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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
"Although the breakthrough seems like a dream come true, an unwanted side effect has been emerging. Letter writers have complained to Consumer Reports and the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) that over time DI can lead to clogged fuel systems and engine carbon buildup. The result can be engine hesitation and a loss of power—and the need for expensive repairs."

https://autos.yahoo.com/news/direct...ve-performance-save-fuel-price-193000698.html
 

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i suppose time will tell on our cars, they have only been around ~3 years. 55K on mine with no issues yet that I can tell.
 

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The article also mentions companies posting TSBs as well as the recommendation of E0 fuel.
 

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Just a reminder: Ford has yet to approve any method of cleaning potentially dirty valves in both the EcoBoost engines as well as our NA DI engines. Walnut shells, spray cleaners, and manual scrubbing are all no-nos in the eyes of Ford and they may void the warranty.

According to makuloco, though, Ford is working on this and will likely provide a TSB or an approved cleaning method:

http://www.focusfanatics.com/forum/showthread.php?t=529138&highlight=
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
This article seems to confirm it's only a known problem so far with early VW/Audi engines:
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/...a-problem-with-direct-injection-engines-.html
For the time being Karesh said that according to his data, “Clearly it’s a VW/Audi problem and not much else.” Elaborating he also said, “We’ve got other direct-injected engines and it’s not showing up for those.”

He is just dead wrong. Visit the BMW forums. Or the Mini forums. AFAIK, BMW was the first to develop the walnut shell blasting protocol. Brian has also confirmed the problem with Ford Ecoboost.

The problem with carbon buildup is there is no light on the dash that says "Service Engine Soon-Carbon Buildup" It is insidious with gradual power loss, rough cold idle, etc. No codes are thrown.

Driving patterns are a huge influence on this issue as well. Extended idling in traffic for example vs. cruising at 70 down the interstate. Why do you think Ford kept the revs up in their original torture test of the Ecoboost? High intake velocities coupled with high heat kept those intake valves cherry red to burn off carbon.

The article made not one mention of oil which is a known contributor to intake valve carbon fouling.
 

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Has anyone with the NA actually reported any issues?
 

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I've put 111,000 on mine and power seems to be the same as when it was new. 5000 mile oil changes with motorcraft semi-syn and have only had to fill tank with e10 maybe 10 times. The rest have been e0.
 

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This is a non-problem for worrywarts to worry about.
So far one person, maybe two have decided this is a problem to be on the Ford Focus 2.0. No one has actually HAD the problem so far with it four years on..
IMO it is something for folks who love to worry to worry about.
It is true other engines have had problems.
The valve timing overlap is designed to 'solve' the issue. Why assume it will fail to do so? So far no problems.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
This is a non-problem for worrywarts to worry about.
So far one person, maybe two have decided this is a problem to be on the Ford Focus 2.0. No one has actually HAD the problem so far with it four years on..
IMO it is something for folks who love to worry to worry about.
It is true other engines have had problems.
The valve timing overlap is designed to 'solve' the issue. Why assume it will fail to do so? So far no problems.
The CR article was about DI engines in general but I agree with you that Ford has been much better in this regard. I believe their engineers learned from the problems of BMW/Audi. The Ford engineers will have to devise some sort of cleaning method for the Ecoboost valves that doesn't destroy the turbo. Replacing the heads is an expensive proposition.

With the introduction of the 3 cylinder 1.0 Ecoboost in the MK3.5 Focus, this is a possible concern.
 

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Why would the heads have to be replaced versus cleaned?

I could see a greater risk to the valves, and even more likely, valve seals/guides.

I suspect a cleaning method will be developed that eliminates the need to tear the engine down, but it's also likely that some will need to tear it down to fully clean. My guess is that if a cleaning method is developed the cleaning will need to be done at regular intervals -- perhaps every 25K or 50K miles.


Brian
 

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This is a non-problem for worrywarts to worry about.
What's the world without a good deal of worry?

