E85 vs 93 octane - Ford Focus Forum, Ford Focus ST Forum, Ford Focus RS Forum
Ford Focus Forum
HomeContact UsAbout UsGalleryDiscussion ForumsMarketplace


Go Back   Ford Focus Forum, Ford Focus ST Forum, Ford Focus RS Forum > Ford Focus Third Generation > DURATEC Ti-VCT Performance (2012-Current)

DURATEC Ti-VCT Performance (2012-Current) The place to chat about any Duratec 2.0L Ti-VCT engine performance, tuning and exhaust related upgrades.

Search This Forum | Image Search | Advanced Search    
Ford Focus Tire & Wheels FocusFanatics Merchandise

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-20-2013, 08:47 PM   #1
Eminaga
Focus Addict
 
Eminaga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Fan#: 123953
Location: Waterloo, IA
What I Drive: 2014 Focus SE (Performance Blue)

Posts: 985
Points 1,192, Level 18
Points: 1,192, Level: 18 Points: 1,192, Level: 18 Points: 1,192, Level: 18
Level Up 92% Completed
Level up: 92% Level up: 92% Level up: 92%
Forum Activity 24%
Activity: 24% Activity: 24% Activity: 24%
FF Reputation: 1 Eminaga Good Standing Member
Buy-Sell-Trade Rating: (0)
E85 vs 93 octane

I have access to E85 for 2.99 per galon and 93 octane for 4.30 per galon... Which one should I use? My car is stock but it drives better with 92 octane that i put in it so I am assuming 93 will be even better, but its so expensive! Should I go ahead and use E85? What are the negatives to it other then less mpg which I dont care about...?

By the way I am new here I traded my 2013 Subaru impreza for a 2014 Focus SE 5 speed with sport package and nav package. Subaru had too many quality issues plus it was CVT so boring as hell. Focus is a lot faster and better build quality. If you are thinking about a subaru impreza, run... By the way I plan on doing mods to be faster I got the best 0-60 at 7.4 seconds slipping the clutch at 4k. One more question, if I used E85 could I run the 93 tune from one of the tuners?


Eminaga is offline  
    Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 11-20-2013, 09:31 PM   #2
1turbofocus
FF Affiliate
 
1turbofocus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Fan#: 1123
Location: Belmont, NC
What I Drive: 2000 ZX3 / 2002 SVT Turbocharged

Posts: 22,180
Points 51,268, Level 100
Points: 51,268, Level: 100 Points: 51,268, Level: 100 Points: 51,268, Level: 100
Level Up 0% Completed
Level up: 0% Level up: 0% Level up: 0%
Forum Activity 22%
Activity: 22% Activity: 22% Activity: 22%
FF Reputation: 154 1turbofocus Excellent Standing Member 1turbofocus Excellent Standing Member
Buy-Sell-Trade Rating: (28)
My opinion is stay away from the e85 if your using it for performance , the loss of mpg in most cases makes it very close to the cost of 92-93

The octane is unregulated so it is all over the place from one fill to another , do a lot of reading and understanding before you for your own decision

I wont use the stuff

Tom
__________________
Focus-Power: Your #1 Source for Ford Focus Speed, Tuning & Performance!

Customer Support
AIM: hpdyno
Email: hpdyno@aol.com
Phone: 704-249-3745
Site: focus-power.com

Elder 1turbofocus
1turbofocus is online now  
    Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-20-2013, 09:43 PM   #3
Eminaga
Focus Addict
 
Eminaga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Fan#: 123953
Location: Waterloo, IA
What I Drive: 2014 Focus SE (Performance Blue)

Posts: 985
Points 1,192, Level 18
Points: 1,192, Level: 18 Points: 1,192, Level: 18 Points: 1,192, Level: 18
Level Up 92% Completed
Level up: 92% Level up: 92% Level up: 92%
Forum Activity 24%
Activity: 24% Activity: 24% Activity: 24%
FF Reputation: 1 Eminaga Good Standing Member
Buy-Sell-Trade Rating: (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1turbofocus View Post
My opinion is stay away from the e85 if your using it for performance , the loss of mpg in most cases makes it very close to the cost of 92-93

The octane is unregulated so it is all over the place from one fill to another , do a lot of reading and understanding before you for your own decision

I wont use the stuff

Tom
Thanks Tom. I have been doing a lot of reading in the last few days especially about tuning and I will probably go with you once I decide to do that. I just have 485 miles on the car so far so I will give it some more time before tuning. I like the way you can tune my car any time I add a new mod instead of the tune that injected do which is just octane based. (not that I have anything against them from reading their thread they seem to be doing a great job and people are happy)

First thing I got to do is get KNN filter,RMM and short shifter from steeda before I tune. This might take a while I am still learning this car
Eminaga is offline  
    Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-21-2013, 08:25 AM   #4
02fordsvt
Meh.
 
