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Old 06-04-2013, 12:54 PM   #21
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Why do you think Ford used stronger forged rods with bigger wrist pins in the SVT?
Because the SVT started life as the FR200 and was suppose to be turbocharged , when this changed they kept the rods because they were already built as well as the SVT head , cams , VCT etc

Even with ITB , 11-1 compression and all the other goodies in your list it still wouldnt hit 200HP

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Old 06-04-2013, 05:39 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1turbofocus View Post
Because the SVT started life as the FR200 and was suppose to be turbocharged , when this changed they kept the rods because they were already built as well as the SVT head , cams , VCT etc

Even with ITB , 11-1 compression and all the other goodies in your list it still wouldnt hit 200HP

Tom
I'm pretty sure it would be close enough so you'd just be splitting hairs.

VCT was clearly intended for NA to compliment the adjustable intake. Cams are NA grind for VCT. But I accept that the rods and head could work for either one, as long as the piston design/CR was changed... or maybe they just shaved all the heads for the NA version and accepted the valve interference that resulted.
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Old 06-04-2013, 07:32 PM   #23
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IIRC, Topspeed did a complete NA build on the SVT head and pulled 190s on pump fuel. but thats the highest i've heard with alot of custom parts. I don't know if there is a cam made for the focus (not even the crower 4's can make reasonable power @ 8500 rpm. I had a reasonably high hp focus NA @ 164 whp, and the only things i could have done more were raising compression to 11:1 +, ,but then you can't dd it on pump fuel. I could have gone to an SVT head w/ Tom porting the snot out of it and Kent Cams instead of a custom ported FR and Crower custom grinds, perhaps ITBs, and a dry sump to spin higher rpm, but at that point, your low end suffers too.

Iminhell has about the best NA setup. If I still had a social life, or any free time whatsoever anymore, i may try a build similar to his, but i don't have the time or money to do so.

Iminhell, did you ever dyno ur setup? I haven't been around a while to check to see what you made
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:27 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pb-foot View Post
I'm pretty sure it would be close enough so you'd just be splitting hairs.

VCT was clearly intended for NA to compliment the adjustable intake. Cams are NA grind for VCT. But I accept that the rods and head could work for either one, as long as the piston design/CR was changed... or maybe they just shaved all the heads for the NA version and accepted the valve interference that resulted.
Do some reading on the FR200 it was an interesting car and what the SVT should of been , I got to drive one and got to see 3 of them back in the day , trying to buy one now

I build a lot of Caterhams , and built some with the combo you talked about and there in the 185 range with a RPM range of 3600 - 7300

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Old 06-04-2013, 08:59 PM   #25
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Has anybody from the forum ever build a zetec with ITB in a focus ? ( I mean true ITB's not itb's inside a plenum to keep using MAF ). I've been looking around for a while but nobody as ever done and documented it this side of the Atlantic. In Europe they get more than 200 hp with ITB on engines that they transplant into saphire, focus , fiestas, Orions , Escort mkx, cortinas, etc... I suppose running aftermarket ECU is what is keeping us from going all-out and build monster zetec's ? CAuse I understand that the stock ECU cannot be converted to run with another signal than MAF ( Tom corect me if I'm wrong ? )

Dunnell are making 190 hp on ITb's with stock head, valvetrain, bottom end and camshafts ... That seems like a quick way to gain 60 hp IMHO :
http://www.dunnellengines.com/zetec_...tionkits_4.php

Though, it wouldnt be cheap to go that route cause you would still need custom tuning...
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Old 06-05-2013, 11:09 AM   #26
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Brad,
I made 173hp on the stock SVT intake (manifold to airbox).
Haven't dyno'd with the FRIM yet.


Far as ITB's go,
You cannot compare the power to any stock ECU powered car. You are not able to know what made the extra power, or if the stock ECU is holding the car back.


Far as the FR200 goes,
They (all of them) were built with ZX2 parts. The SVT evolved from things learned with the cars. But the SVT didn't. use any of the parts used on the FR200 that I know of or have ever seen proof of.
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Old 06-05-2013, 12:04 PM   #27
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Quote:
Far as ITB's go,
You cannot compare the power to any stock ECU powered car. You are not able to know what made the extra power, or if the stock ECU is holding the car back.
I dont get your point ? What is restricting your power output when tuning on ford ecu ? I believed that SCT gave you access to all ignition and injection tables ? And I've read many times that ford has better/faster/more precise processors than most of the aftermarket ecu's... The only difference being the ability of aftermarket ecu's to calculate the amount of air via other strategies than MAF using maf...

I dont think a megasquirt/AEM/omex/whatever tuned stock focus would make more power than an SCT tuned stock focus ? ( as long as both tunes were provided by professionnal tuners, running the same level of octane ) Do you ?
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Old 06-05-2013, 12:23 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1turbofocus View Post
Do some reading on the FR200 it was an interesting car and what the SVT should of been , I got to drive one and got to see 3 of them back in the day , trying to buy one now

I build a lot of Caterhams , and built some with the combo you talked about and there in the 185 range with a RPM range of 3600 - 7300

Tom
Did some reading... it looks like that car will cost you allot as a collectable, but fun to play with. Too bad all Ford ended up using it for was to test the viability of some aftermarket parts for FRPP. All three engines seem to have been tweaked a bit differently though, it looks like SVT might have learned from the developement of them and chose the more robust internals to build around.

I'm sure it's fun to build/tune Caterhams, I remember seeing a Lotus Super 7 easily pulling away from everything else in the field that had a half liter "advantage" in modified class. And youtube is full of current day examples of Chaterhams doing the same on any kind of track.

Is the 185 figure street-tuned for 93 octane, or is that race fuel tuned? It seems to me that such an engine as described should be able to carry power into 8K range at 11:1, with proper cams/gas/head work on race fuel. But then I've been wrong before, although I'm usually quite close.
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Old 06-05-2013, 04:38 PM   #29
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Classic Ford, july 2013 issue : 251 hp zetec engine and 211 lbs.ft
http://www.classicfordmag.co.uk/2013...e-on-the-dyno/
When do we start building one ???

PS: that FR200 looked like a pretty quick car, too bad they didn't mass produce it :(
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Old 06-05-2013, 08:15 PM   #30
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Nice link, beatmaniac1! ITBs FTW NA.
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