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Old 06-10-2013, 05:58 PM   #41
replica81
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Originally Posted by 2.0 Focus View Post
The only thing is I was talking about the 99-07 models not the 09/10+. At that time they dropped the American version and brought in the European version over. Ford has brought in about 6/7 European models in the past 5 years, steadily dropping their American versions.

Cost cutting is evident in 99-07's. Looking at other ford's produced in that time period they are of better quality.
The 99-04's were reasonable quality for their time. It's evident there was some cost cutting on the 2005 refresh. I've owned both, and the interior materials were slightly better on the 99-04's. I'm not sure it bothers me that much, as I don't have any rattles, and I don't touch much of the interior expect the touchpoints (handles, arm rest, steering wheel etc) are all carryovers from the first Focus. Cost cutting is pretty common over the life of a model, Toyota is infamous for it on the Camry. As long as the cost cutting doesn't completely ruin the ability of the car, I'm not sure it's that big of a concern. An example; my 2005 Focus has a dash made from hard plastics, the 99-04's have a softer dash. This doesn't concern me. The 08-10 or whatever years, scream "cost cutting" to the point I'd never consider ownership.
Quote:

They are not problems they are parts of these cars. I've driven a 05 Toyota matrix and everything just felt a bit more refined, from the ride to auto trans. Granted the matrix may have cost more when it was new.
I've driven a base auto Matrix, as well as the XRS. The Toyota is a little nicer but they cost more and aren't as engaging to drive. Not that the Focus is a race car by any means, but it is a more tactile experience and the steering offers more feedback. The Matrix does have a bit of cost cutting, namely, that rear beam suspension. I sort of doubt it rode better, but that's up to each of our own personal standards to determine.


Quote:
The problem I have with the handbrake is that it is too weak to stop the car from 30 mph in an emergency situation. There is not enough leverage to it. However this can be attributed to the weak rear brakes.
I've never, in my life, considered using the handbrake to stop the car from 30 mph. I've never heard of anyone using it in an emergency to slow the car. This sounds pretty illogical and probably won't accomplish anything better than just hitting the brakes and letting the ABS work its magic. I think every car I've ever owned (over 20 cars), it was possible to accidentally leave the handbrake up and drive around with it engaged with only slight resistance. Please don't depend on your parking brake to stop your car from 30 MPH. It's absolutely a bad idea.
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Old 06-10-2013, 06:15 PM   #42
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The 99-04's were reasonable quality for their time. It's evident there was some cost cutting on the 2005 refresh. I've owned both, and the interior materials were slightly better on the 99-04's. I'm not sure it bothers me that much, as I don't have any rattles, and I don't touch much of the interior expect the touchpoints (handles, arm rest, steering wheel etc) are all carryovers from the first Focus. Cost cutting is pretty common over the life of a model, Toyota is infamous for it on the Camry. As long as the cost cutting doesn't completely ruin the ability of the car, I'm not sure it's that big of a concern. An example; my 2005 Focus has a dash made from hard plastics, the 99-04's have a softer dash. This doesn't concern me. The 08-10 or whatever years, scream "cost cutting" to the point I'd never consider ownership.


I've never, in my life, considered using the handbrake to stop the car from 30 mph. I've never heard of anyone using it in an emergency to slow the car. This sounds pretty illogical and probably won't accomplish anything better than just hitting the brakes and letting the ABS work its magic. I think every car I've ever owned (over 20 cars), it was possible to accidentally leave the handbrake up and drive around with it engaged with only slight resistance. Please don't depend on your parking brake to stop your car from 30 MPH. It's absolutely a bad idea.
I'm talking more in terms of the things behind the dashboard and internal working components. Everything makes noise when you turn it on or off, like the wipers, a/c, vents moving, and all other sorts of actuators and motor noise. Not much refinement.

And as for the handbrake its called an "emergency brake" for a reason. If your engine goes out you will have limited braking power.


The only misconception that seems to be on this forum is that the focus is bad in snow. That's far from the actual truth, it is excellent in snow. For some reason people think that a large pick up or suv will be better. But the fact is driving a suv/pick up in the snow will feel like your on 5 foot stilts, limited control and very bad braking distances due to the weight.
While the focus is nimble, accelerates very well and brakes good too. I've been though 12" of snow and besides the idiotic bumper design that eats snow and shoves it into vital engine components which then freeze over it was perfectly fine.
If you cannot drive it though snow its not because the car but because of the lack of snow driving experience/ skill.
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Old 06-10-2013, 06:23 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2.0 Focus View Post
I'm talking more in terms of the things behind the dashboard and internal working components. Everything makes noise when you turn it on or off, like the wipers, a/c, vents moving, and all other sorts of actuators and motor noise. Not much refinement.

And as for the handbrake its called an "emergency brake" for a reason. If your engine goes out you will have limited braking power.
The wiper motor is quite loud. I agree some of the small things seem a bit noisy, but as long as they function, I don't mind too much. I still think someone is shooting at me when I hit the trunk release. POP. The thing that "killed" the Focus was Ford's neglect and letting it rot on the vine past 2004. It was pretty much the same car all the way until 2010. Though, Toyota did this with the Corolla, as did Honda with the Civic, and Mazda is really pushing their luck with the ancient Mazda3.

I've never had a situation where I needed the handbrake. I guess it's possible.


