it, muffled! It should not affect the highs at all, even if the driver has a whizzer cone. Eh! it should be cheap enough to try if you want. Note: How much fill you put in is completely subjective. Only your ear can decide whether it is good or bad. Also, I read (at one time) 'some' folks advocating after doing this, drilling a small-ish hole down low in the enclosure. NOT a port, but to permit the driver to breath a bit (in this case the batting is consuming internal volume). There are no formulas that I am aware of. You start small and work your way up until your not getting any weird noises coming from the hole. I have never done this and am not advocating it. Just being informative only. the article was primarily a discussion about using 3-5" woofers in small enclosures.

ChrissyL >> Yes! True! but where do you go to evaluate/purchase good grills? I always thought grills were the unloved stepchild to the whole industry (perty much). [wiggle]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,484 Posts
Discussion Starter #23
I removed the grills because the door panel already has enough of a grill.

The grill on the tweeter is metal the midrange driver is plastic.

The fiber fill is still debated wether it works or not. Some people say it improves bass some people say its nonsence.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,365 Posts
The fiber fill is still debated wether it works or not. Some people say it improves bass some people say its nonsence.
Hehe! Ya! I know! It's like asking what's the best oil. All you can do is try it and decide for yourself, as the final arbiter is your ears. [:)]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,484 Posts
Discussion Starter #26
Hehe! Ya! I know! It's like asking what's the best oil. All you can do is try it and decide for yourself, as the final arbiter is your ears. [:)]
Well all i have is the loose fiberfill stuff like what you would find in a pillow. The stuff in the Ford componet speaker is like a sheet similar to a sheet of fiberglass.

I would run a test with the fiberfill and the sheet stuff but i dont have any right now.
 

·
Deutsche Arsche
Joined
·
2,549 Posts
First, let me compliment everyone on their contributions to an interesting audio thread, especially the OP for actually using test procedures instead of relying solely on subjective impressions. I also used to "do this stuff" pretty hardcore back in the '70s, studying with the techs at Seattle's Speakerlab and building some pretty high-end home systems, including custom speaker cabinets, custom cross-overs, Phase Linear amps, blah, blah.

So here's my small contribution, relating to the quote. Well-designed speaker grilles may improve dispersion of upper-midrange and treble frequencies. You should be able to hear a difference between the grill on and off. With a good grill, the higher frequency sound will be more consistent as you move your head around or change seating positions in the car or other listening environment. This helps in the localization or sound-staging of instruments.
I like this, very true. I fuss with speaker placement for days when I move from one house to another.
 

·
Trying to Focus
Joined
·
1,881 Posts
ChrissyL >> Yes! True! but where do you go to evaluate/purchase good grills? I always thought grills were the unloved stepchild to the whole industry (perty much). [wiggle]
Actually, the industry cranks out lots of OEM and aftermarket car speaker grills. It's very easy to find purchase info, especially pictures (as though the visual aesthetics are what we buy speakers for), but it's much harder to find good evaluative information. I guess a lot of the detailed knowledge is protected as proprietary.

I did a quick Google search for "speaker grille design" and found a bunch of mildly informative links. But there doesn't seem to be much that goes into any depth. I guess for us consumers/hobbyists, a lot of trial-and-error and sharing of experiences is nearly as informative.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,365 Posts
Grill's are not proprietary unless there very high end home units, they simply don't test them to any degree (that would be expensive). So it's all visual aesthetics. I mean, who is going to put a sonically correct, 'butt ugly' grill in there car?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
523 Posts
I am suprised just how much the stock speakers have improved over a short 6 years. I drive all the time for work, so I enjoy listening to active music like rap and pop. I just traded in my 2004 F150 for a 2010 Focus SE and on the way home, my girlfriend said, "let's see how these speakers are." She turned on some Lil Wayne and turned up the volume. I couldn't believe how great the speakers sounded and the bass was incredible! She said,"somebody must have turned the bass up," then she checked it. To our amazement, it was set at zero. I am so happy with my stock sound system.
 

