[biggestloser]

currently rung a 10.5 cr frpp head crower 2's jba race header w/ all the bolt ons and the cams are set to 0* i and e.

are there any real gains to be seen with this set up and cam tuning, aiming for 13-13.5 afr @ wot?

 

[sleepyboy]

Yes there are gains to be found dyno tuning the cam gears. But it must be a dyno, your butt will lie to you soo bad, trust me I know. Also don't think so much as "peak" power gains, it's the power curve your changing. Though you can gain some more tq and hp but it's the hp and tq through out the power curve.

 

[iminhell]

The cams being set to 0/0 is trivial. There is always a little play either in the cam bar or when the engine is running. That tiny bit of play can alter cam timing. For the most part though it won't be noticeable.

And I know this won't pertain to the cams at hand but, http://www.focusfanatics.com/forum/showthread.php?t=259167

As you'll notice by the bell curves, at the beginning and end of the ramps variations of a cam degree or two won't make any difference. But when you get near the peak of the cam lobe it'll make a huge difference, or can.

The goal is to match the timing of the cams to what your intake and exhaust flow/velocities wants. That is where the dyno comes into play.
I've sat and played with every equation I could find as well as making a few of my own to try and find a quick path to getting close to perfect timing. It's not possible, but I did learn a few things along the way.

You can get kinda close doing the compression thing. But who's to say how much you leave on the table or where you're making sacrifices.

 

[sleepyboy]

The cams being set to 0/0 is trivial. There is always a little play either in the cam bar or when the engine is running. That tiny bit of play can alter cam timing. For the most part though it won't be noticeable.

And I know this won't pertain to the cams at hand but, http://www.focusfanatics.com/forum/showthread.php?t=259167

As you'll notice by the bell curves, at the beginning and end of the ramps variations of a cam degree or two won't make any difference. But when you get near the peak of the cam lobe it'll make a huge difference, or can.

The goal is to match the timing of the cams to what your intake and exhaust flow/velocities wants. That is where the dyno comes into play.
I've sat and played with every equation I could find as well as making a few of my own to try and find a quick path to getting close to perfect timing. It's not possible, but I did learn a few things along the way.

You can get kinda close doing the compression thing. But who's to say how much you leave on the table or where you're making sacrifices.

exactly, being at 0* is only what the gear is set at. In reality the cam could be retard 4*'s and you'd never know it. This is where the tuning comes into play. Once I got my cams dyno tuned holy cow I had power EVERYWHERE down low and up top. Really woke up my car and that was with the stock cams.

 

[BowerR64]

Once I got my cams dyno tuned holy cow I had power EVERYWHERE down low and up top. Really woke up my car and that was with the stock cams.

How do they do that?

 

[sleepyboy]

I went and got it dyno. They strapped the car down and started making pulls. First few pulls were to see where I was at. Then we did one cam at a time. Once one cam was dialed in we went to the next and then back to the other, till we got them dialed in. I have my dyno sheet posted in the Zetec dyno thread. I could have gotten more peak hp or tq but we dialed them in for the most avg. hp and tq through out the power band. Best money I spent on my car hands down.



I also want to add that my car was dyno'ed on a mustang dyno so my numbers are little lower than if they were on a dynojet. But you can see I make great numbers for the mods I had.

 

[BowerR64]

I went and got it dyno. They strapped the car down and started making pulls. First few pulls were to see where I was at. Then we did one cam at a time. Once one cam was dialed in we went to the next and then back to the other, till we got them dialed in. I have my dyno sheet posted in the Zetec dyno thread. I could have gotten more peak hp or tq but we dialed them in for the most avg. hp and tq through out the power band. Best money I spent on my car hands down.


I also want to add that my car was dyno'ed on a mustang dyno so my numbers are little lower than if they were on a dynojet. But you can see I make great numbers for the mods I had.

oh ok, that makes sense now. How many pulls did it take and about what did it run you?

Did they do it with an SCT type system?

 

[sleepyboy]

You don't need a tuner or a tune to get the cams dialed in. It cost me 150 bucks but they originally quoted me 100 bucks. Can't tell you how many pulls but over 10? To be quite honest I got ripped a little, but was happy with the end results so...but I will not pay that much again I'll tell you that. When I confronted them about the price he gave me some BS lines. Long story not meant for this thread. Call around and find out prices. I called some places that supposedly are car tuners or places like that and they didn't know what a adjustable cam gear was. Needless to say don't go anywhere that says that for sure lol. If a place really knew about cars then they wouldn't say stuff like that.


Oh and I want to add about the price. Most places charge for dyno time, not pulls. So I was being charged for the time not the pulls. Most places will do 3 pulls for 75 bucks you need more than 3 pulls. Most will give an 1 hr of dyno time for 100-150 bucks. Call around though.

 

[BowerR64]

So it was $150. for the dyno time and the tune adjustments?

Do you already have an SCT tuner or did they supply that and you leave with just a better running car?

How did they hook up the wideband or did they do any of that?

 

[1turbofocus]

You need to adjust the cam gears and get a tune , dyno is the only way to adjust the cam gears properly a compression gauge will get you close

13-13.5 WOT air fuel is WAY to lean and will kill the engine

Your in SC , I am in NC if your close I will adjust your cam gears on the dyno for 75.00

I can also do your tuning

Tom

 

[biggestloser]

You need to adjust the cam gears and get a tune , dyno is the only way to adjust the cam gears properly a compression gauge will get you close

13-13.5 WOT air fuel is WAY to lean and will kill the engine

Your in SC , I am in NC if your close I will adjust your cam gears on the dyno for 75.00

I can also do your tuning

Tom

tom what exactly is this service, what does it do and what should one expect?

 

[sleepyboy]

So it was $150. for the dyno time and the tune adjustments?

Do you already have an SCT tuner or did they supply that and you leave with just a better running car?

How did they hook up the wideband or did they do any of that?

I had no tuner or any tuning done, just had the cam gear dialed in. You don't need a tuner to get the cam gear dyno tuned. Though I highly suggest getting a tune. It was one of the biggest gains or I should say one of the best mods that I could have done to my car.

 

[iroc34]

tom what exactly is this service, what does it do and what should one expect?

"Your in SC , I am in NC if your close I will adjust your cam gears on the dyno for 75.00

I can also do your tuning "

THAT OFFER IS A NO BRAINER !!!. I`d be tempted to drive from Illinois for that deal !!! Take him up on it !!!

 

[sleepyboy]

^^yeah that is a deal, heck I'd do it in a heart beat if I wasn't hundred of miles away lol

 

[biggestloser]

whats being done? cams set to 0* or adjusting it to the bell curve like hell was talking about?

 

[1turbofocus]

When strapped to dyno , the intake cam gear would be adjusted then the Exh gear would be adjusted

About the tuning , I charge 399.00 and 20.00 for shipping you will get the xcal flasher , full custom tune not the cookie cutter tuning the competitions sells and FREE tunes as you add more NA mods

I can tune you car remote with you sending me datalogs by email , I can take over you PC and set everything up for dataloggin and show you how to use it like I was sitting there there is no other tuner that offers this level of tuning

Tom

 

[biggestloser]

^^yeah that is a deal, heck I'd do it in a heart beat if I wasn't hundred of miles away lol

i looked with no luck...were is your dyno sheet?