02fordsvt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Fan#: 84654
Location: Lowville, NY
What I Drive: 2002 SVT, 2001 SE (Rusty)

Posts: 9,791
Points 55,590, Level 100
Points: 55,590, Level: 100 Points: 55,590, Level: 100 Points: 55,590, Level: 100
Level Up 0% Completed
Level up: 0% Level up: 0% Level up: 0%
Forum Activity 8%
Activity: 8% Activity: 8% Activity: 8%
FF Reputation: 49 02fordsvt Great Standing Member
Buy-Sell-Trade Rating: (11)
My suggestion would be to stay away from E85.

If your worried about the cost of fuel, you'll be better off running lower octane gas instead of the high ethanol gas. I don't know what stations sell in your area, but locally for me, I get a choice of 87 and 91 octane gas with at no more than 12% ethanol by law, or ethanol free 93 octane gas.
__________________
Hatch Nation #13 : Rally Revolution #13 : ROTM Jan '13
It's Bryan, not Brian
RSVT-170 Build in Progress
Derusting Rusty Build in Progress
02fordsvt is offline  
    Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-21-2013, 10:12 AM   #5
Eminaga
Focus Addict
 
Eminaga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Fan#: 123953
Location: Waterloo, IA
What I Drive: 2014 Focus SE (Performance Blue)

Posts: 985
Points 1,192, Level 18
Points: 1,192, Level: 18 Points: 1,192, Level: 18 Points: 1,192, Level: 18
Level Up 92% Completed
Level up: 92% Level up: 92% Level up: 92%
Forum Activity 24%
Activity: 24% Activity: 24% Activity: 24%
FF Reputation: 1 Eminaga Good Standing Member
Buy-Sell-Trade Rating: (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by 02fordsvt View Post
My suggestion would be to stay away from E85.

If your worried about the cost of fuel, you'll be better off running lower octane gas instead of the high ethanol gas. I don't know what stations sell in your area, but locally for me, I get a choice of 87 and 91 octane gas with at no more than 12% ethanol by law, or ethanol free 93 octane gas.
I can get 92 with ethanol for $3.30 and ethanol free 93 for a dollar more. I guess I will just keep using 92 with ethanol since I like the way the car drives compared to 87. It would probably not be worth going with 93 since it would cost me 10-11 bucks more per fill up and the difference in power/mpg compared to 92 w/ethanol would be small. I do feel the ethanol free 93 would make my car happy, ughh sucks being ocd about that kind of stuff!!!
Eminaga is offline  
    Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-21-2013, 10:27 AM   #6
Romans5.8
Focus Enthusiast
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Fan#: 119488
Location: Franklin County, MO
What I Drive: 2014 Tuxedo Black Ford Focus SE

Posts: 413
Points 578, Level 11
Points: 578, Level: 11 Points: 578, Level: 11 Points: 578, Level: 11
Level Up 56% Completed
Level up: 56% Level up: 56% Level up: 56%
Forum Activity 1%
Activity: 1% Activity: 1% Activity: 1%
FF Reputation: 4 Romans5.8 Good Standing Member
Buy-Sell-Trade Rating: (0)
First off, understand that octane doesn't increase power. More octane =/= more power. Even if ethanol really was that magic 110+ octane (it usually isn't, and it's usually inconsistent and all over the place), that wouldn't increase power. It would simply really, really resist knocking. That's ALL octane is, a resistance to knocking. Your car also has a knock sensor that will adjust timing to prevent knocking. Higher octane fuels have their use (heavily loaded down car wide open throttle up a steep hill, in the case of the mk3 focus, will benefit as lower octane fuels will eventually cause knocking which means the computer will retard timing; it won't have to with high octane).