·
Trying to Focus
Joined
·
1,881 Posts
Current stock speakers in Foci do sound pretty good for whizzer cone-equipped "one way" OEM cheapies. Upgrading to BA S85s recently, though, quickly revealed the stockers' shortcomings: bass is a bit muddy (pretty good thump, though!) and the high end is harsh and fatiguing to listen to at louder volume. Both low and high frequencies lack definition when compared to the Boston Acoustics.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,484 Posts
Discussion Starter #32 (Edited)
Yeah thats one thing that would need more testing at higher volumes.

Paper and foam is probably the cheapest materials you can use for speakers and they probably dont handle the higher volumes as well as other materials do. The tone they have is what i was most impressed with. I think paper gives good bass but probably distorts faster then other cone materials.

Another thing about after market speakers is if you use materials other then foam and paper it will last alot longer. Foam rips easy, it dry rots and over time just goes bad. Same with paper

If you change any change the doors they will probably go bad before the rear panel speakers. I dont know about your car but water leaks in around my windows and runs down into the doors.

I think upgrading is still a good idea if you can afford it, but i would change the radio first then replace the speakers when you can afford it. My car is an 07 and the OEM speakers still look new, the cones are still nice and tight and the foam still looks new as well.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
299 Posts
I am suprised just how much the stock speakers have improved over a short 6 years. I drive all the time for work, so I enjoy listening to active music like rap and pop. I just traded in my 2004 F150 for a 2010 Focus SE and on the way home, my girlfriend said, "let's see how these speakers are." She turned on some Lil Wayne and turned up the volume. I couldn't believe how great the speakers sounded and the bass was incredible! She said,"somebody must have turned the bass up," then she checked it. To our amazement, it was set at zero. I am so happy with my stock sound system.
Same here! I love the sound of the stock speakers... and I don't even have the Moon 'N Tune package!...amazing clearity
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
117 Posts
So is it safe to say my 09 Foci has 6x9's? I tried a few things online and they say 5 1/4 and 6x9? Dont want to take the door panels off just to tell what size speaker it takes. Thanks.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
117 Posts
Went ahead and took the door panels off just for the reason of finding out what speakers there were and they are 6x8 front and rears.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
I have a 2010 SE and I will say the stock spk. is decent. I really like the placement of the spk. in the front door. Perfect for a point source location. I too (like ChrissyL) changed them (fronts) out early on for some Boston Acoustics SX-85's. Absolutely no comparison. You have no idea how great these spks. sound. I have Sirius radio and the stock head unit drives the BA's just fine. Fantastic spks. and worth every penny IMO.
 

·
VEKTOR PLATE
Joined
·
5,657 Posts
all i can add to this is the stock 6x8 (non audiophile) units are friggen tanks. i ahve beaten the snot out of mine badly for the last 8 years my car has existed. and they still havent given up. i'd like to build a 3 way component setup up front but use the stock door speakers for the mid low (they have a pretty good mid low in my mind.)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
331 Posts
Wow, superbe stuff. Way more than basic listeners can handle or care about. But love the info.
Couple things, since you got/had all that set up, would love to see MB Quart coparo. Not surprised by the JBL manufacture, they've been doing it for ford for years. But do you have any idea how hard it is to get JBL auto speakers? Yes, easy w/ internet now. Ran a pair of JBL 6x9 3ways and a 8"pyle sub for years, and it sounded awsome. Bass heads thought I had 12"s in there, but clear.

So, I was thinking of snagging some of those ford audiophile components, but second guessing now.

Any thoughts... thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
675 Posts
Nicely done test! Graphs and all! Are those stock speakers the same as would be in my 04, ZX3, non blaupunkt non amp system? I did swap out to a brand new Kenwood Excellon head unit so I can add my amps and sub box. But right now, I am using the stock speakers and probably will till late July or so to install my system.
 
21 - 40 of 70 Posts
Top