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Discussion Starter #1
Alright currently i'm building a supercharged monster engine for my car but i've started from scratch with it so i'm going to be left with an engine sitting around my garage. I've always liked the thought of a high rev N/A engine say one that'll go to 11,000 rpm. I'm woundering if anyone has every done this on a zetec with much success. I know there are the restraints of the oil pump but I would run a dry sump on such an engine anyways. I'm trying to gauge if this would be a worthy project to put together.

My thoughts on parts would be this

FR head gone through for extreme flow P/P and all the little tidbits to make it able to rev.
Higher compresion pistons matched with rods.(i'd like to keep the same stroke because going with the stroker setup it would limit my rpms.)
Steel crank that is fully balanced.
Exedy hypertech clutch which i already have for my supercharged engine.( could just swap it over but this might go in another car)
Dry sump setup to handle any oil needs.
And of course ITB to get the maximum airflow at those super high rpms.


Of course there are all kinds of other tidbits that go into engines but as for the major parts thats about it. Any sugjestions or thoughts on this?
 

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the oil pump shatters at around 7600 rpms due to harmonics. your only option at the moment is a dry sump system. tom is working on a billet oil pump, but not sure when that'll be available
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Well all this is of course normal. I know about the oil pump and thats why i stated that i was going to run a dry sump. I currently have a PRP that i'm going to be using with my SC Engine and I would undoughtedly run that if not go to a stand alone system. It would all depend on if the stock ecu with prp could handle the rpms. I would of course also probably end up upgrading the ignition to an msd or other system that is designed to rev that high. I would possibly even consider going to a coil per plug setup.
 

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this seems like an interesting project...
 

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Shiroi kabocha
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dont forget cams...the stock ones fall flat on their faces after 6k rpms, but im not sure of any cams that you will be able to rev that high with. you might want to consider doing this to an svt motor as the vct and really high flowing head will allow for higher rpms.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Yes of course there is the subject of cams. Now i do not know of any cams myself either and i'm sure that stg 3 cams don't rev that high. They would possibly be good until about 8000-8500 but that is nowhere near the range i would be wanting to reach. I would more than likely have to do a set of custom cams.
As for the svt motor. I honestly don't see runing a svt motor that much of an advantage when it would come to a major project such as this one. Although i have not done much research on the svt head and it's vct I will look into this for the gained knowledge. Does the vct actually change the cams position(timing) during increased revs?
All in all runing a ported polished FR head(and i mean maxing it out for complete high flow potential) would ultimatly flow better than an svt head. True a svt head could probably ported and polished. But i don't think it would be able to be taken as far as the FR at least not until they come out with a different casting of it.(I could be wrong like i said i don't know to much on the svt)
Also runing the FR pp head i could have it matched with the Indipendent throttle bodie manifold that i would run with the setup thus giving the perfect airflow into the head.
Another thing that i would get would be a perfectly matched exhaust header. I do not know if anyone makes a header that has equal length tubes but this does end up helping if ever so slightly in the end. and if i would be going this far every little bit would help.
 

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y would u need to go to 11k RPM's.....just wondering
 