Why would the heads have to be replaced versus cleaned?

I could see a greater risk to the valves, and even more likely, valve seals/guides.

I suspect a cleaning method will be developed that eliminates the need to tear the engine down, but it's also likely that some will need to tear it down to fully clean. My guess is that if a cleaning method is developed the cleaning will need to be done at regular intervals -- perhaps every 25K or 50K miles.


Brian
Like wavsine said, the biggest issue is wilh Ecoboost engines, and at that much more prevalent on the F150 engines. Pop over to any F150 forum and you'll find a bigger discussion about carbon buildup:

http://www.f150ecoboost.net/forum/14-f150-ecoboost-maintenance/5971-f150-intake-valve-carbon-build-up.html

Ford's prescribed method of removing the heads to clean is meant to prevent damage to the turbo when buildup is removed. Apparently, you can fry the turbo and wreck your catalytic converter if you knock enough carbon loose.

According to makuloco, the most likely remedy in the future will be software updates to achieve the most complete combustion.

The best thing you can do to prevent a problem down the road is to use top tier fuel and high quality oil with regular changes.
 

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Problem isn't as much the incomplete combustion with the N/A GDI engine. It's oil vapour from the PCV and also residual oil film from the valve stems coking to the face of the intake valves.

Not seeing this as much on the N/A engines as of yet. Not to mention it will be much easier to clean the N/A GDI than the turbo's. I'm keeping a very close eye on the wife's GDI Mazda.

Agree that regular oil changes (100% sythetic) will definitely help. The type of fuel you use is still really up in the air. Even with valve overlap there isn't much fuel hitting the face of the valves with any scrubbing/cleaning pressure. The vigilant watch over the PCV (if equipped) will also help. I have already installed a catch can on the wife's '14 2.0L GDI Mazda. I will admit that we do also run premium fuel as well..... Every little bit helps.... However the premium fuel is more for economy and combustion chamber/injector cleaning!
 

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I owned a 07 mini cooper s and this was a huge problem. i had to have my intake valves cleaned every 30,000 miles and it was crazy how much carbon build up was on them. That was a turbo engine and the cause was the pcv system. i eventually eliminated the PCV system and vented to atmosphere and it got rid of the problem.
 

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I owned a 07 mini cooper s and this was a huge problem. i had to have my intake valves cleaned every 30,000 miles and it was crazy how much carbon build up was on them. That was a turbo engine and the cause was the pcv system. i eventually eliminated the PCV system and vented to atmosphere and it got rid of the problem.
So a good preventive measure for we Focus owners is using a low Noack volatility synthetic oil, I guess. While it's hard to find volatility figures, in 5w-20 the lowest mass-market values I've found are Pennzoil Platinum at 8.5% (SOPUS has since stopped publishing Noack values) and Valvoline Syntec at 10.0%. Mobil, Castrol, etc. don't publish this information. Anyone have a better suggestion?
 

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#dailydriven
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Honestly im the wrong person to ask. i use the motocraft syn blend oil and change it every 3000 miles. i use premium gas with every tank and try to do as few short trip drives as possible.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
So a good preventive measure for we Focus owners is using a low Noack volatility synthetic oil, I guess. While it's hard to find volatility figures, in 5w-20 the lowest mass-market values I've found are Pennzoil Platinum at 8.5% (SOPUS has since stopped publishing Noack values) and Valvoline Syntec at 10.0%. Mobil, Castrol, etc. don't publish this information. Anyone have a better suggestion?
You could tap into my massive oil reserve of NOACK 5 Pennzoil Ultra 5W-20 that I stockpiled right before they discontinued it.[deviltail]
 

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You could tap into my massive oil reserve of NOACK 5 Pennzoil Ultra 5W-20 that I stockpiled right before they discontinued it.[deviltail]
Yeah, I have 15 quarts of the old Ultra left. Just don't have a plan for what happens after...

Not that we overanalyze stuff like this.
 
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