HOWEVER, ethanol, no matter the octane, is far less thermally efficient. For starters, understand WHY ethanol gets poorer gas mileage; it's because the engine has to work harder to accomplish the same work. You need more ethanol to cruise 70mph on the highway than you need gasoline to do the same job. Just all there is to it.

In heavily modified, forced induction engines, they can be tuned for more performance by taking advantage of the knock resistance of ethanol. However, your stock mk3 focus will not benefit in any way, and will have a reduction in power and fuel economy.

If you do the math and find that it's cheaper; that's one thing. But, it is NOT for performance, no matter what the internet and it's amazing butt-dynos tell you.
__________________
2014 Ford Focus SE, Tuxedo Black (Sport pkg, 5spd manual)
2002 Ford Taurus SEL, Silver Frost (Wifes Car)
2006 Kawasaki Vulcan 900 Classic LT, Thunder Blue / Graphite Two-Tone
2011 Honda Shadow Aero, Candy Red (Wife's Bike)
Romans5.8 is offline  
    Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-21-2013, 12:07 PM   #7
Eminaga
Focus Addict
 
Eminaga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Fan#: 123953
Location: Waterloo, IA
What I Drive: 2014 Focus SE (Performance Blue)

Posts: 985
Points 1,192, Level 18
Points: 1,192, Level: 18 Points: 1,192, Level: 18 Points: 1,192, Level: 18
Level Up 92% Completed
Level up: 92% Level up: 92% Level up: 92%
Forum Activity 24%
Activity: 24% Activity: 24% Activity: 24%
FF Reputation: 1 Eminaga Good Standing Member
Buy-Sell-Trade Rating: (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Romans5.8 View Post
First off, understand that octane doesn't increase power. More octane =/= more power. Even if ethanol really was that magic 110+ octane (it usually isn't, and it's usually inconsistent and all over the place), that wouldn't increase power. It would simply really, really resist knocking. That's ALL octane is, a resistance to knocking. Your car also has a knock sensor that will adjust timing to prevent knocking. Higher octane fuels have their use (heavily loaded down car wide open throttle up a steep hill, in the case of the mk3 focus, will benefit as lower octane fuels will eventually cause knocking which means the computer will retard timing; it won't have to with high octane).

HOWEVER, ethanol, no matter the octane, is far less thermally efficient. For starters, understand WHY ethanol gets poorer gas mileage; it's because the engine has to work harder to accomplish the same work. You need more ethanol to cruise 70mph on the highway than you need gasoline to do the same job. Just all there is to it.

In heavily modified, forced induction engines, they can be tuned for more performance by taking advantage of the knock resistance of ethanol. However, your stock mk3 focus will not benefit in any way, and will have a reduction in power and fuel economy.

If you do the math and find that it's cheaper; that's one thing. But, it is NOT for performance, no matter what the internet and it's amazing butt-dynos tell you.
You could be right but why do people dyno more on 91+ octane with these cars? And also report better drivability? I know I can feel a nice difference when I switched from dealers 87 octane to 92...
Eminaga is offline  
    Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-21-2013, 12:25 PM   #8
Romans5.8
Focus Enthusiast
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Fan#: 119488
Location: Franklin County, MO
What I Drive: 2014 Tuxedo Black Ford Focus SE

Posts: 413
Points 578, Level 11
Points: 578, Level: 11 Points: 578, Level: 11 Points: 578, Level: 11
Level Up 56% Completed
Level up: 56% Level up: 56% Level up: 56%
Forum Activity 1%
Activity: 1% Activity: 1% Activity: 1%
FF Reputation: 4 Romans5.8 Good Standing Member
Buy-Sell-Trade Rating: (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eminaga View Post
You could be right but why do people dyno more on 91+ octane with these cars? And also report better drivability? I know I can feel a nice difference when I switched from dealers 87 octane to 92...
They may report better drivability because their high octane fuel runs no ethanol, has additives; or, for the same reason that a number of people can be convinced they are cured of a disease after taking a placebo. If you think it's gonna happen, are convinced it's gonna happen, do it; well you're already convinced it's happened!

Also, a Dyno only measures one thing. Power at wide open throttle with a load. That's where that knock sensor comes in. With lower octane fuel, under heavy load and full, wide open throttle, lower octane fuels can induce knocking which causes the computer to retard timing, reducing performance slightly. However, in every day driving, performance will be the same. Provided there are not OTHER variables at play (such as 91/92/93E0 vs 87E10, or additives used in premium fuel).