Quote:
The only misconception that seems to be on this forum is that the focus is bad in snow. That's far from the actual truth, it is excellent in snow. For some reason people think that a large pick up or suv will be better. But the fact is driving a suv/pick up in the snow will feel like your on 5 foot stilts, limited control and very bad braking distances due to the weight.
While the focus is nimble, accelerates very well and brakes good too. I've been though 12" of snow and besides the idiotic bumper design that eats snow and shoves it into vital engine components which then freeze over it was perfectly fine.
If you cannot drive it though snow its not because the car but because of the lack of snow driving experience/ skill.
I had a 2008 as a rental the first time I drove through snow. It did very well. I had zero snow driving experience at the time.
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Old 06-10-2013, 06:24 PM   #44
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My Focus interior feels more expensive than most other brand of economy cars. I sat in a new Honda the other day and it felt cheap to me. I like my 4 year old Focus and still get compliments on it. So much so that my Sister in-law went out and bought a fusion because she liked my car so much. And to date, I have only seen 2 other coupes in this area. A silver one like mine and just the other day I saw a black one.

And road noise is much less with those Continental DWS tires on. The Kumho tires sucked ass all around.

But I agree the ST is over priced for what it is. Hugely so. Also, I'm not a fan of four door vehicles. If they ever make a 2 door hatch, I'll consider it. The sedans do nothing for me in their current form (the ass-end looks disfigured. lol).
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Old 06-10-2013, 06:26 PM   #45
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My Focus interior feels more expensive than most other brand of economy cars. I sat in a new Honda the other day and it felt cheap to me. I like my 4 year old Focus and still get compliments on it. So much so that my Sister in-law went out and bought a fusion because she liked my car so much.
I've had a 2005 Civic Si, as well as a 2007 Si. I think they both had nicer interiors than the 2008 Focus. But neither was terribly luxurious.
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Old 06-10-2013, 06:42 PM   #46
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2012 ford's interior is nicer then the 2012 jetta's
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Old 06-10-2013, 09:28 PM   #47
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I read a bit of this, some sense from some, but not much from others. Becomes very apparent who's bought a brand new Focus and who hasn't. Also who thought the car would be more than it really is.

I knew what I was buying, I knew what I was going to do with the car. I have zero complaints. In fact I bought another simply because mine was waring out. As much as I hate to admit it, I love the car.
Bought mine brand new in March '01 with 14 miles (8 of which were me test driving it).
Bought my second ('00), second hand with 48,xxx last July.
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Old 06-11-2013, 12:03 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by 2.0 Focus View Post
The only thing is I was talking about the 99-07 models not the 09/10+. At that time they dropped the American version and brought in the European version over. Ford has brought in about 6/7 European models in the past 5 years, steadily dropping their American versions.

Cost cutting is evident in 99-07's. Looking at other ford's produced in that time period they are of better quality.

I've driven 3 99-07 focuses, old q56, nissan maxima (briefly), 2 chrysler pacifica's (very good car, even though Americans bashed it), mercdes s class, mercedes ml class, mercedes gl class, ford f150 lariat, f150 xlt, f150 fx2, ford fx2 (2012), some 05 chevy sedan, 2 different dodge caravans, Toyota sienna, Toyota matrix, very basic Toyota Tacoma, Toyota yaris, mustang gt 5.0, Hyundai genesis 3.8 auto, genesis manual, ram 1500, Honda ridgeline and nissan frontier.





They are not problems they are parts of these cars. I've driven a 05 Toyota matrix and everything just felt a bit more refined, from the ride to auto trans. Granted the matrix may have cost more when it was new.



The problem I have with the handbrake is that it is too weak to stop the car from 30 mph in an emergency situation. There is not enough leverage to it. However this can be attributed to the weak rear brakes.
You are not a car person.
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Old 06-11-2013, 01:59 AM   #49
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You are not a car person.
????
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Old 06-11-2013, 02:01 AM   #50
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Define "Murders"

The base V6 Mustang has horsepower, but it's a pretty terrible about everything else. It has slow highway gearing, no recaros, 4spkr radio, no gadgets, crummy tires.
If you option up a V6 Mustang to actually compete with the level of total performance offered by the ST, you'll be pushing $30k. r. You really can't compare them outside of actual performance numbers and they are really close. The Mustang has slightly better circuit track performance while the Focus shines in tighter autocross environments. Straight line performance is nearly identical base-to-base. The Focus has just a few less ft/lb of torque than the Mustang and the Mustang has more drivetrain loss than the Focus.
IMO, the Focus ST is a much better value than the Mustang because the ST base is still a well-equipped performance car whereas the Mustang isn't a performance car until you get the optional 3.31 gears.
hmmm, everything you said is laughable at best. you do realize the hp/tq numbers you keep talking grandios about the st only happen for a total of 20 seconds in overboost. yes, thats where the 254/270 comes from and is not maintained long. sorry to deflate your ego. and it seems looking at dynos for the st it picks up about 2k and runs out of steam just before 5k every time, dyno after dyno. care to see a v6 mustang dyno up to 7k? it doesn't fall off.
on your track theory, is that your wishful thinking or do you have an actual link somewhere?
by the way, I'd also like to see where you found your info on the drivetrain loss. I would like to see how you figure one is more than the other...
And if you've ever noticed any real performance car, they aren't well equiped. as a matter of fact, they are as basic as possible to keep them light (frs, lotus elise, etc), until you get into your luxury performance (the focus is far from this class)

Of course I ordered mine and it came in at 29,070. perf pack, cloth recaros, 102a, rpa&alarm system, manual trans. with incentives and such just shy of 25k out the door. and the pirelli p zeros stick like glue.
It was special ordered with alot deleted. at 3300lbs it weighs about what your st does...

but, I'll let this go. as everyone knows, no one can talk with someone like you that makes up their own facts...
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