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Old 07-31-2019, 02:02 PM   #21
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To the OP - If you really believe what you have posted answer me this. Why did Ford choose to switch to a normal torque converter automatic in the face lift 2015 Focus in all of it's global markets except for the North America (USA & Canada) market?

Bottom line is dry dual clutch transmissions fault is thermal. The drivers who live in the country with no stop and go traffic & flat geography will have the best luck with this type of transmission.
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Old 07-31-2019, 02:26 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yanik View Post
But I am also not OK with people claiming that Ford owns them more than just working DCT.
Oh! Excellent point! Someone just tell Ford that all we want is a working DCT! I'm sure Ford never considered that people wanted to buy a car with a working transmission. They'll be simply thrilled to know the solution is just to fix the DPS6!

Give me a break. Of course Ford owes people more than just a working transmission. Have you been under a rock this whole time? Ford took to market a transmission they knew was defective. Before it was even available to customers. Do you not get that? It's not like they only discovered issues after the cars were in production (though they did that, too). It's great that the fixed the defective components (TCM, input shaft seals, and clutch plates) when it became obvious that those were problem items; if that were the only issue, then yes, I'd agree that Ford doesn't really "owe" us more than a working transmission.

Except that's not what happened, is it? They decided that the sunk cost of R&D (plus machining and production, and a whatever their contract with Getrag consisted of) was worth more than the financial cost of putting out a defective product.

That is why Ford "owes" us more than just a working transmission. They blatantly lied, have cost people time and money, and endangered lives by using a defective product. They need to be penalized for doing so, in order to deter similar behavior (by Ford or others) in the future.

Ugh, you corporate apologists are the worst.
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Old 07-31-2019, 03:08 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Shenny1319 View Post
Hello,

I just purchased a 2015 Ford Focus SE Hatchback with the infamous DTC.

I love it so far. Took it on a country road at 6 am on a Sunday and tour up the roads of central maine. The car performed great. I use the manual shift 85% of the time. Ironically the Free press article came out 2 days after I purchased it and gave me a bit of a scare. I spent a whole day of researching and have come up with a conclusion.

How many of you were explained by the dealer how the DTC works and how it can't be driven like a normal everyday automatic transmission?

IMO I think the transmission is great but wears early and cause problems because of bad user driving habits and the fact that Ford never explained that it should be ( in layman's terms) driven like a manual.

Thoughts, comments, concerns??


I hate to break it to everyone who thinks you have to drive it like a stick shift.... explain to me how you drive it like a stick, I understand that it’s not a conventional auto but it is definitely it a manual, I been driving only stickshift for 8 years till I bought this focus in 2013 and i still go back and forth driving both cars. Again how is it possible to drive an focus like a manual?
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Old 07-31-2019, 04:42 PM   #24
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I have a 2012. Until recently, I just thought it was an automatic. I didn't know anything about it, and I actually know about cars. I started hearing about the issues with them, and that's when I found out. Had I known in 2016 when I bought it, I never would have. Now it is lawn art and Ford is refusing to fix it. They want me to pay $5,200 to fix THEIR mistake.
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Old 07-31-2019, 05:28 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rczrider View Post
Oh! Excellent point! Someone just tell Ford that all we want is a working DCT! I'm sure Ford never considered that people wanted to buy a car with a working transmission. They'll be simply thrilled to know the solution is just to fix the DPS6!

Give me a break. Of course Ford owes people more than just a working transmission. Have you been under a rock this whole time? Ford took to market a transmission they knew was defective. Before it was even available to customers. Do you not get that? It's not like they only discovered issues after the cars were in production (though they did that, too). It's great that the fixed the defective components (TCM, input shaft seals, and clutch plates) when it became obvious that those were problem items; if that were the only issue, then yes, I'd agree that Ford doesn't really "owe" us more than a working transmission.