Smoother and better throttle response maybe. I haven't driven your car, I don't know! There are ways to measure that but it gets pretty pricey! And it is possible, that the car is running with the ignition slightly retarded even at lower RPM's in anticipating of heavy loads. But, basically the point is- you aren't getting cleaner burning engines and it's not 'better' for your engine. And the octane ITSELF doesn't do anything for performance. It doesn't have more 'energy' in it. It ENABLES more performance, but it doesn't CREATE it, does that make sense? And that was my point. If you want to run premium, go for it, I do too a lot of times. I'm just saying we have to understand what octane ACTUALLY does, to understand why ethanol is not a great choice for performance on OUR engines. Ethanol resists knocking, but has less energy. So, performance will go down. Both in real world driving scenarios, and in wide-open-throttle dyno runs.
__________________
2014 Ford Focus SE, Tuxedo Black (Sport pkg, 5spd manual)
2002 Ford Taurus SEL, Silver Frost (Wifes Car)
2006 Kawasaki Vulcan 900 Classic LT, Thunder Blue / Graphite Two-Tone
2011 Honda Shadow Aero, Candy Red (Wife's Bike)
Romans5.8 is offline  
    Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-22-2013, 02:13 AM   #9
Tjrommel
Focus Enthusiast
 
Tjrommel's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Fan#: 114674
Location: Cincinnati, OH
What I Drive: 2013 Oxford white Sedan 5M

Posts: 294
Points 1,516, Level 22
Points: 1,516, Level: 22 Points: 1,516, Level: 22 Points: 1,516, Level: 22
Level Up 16% Completed
Level up: 16% Level up: 16% Level up: 16%
Forum Activity 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
FF Reputation: 1 Tjrommel Good Standing Member
Buy-Sell-Trade Rating: (0)
7.4 seconds 0-60 o.0 Run Shell 93, I did a ton of datalogging... Top 2 gasolines were BP and Shell. I was able to run 1* advance further at WOT (23.5) on V-Power than BP ultimate. If you're unfamiliar with advance curves, a general rule is the further advance the more stable/less detonation you have... which is good :)
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_HedgeHog View Post
That or the new SMurF mod ;)
Tjrommel is offline  
    Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-22-2013, 07:38 AM   #10
Eminaga
Focus Addict
 
Eminaga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Fan#: 123953
Location: Waterloo, IA
What I Drive: 2014 Focus SE (Performance Blue)

Posts: 985
Points 1,192, Level 18
Points: 1,192, Level: 18 Points: 1,192, Level: 18 Points: 1,192, Level: 18
Level Up 92% Completed
Level up: 92% Level up: 92% Level up: 92%
Forum Activity 24%
Activity: 24% Activity: 24% Activity: 24%
FF Reputation: 1 Eminaga Good Standing Member
Buy-Sell-Trade Rating: (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tjrommel View Post
7.4 seconds 0-60 o.0 Run Shell 93, I did a ton of datalogging... Top 2 gasolines were BP and Shell. I was able to run 1* advance further at WOT (23.5) on V-Power than BP ultimate. If you're unfamiliar with advance curves, a general rule is the further advance the more stable/less detonation you have... which is good :)
Yeah I got 7.4 after about 5th try most were 7.5-7.6. It seems like the more you raise the rpms the faster it does it. I have not tried to go over 4k since the car is still brand new and I kinda feel bad. After I do my first oil change I will try 5k launch lol. Anyway I will try shell 93 thats the pump that offers it in my area its just kind of expensive.
Eminaga is offline  
    Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply

Bookmarks & Social Networks

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Ford Focus Forum, Ford Focus ST Forum, Ford Focus RS Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:06 PM.


Copyright 2002-2014 FocusFanatics.com. All Rights Reserved : Privacy Policy : Advertise Information

Focus Fanatics Ford Focus Forum offers many fun ways for you to engage with other Ford Focus Owners from across the world. Whether it be about the aftermarket performance modifications, technical how-to's, European tuned suspension or awesome fuel economy similar to the Audi S3, Ford Fusion and Acura TLX. You can find all Ford Focus and Focus ST related information here. Join our Ford Focus discussion forums and chat with local Focus enthusiasts in your area. Challenger Hellcat - Charger Hellcat