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Old 07-12-2012, 10:22 PM   #1
awsimons
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DCT Shift Into Neutral?

I had my first experience with some weird DCT behavior today. I was in stop and go traffic in South Texas heat today and I started getting some clutch slipping. I had a manual before and the same thing would happen in stop and go traffic sometimes.

I've read recommendations about putting VW's DSG into neutral if you were going to be stationary for more than a few seconds rather than keeping your foot on the brake in D. Apparently in D, the clutch stays very close to engaging, possibly causing more heat to build up, whereas in N, the clutch is completely disengaged and no heat is building up. Does our DCT operate like this? Should we be shifting to N in traffic?

Alan


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Old 07-12-2012, 10:42 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by awsimons View Post
I had my first experience with some weird DCT behavior today. I was in stop and go traffic in South Texas heat today and I started getting some clutch slipping. I had a manual before and the same thing would happen in stop and go traffic sometimes.

I've read recommendations about putting VW's DSG into neutral if you were going to be stationary for more than a few seconds rather than keeping your foot on the brake in D. Apparently in D, the clutch stays very close to engaging, possibly causing more heat to build up, whereas in N, the clutch is completely disengaged and no heat is building up. Does our DCT operate like this? Should we be shifting to N in traffic?

Alan
You really shouldn't need to.

I've fooled around at stoplights and going from N to D just takes more time then leaving it in D.

If anything my foot is on brake and gas and I let it rev to 1500-2000 and then go; no issues. Usually I only do this if I am at the front of the line, never if I am behind someone for obvious reasons.
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Old 07-13-2012, 08:44 AM   #3
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Your car should be able to sit at a stoplight in D without causing itself problems. As far as I can tell, the clutch totally disengages when the transmission receives a signal from the brake light circuit, and the wheel speed = 0.

Having said that....I do put mine in N when I get stopped at lights that I know are long, just so I can take my foot off the brake.
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Old 07-13-2012, 10:35 AM   #4
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Since these are automated manual transmissions I would assume there's a throwout bearing. I don't know. If there is I would put it in neutral at stops of more than a few seconds.
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Old 07-13-2012, 03:25 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by awsimons View Post
Should we be shifting to N in traffic?
In my previous Pontiacs with automatics, I would shift into N at long lights and stop and go congestion, as it was mentioned in the owners manual to do so to reduce heat build up in the torque converter. I tried the same with 2012 and it didn't really work that well. I am not sure but it seems to me the car shifts into N for you when stationary, thus the roll back on hills when letting of the brake from a dead stop. I would be the smart thing for the computer to tell the transmission to do. Not sure if it does it though.
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Old 07-13-2012, 03:34 PM   #6
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I am not sure but it seems to me the car shifts into N for you when stationary, thus the roll back on hills when letting of the brake from a dead stop.
That doesn't necessarily mean it shifts into neutral. It could be that it's left in first gear with the clutches disengaged.
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Old 07-13-2012, 03:55 PM   #7
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It could be that it's left in first gear with the clutches disengaged.
It could, I said I didn't know, but it seems to me the if all it had to do was release a clutch the process would be quicker. In my car it feels like the car is shifting into gear and releasing the clutch. Just a sort of seat of the pants feel. Maybe some tech or other person with actual knowledge of what it does will step in here and clear it up.
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Old 07-13-2012, 04:56 PM   #8
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@awsimons

I've been experiencing the same problem lately since the temps in my area started climbing into the 90's, and noticed that turning off the A/C seems to help quite a bit.

Have you tried that?
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Old 07-14-2012, 05:11 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BetaDnB View Post
That doesn't necessarily mean it shifts into neutral. It could be that it's left in first gear with the clutches disengaged.
The DCT uses something referred to in the documentation as neutral idle. Of course initially it was also described as allowing the car to freewheel while under deceleration. I think that portion was deprogrammed out later, but still prior to release in favor of the a-dfso, but it would also put the car into neutral at speed while coasting or decelerating.

It would make more sense that the car would be in neutral with the clutches engaged fully at a stop rather than having the car in first with the clutch disengaged. If its bad for the manual transmission's throwout bearing then chances are they've not done this to what is essentially two sequential 3 speed manual gearboxes in a single case.

Even in select shift manual mode with the car stating that it is in 1st it really is in neutral when the vehicle speed is equal to zero. This is why it takes at least a few fractions of a second or two for the clutch to engage and the gear to be re-selected upon take off. Just as in a manual. If it was simply a matter of releasing the clutch and going it would potentially be quicker, but it would be causing undue wear on throwout bearing and lay shafts.

"Neutral idle: This feature helps improve fuel economy by eliminating the drag a traditional hydraulic transmission puts on the engine when a vehicle is idling"
http://media.ford.com/article_displa...ticle_id=34218
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Old 07-14-2012, 09:02 PM   #10
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Not sure where I read this (a thread on here somewhere perhaps), but if memory serves, the clutches on the DCT are normally "open" or not engaged, unlike a traditional manual transmission. Picture a clutch pedal working in reverse, where you have to push it to start moving.
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