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teh tranny killer
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why does a zebra have stripes? [8] ...as for the cams, im pretty sure even the crane V are only good till 8500rpm which is kinda peculiar considering the IV and III are pretty much the same, i think what that is tellin us is that noone has takin it to the level your talking about..if your planning on somethin this serious i would get the block professionaly done (to include a cyro treated crank) but the block would be the easiest part, gettin the ITB setup that you want is next to impossiblie because of the firewall, crower retainers float after 8k rpm, there is no standalone available for the zetec ecu that im aware of (to go with itb's), getting head flow and exhaust flow to make it even worth your wild would be quite a project..id say wanting anything past 9k would not only totally ruin any sense of idle but find no power that high in the rpm's..perhaps with the duratec they will have more success with the high revving regions but even the notorious focus-central beast fell on its face after 8.5k
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I believe it is true that noone has really ever tried to rev the hell out of the zetec. With the issue of the oil pump being the main reason. noone wants to invest that much money into an engine a risk blowing it up in efforts to find more power. So i would solve the oil issue with the dry sump. The engine would be getting professionally put together and would more than likely have a steel crank in it. Having that crank cryo'd would be a good idea as well thou. As for the ITB it is true that they don't fit in the zetecs normal location. but i'm sure if a v8 can be riged into that tiny engine compartment then finding a little more room for a set of ITB's wouldn't be that hard. If anything there is always the option of shifting the engine forward a little bit. This of course would take alot of work but could be done. I'm sure i'd be able to find or have made a set of springs and retiners that could handle the revs and i'm more than positive a set of cams could be created that would allow an insane rev with a hard idle. True enough when all is said and done the idle would probably be at 1200rom if not a little more but this isn't really looking at being a daily driven engine anyways. As for the engine control sometimes you just have to eliminate all the stock stuff and go with a complete standalone system. This of course would be expensive in itself but thats the way all the top tuning companies do it. A standalone unit that controls the entire engine, fuel, spark, everything. This of course would then result in having to get a new gage setup and other things like that and switch to a return style fuel system as well but. think about it if it all worked and it ended up being a N/A engine that reved to even 10,000 rpms and made power or at least held pwer that hole way it would be insane. talk about a track machine.
 

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imagine runnin that thing down the quarter... i'm pretty sure you wouldn't even need to shift to second
 

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If we are talking street driven I would say it was a waste of time and money, a good turbo will still eat you alive and the car would be VERY undriveable. On the track , maybe, but still easier ways to spend money. LOL
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Yes this is true. There are easier ways to spend money. Like takeing off the c-2 procharger that i'm putting on my currently being built engine and slaping on a huge turbo and putting in a thicker head gasket to drop compression. a switch to a return style fuel system and suddenly i'm probably looking at around +400 whp which would probably be reachable with what all i'm doing. i'm currently going to be looking at around 350whp on my procharger setup that i'm doing.

My hole purpose behind this thread is to try and figure out some of the specific details that i would need to address to do such a in depth N/A high rev engine. It wouldn't be a track use only engine but would probably only be driven on the track and anyone that knows much about high rev track engines knows that it makes for a killer combo when properly setup right. Besides This is only a idea at this time. My current setup is still being built and should be in my car around late june and by the time i have the money to start dabeling in another engine build i'm sure i'll be doing some other car insted and my old focus engine will just end up on a engine stand with all the other ford motors i have.

I would just like to see what a fully done N/A focus engine is capable of. I believe it has potential once you get past the oil pump problem.
 

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Going to that kind of range is ridiculous.. but if you insist, and you're serious about, you should contact the people who make the Focus WRC. I don't know who controls developement of the car anymore, but you should find out, since they probably know EVERYTHING about the zetec and its capabilities.
 

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( o Y o )
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Steeda also has for sale their #22 zetec race engine, only like 1000 miles on it. It has over 200 n/a hp at the wheels on 14 CR and pectel EM. THeyre putting in a duratec. I dont know how high it revs, but maybe its a good place to start to get questions, theyre pretty knowledgable.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
thanks for the suggestions. I'm more leaning towards the talking with the WRC guys first and formost. I'm sure they would be able to point me in the right direction as far as cams and other things that would allow me to hit those high revs and make power. Also i'll be checking with alot of UK companies being that some of them have pre made crate engines that come in various stage that have ITB's and produce around 240hp I don't know if its whp but they do offer to also do a dry sump for added revs so anything is possible.
 

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Shiroi kabocha
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actually, with carbs and itb's i have seen claims for as much as 270hp.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
is that wheel hp or crank either way for N/A thats outstanding. Makes me want to look into doing this setup more and more
 

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Shiroi kabocha
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thats bhp, whatever that means...
 

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Discussion Starter #20
thats block horsepower or built horsepower. which after you figure in your loss the engine would probably be putting around 230-240 to the wheels

N/A thats a badass engine
 
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