That is why Ford "owes" us more than just a working transmission. They blatantly lied, have cost people time and money, and endangered lives by using a defective product. They need to be penalized for doing so, in order to deter similar behavior (by Ford or others) in the future.

Ugh, you corporate apologists are the worst.
Recalling how Ford extended the transmission warranty rather then a full recall, I can only think that Ford has already deemed this product as a failure. The cost of recalling all DCT vehicles are too much for the R&D they sank to develop this sorry state of a transmission.

They extended the transmission warranty in the hopes that DCT drivers would trade their vehicles in long before reaching the warranty mileage.
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Old 08-01-2019, 01:09 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vidgomd View Post
I hate to break it to everyone who thinks you have to drive it like a stick shift.... explain to me how you drive it like a stick, I understand that it’s not a conventional auto but it is definitely it a manual, I been driving only stickshift for 8 years till I bought this focus in 2013 and i still go back and forth driving both cars. Again how is it possible to drive an focus like a manual?
You anticipate the shifts, so instead of applying a steady acceleration off a start, you give it a bit more juice, then lift up a bit allowing it to shift, then push it more. Just like you would with manual. That's how I do it, hope this makes sense
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Old 08-01-2019, 09:20 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yanik View Post
You anticipate the shifts, so instead of applying a steady acceleration off a start, you give it a bit more juice, then lift up a bit allowing it to shift, then push it more. Just like you would with manual. That's how I do it, hope this makes sense
Not arguing with what you said, but it is beyond ridiculous to expect a driver to do that for a non-manual car. The vast majority of buyers who don't want a stick expect to drive it like nearly every other auto trans car made for MANY decades. Shame on Ford for this crap.
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Old 08-01-2019, 09:29 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by saintsfins View Post
Not arguing with what you said, but it is beyond ridiculous to expect a driver to do that for a non-manual car. The vast majority of buyers who don't want a stick expect to drive it like nearly every other auto trans car made for MANY decades. Shame on Ford for this crap.
I bought mine used so I never had any interaction from the dealer saying you need to drive it any differently than a normal automatic. Furthermore, there is nothing in my 2012 manual to suggest that. So this begs the question - is there anything whatsoever in terms of official documentation directed to the consumer from Ford that gives this guidance? Yes, there is a huge thread on this forum that specifically addresses this but I have never seen anything official. Just telling the dealers to inform the customers seems like a really half-assed approach.
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Old 08-01-2019, 09:59 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by IrishBrewer View Post
Just telling the dealers to inform the customers seems like a really half-assed approach.
Completely half-assed and if Ford put this BS "drive it like a manual" in the sales brochure, they'd be lucky to sell any.
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Old 08-01-2019, 11:02 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yanik View Post
You anticipate the shifts, so instead of applying a steady acceleration off a start, you give it a bit more juice, then lift up a bit allowing it to shift, then push it more. Just like you would with manual. That's how I do it, hope this makes sense
Anticipating the shift points is borderline impossible, specifically because the car is supposed to change shift points on the fly, based on a variety of factors. While there's certainly a range, you have to spend a great deal of time with your car and have extremely regular driving habits to make this advice worth anything.

A manual works because you don't have to anticipate anything; you're in control. Unless you have a telepathic link to your transmission (in which case you should call Elon Musk), you simply can't interact with it the way you're suggesting.

Rather, the best advice is to be "intentional" in your driving and avoid creeping in slow traffic. That reduces the variations in your driving habits and takes a lot of traffic scenarios out of the equation that the computer uses to determine your shifting pattern. Essentially, dumb down your driving so the computer - which is too stupid to do what Ford wanted it to do - can keep up.

If we're being honest, that advice is going to make you a "better" driver, anyway. Creeping doesn't actually help anyone get anywhere any faster, and being intentional in your acceleration and braking will make you more aware of your surroundings and driving conditions. Of course, Americans are sh!tty drivers, so good luck getting anyone do any of that.
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Last edited by rczrider; 08-01-2019 at 11:05 AM.
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