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Old 11-03-2017, 10:27 AM   #51
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Harmonic balancers are there to control the harmonics the engine produces through the crank , there is a reason Ford put them on this engine and not others like the Lima / Pinto 2.0/2.3 Engines

The more HP/TQ and engine produces the more harmonics it makes , the higher the RPM the higher RPM the more the harmonics , it needs to be there , its free to put back on and its safer for the engine , the UDP make NO hp gains at all and you cant see them when installed , there sold to line the pockets of the sellers there is no upside from them to install them

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Old 11-09-2017, 08:46 AM   #52
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The Zetec is internally zero balanced. The crank pulley is just that - a pulley. Harmonic "balancers" are used for balancing and engine. Even Fluidamper has stated the only thing better than their pulley is an internally zero balanced engine. Even Ford Racing sold UDPs. We've got millions of miles on our personal and customer vehicles with no ill effects.

A UDP will show a few HP on a dyno, and of course the reduced weight on the rotating assembly will allow it to rev faster.
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Old 11-10-2017, 05:29 PM   #53
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Firewall mod for Tilton pedals and MCs complete.

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Old 11-12-2017, 04:17 PM   #54
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Quote:
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The Zetec is internally zero balanced. The crank pulley is just that - a pulley. Harmonic "balancers" are used for balancing and engine.
Internal or external balance has NOTHING to do with a Harmonic balancer , your showing a total lack of understanding about what your talking about

Harmonic Balancers DO NOT balance the engine , they balance the Harmonics the engine makes during firing and rotation

You make a UDP , why dont you know what your part replaces and the cause and effect of removing it ?

Why do you think the Zetec/SVT engine lower Harmonic Balancer is 3 piece and what do you think that rubber ( elastomer ) is there for ?

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Even Fluidamper has stated the only thing better than their pulley is an internally zero balanced engine. Even Ford Racing sold UDPs. We've got millions of miles on our personal and customer vehicles with no ill effects.
LOL , LOL An external balanced engine means it has weights on the balancer , Flywheel or both and again has NOTHING to do with how or what a harmonic balancer does/works , whats hilarious about your statement is the FLUID in a Fluid Damp Balancer is there to help control the Engines Harmonics better vs the stock rubber in the stock Harmonic Balancer About Fluidampr you might want to read this , everyone thinking of a UDP should read the 2 links I put in here

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A UDP will show a few HP on a dyno, and of course the reduced weight on the rotating assembly will allow it to rev faster.
" few " meaning ?hp

As for your/any UDP there a TOTAL waste of money and there is NO Dnyos from you the maker and seller of UDP that show ANY gain from them and thats because they add less then 1hp if that , I have a inhouse DynoJet to test this stuff so I dont blindly make and sell parts that have the potential to damage an engine and claim gains in HP that you cant back up , I have tested your UDP on many Foci and have never seen over 1hp at the wheels from them and 1hp is being generous


https://machv.com/pages/tip-11-crank-pulleys this is a great read and there is thousands more out there about why NOT to remove your HARMONIC BALANCER which has NOTHING to do with how the engine is balanced


He is using his engine for long sustained wide open throttle at high RPM right where a harmonic balancer is needed the most and EXACTLY why the Fluid Damp was designed

I HIGHLY recommend you use your harmonic balancer back on your race engine , your engine , your money , your call , read the 2 links above and make your own decision , your being given bad advice in my opinion

Tom
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Old 11-14-2017, 07:08 PM   #55
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The correct term is a harmonic damper. A harmonic balancer is a harmonic damper with a weight designed to offset the internal imbalance of certain engines.

Per Ford Racing, circa 2001, the crank pulley on a Zetec is not a harmomic damper. The elastomer ring was not placed on the pulley for any reason related to the internal engine harmonics but instead to stop noise being transmitted by the external, belt driven accessories. It is solely there for NVH. This isn't to say that there aren't situations where that pulley might perform some harmonic dampening, but, per Ford Racing, that isn't what it was designed to do. If it does act as a harmonic damper, it is by dumb luck.

I am not sure if this remains true for the Duratec. With the longer stroke found in certain iterations of that engine, they may have found cause to add a harmonic damper. The design of the 2.5 crank pulley is quite different than that of other Duratecs, although that could just as easily be a result of a new tech or manufacturing as anything else.

I will say that there are cases of race four cylinders not fitted with a damper from the factory benefiting from the addition of one. Fluidampr makes one for the Honda B-series, for example. That engine came with a simple pulley, no elastomer ring anywhere (and a redline well beyond that of a Zetec) yet many builds add the damper in spite of the weight. Why? Because it helps durability and power.
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Old 11-15-2017, 07:25 PM   #56
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Doesnt matter why the elastomer is there for harmonics , belt , rotating mass , crank doesnt matter , the elastomer is there for a reason

That IS NOT what the Ford Engineers told me when I asked the engineers over that engine back in 1994 when we helped a team that raced the Escort successfully

To each there own , not my engine or money , My guys will run them , its works well for me to keep them and the added protection wont hurt a thing , even make the same HP as a UDP , there isnt a reason not to run it and many to run it

Tom
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Old 11-16-2017, 06:50 AM   #57
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Not surprised we got different info from Ford. Happens a lot. Ford Racing USA said to run 5w/30 in the Zetec on track. Ford Rallyesport UK told me 10w/40. Of course, neither of them were right because SAE weight isn't even the important point to be measured. But I digress.

I never ran a UDP for power, I did so I could slow down the alternator and have a hope of it living more than a couple thousand miles on track. I got tired of ejecting the bearings from the back of the case.

If you aren't wanting a UDP. add a Motorcraft GP-385 to the Zetec alternator. https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Offset is identical. I did the maths on how much it underdrives at one point and can dig it up if you'd like, but I do know that it works great and slows things down enough to be fine for 7000 RPM and lower in my experience. The alternator is the weak spot and must be addressed if you are going to be running extended RPM.

Unfortunately, you still have a power steering pump which is pushing fluid through and building heat way too fast, but at least you can add a cooler to that. Thankfully, the Zetec water pump shows little tendency to cavitate, but I always ran an larger aluminum pulley on that just in case.

I haven't had any issues with overspeeding of idler pulleys or the tensioner, thankfully. I was worried about the tensioner because I was running a blower at one point and it was seeing extra load, but it never had evidence of slippage even when shifting at 7300 to 7400 RPM.
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Old 11-16-2017, 04:27 PM   #58
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Its a pain to press off and on but there is a UDP PS Pump pulley to slow the pump down but they dont make a big difference in fluid temps , that with cooler helps a lot tho

Tom
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Old 11-16-2017, 05:49 PM   #59
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Its a pain to press off and on but there is a UDP PS Pump pulley to slow the pump down but they dont make a big difference in fluid temps , that with cooler helps a lot tho

Tom
I've got a good size power steering cooler with dedicated forced air, and it seemed to work well for the last two track seasons. I may move it and provide a better forced air path because I need the space where it is currently located for something else.

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Old 11-17-2017, 09:26 AM   #60
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Bigger rear sway bar is also good for lowering power steering temps. Steer less with the front wheels and more with the rear...
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