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Old 03-12-2013, 01:16 PM   #101
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What makes you think someone who has a diesel truck hasn't tried it? How much time do YOU have at the throttle of 20,000 to 30,000 diesel horsepower (locomotives, in multiple-unit operation)?

You still haven't provided the example. You're all hat and no cattle, it appears.

You must be buying diesel at the station of someone with OCD. The ones around here have diesel on the ground so your shoes smell like diesel. You brush against the pump, or something on the island, you smell like diesel. And no, I don't obsessively carry gloves around in a climate where it is 100 degrees and 100 percent humidity much of the year. With gasoline, you get it on your hands, you wash your hands or even just use some hand sanitizer, problem solved. With diesel, you plasti-dip yourself first, fuel up, then you might not smell like diesel when you peel off the plasti-dip. Get within 20 feet of a diesel pump, the stink beats you home to bed. I actually wait in line to use the gas-only pumps where I buy gas, because I don't want to use the smelly dual gas/diesel ones even if they're free and the gas only ones aren't. That's how much I don't like the smell of diesel.

I don't often go places hauling other people. Focuses specifically state in the owner's manual NO TRAILERS. As a matter of fact, on this very forum, is an entire thread just about the fact that you'll lose your powertrain warranty if they find trailer light harness on your car when you go to the dealership. For those that do haul 4 or 5 people (would be UNCOMFORTABLE in a focus), they're probably not going to be driving a car the size of a focus in the first place. And those larger cars come with diesel options, like all these diesel jeeps you are already driving. So what is the big deal about a diesel focus? I have offered a proof that it would save no money (which you have not refuted any more than just simply to say you hate math, probably because I used it to prove a point you don't want to hear) and I assert that it would NOT be as fun to drive (if it gets the amount of fuel economy to beat the gasser by enough to pay for the extra fuel costs, it is NOT going to be blowing the doors off of every other focus).

I repeat: Diesel Shmiesel, in a focus. Hold your breath and see what color you turn before it happens. These people know that the numbers aren't on their side in a Cost/Benefit Analysis, they're engineers, or they have them on staff. Engineers don't hate math.

EDIT: And I would also add that when I bought the F350 diesel, the cost of diesel was 10 to 20 cents a gallon less than regular gas. It made sense in a Cost/Benefit Analysis. I was willing to put up with stink to save money. I don't want to have diesel jammed down my throat because "that's what they do in Europe". If I want European lifestyles, I can go there. Been there many times, I know how to get there. Chacún a son gôut.
Your a ships captain now? What does that have to do with the automotive world? Reel yourself back onto topic.

I have provided several examples now, pay attention.

I don't brush up against pumps or anything else while I am pumping fuel, nor do I brush up against anything else, I'm pumpng fuel not taking a guided tour of the station. I have never had a issue with fuel on my shoes, I also avoid stepping in spill areas, I know better. I have an extra set of gloves that I use for working on cars that I use for filling up, they sit right next to the seat on the floor under my mag-lite, out of the way. 100F please 130F+ and you can start talking, we wore gloves and covered from head to foot to keep from gettng burned, add 15l of water, 2 MRE's 750 rounds of 5.56, 80lbs of gear and we can talk. Building ice block holders to cool intake charge lines on 350KW PPU to keep the engines from overheating while it is 120F+. Sounds like you have a PERSONAL issue with diesel fuel, which is understandable.

Towing, yes the Focus, since you cannot think of any other vehicle with a small displacement engine and is the TOPIC of this post, is not rated to tow in the US, but low and behold it is authorized to tow in every other market it is sold in. Go figure. You can even buy a FORD tow hitch and wire harness for it. Both my MKI Foci are rated to tow 1100lbs. I have hauled 4 people comfortably in my Foci, you must have some oversized associates. I'd be more than happy to show you just how fun a diesel can be to drive, just because you think it is not good does not mean you cannot have fun driving it. Take your blinders off, and look at the forest around you. There is more to the world than what is in front of you.

Like all good engineers know, theory can always be changed by practical application. Thats why long term mules are used for data collection.



Again we are talking about ALL CARS IN THIS POST not just the Focus.

EDIT: When I bought my Jeep diesel was $7.50 a gallon, driving the miles I do in a year, it was the cost effective answer. It paid off, even when it hit $9.10 a gallon. No one here is making you drink diesel, that is YOUR choice. I have been to Europe as well, lived there for 13 years, own a house there with 2 cars, a dog and a wife. Besser ist diesel, de dinken ist nicht richtig.
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Old 03-12-2013, 01:18 PM   #102
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We should just all move to Germany and drive diesel Jeep Liberties. Then and only then would the world make sense.

I'm over it.
Expected response from a narrow mind.
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Old 03-13-2013, 01:33 PM   #103
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Unless a diesel option will lower the lease price of a car in the US, diesel will never move off its sub 3% market share (currently 1%). The regular Prius moves more units than all diesel passenger cars combined.

Although the German makers offer diesels across thier product lines, most of thier volume is in gas engines, especially 2.0Ts. VW does have a higher diesel take rate than the others, but they have the most brand recognition when it comes to diesel in the US. The 1.8T gas engine they have coming next year may take some diesel sales as well.

Also, US federal regulations don't favor oil burners. CAFE, which uses the EPA test favors trucks, EVs, Plug-In Hybrids, and Hybrids. Example: for a plug in, you get a 1.6 multiplier ion that vehicle's CAFE number.
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Old 03-13-2013, 05:33 PM   #104
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J8 or JP8 is fuel used in mil-spec aircraft as well as J4

Jet-A is commercial similar to JP8

Narrow body as in 2/1 80 pax? Went Brazilian this time? Looks to be switching from GE to P&W for power as well.
76 pax actually, 2/1F, 2/2Y. The current ones are still GE-powered.
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Old 03-13-2013, 05:35 PM   #105
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Your a ships captain now? What does that have to do with the automotive world? Reel yourself back onto topic.

I have provided several examples now, pay attention.

I don't brush up against pumps or anything else while I am pumping fuel, nor do I brush up against anything else, I'm pumpng fuel not taking a guided tour of the station. I have never had a issue with fuel on my shoes, I also avoid stepping in spill areas, I know better. I have an extra set of gloves that I use for working on cars that I use for filling up, they sit right next to the seat on the floor under my mag-lite, out of the way. 100F please 130F+ and you can start talking, we wore gloves and covered from head to foot to keep from gettng burned, add 15l of water, 2 MRE's 750 rounds of 5.56, 80lbs of gear and we can talk. Building ice block holders to cool intake charge lines on 350KW PPU to keep the engines from overheating while it is 120F+. Sounds like you have a PERSONAL issue with diesel fuel, which is understandable.

Towing, yes the Focus, since you cannot think of any other vehicle with a small displacement engine and is the TOPIC of this post, is not rated to tow in the US, but low and behold it is authorized to tow in every other market it is sold in. Go figure. You can even buy a FORD tow hitch and wire harness for it. Both my MKI Foci are rated to tow 1100lbs. I have hauled 4 people comfortably in my Foci, you must have some oversized associates. I'd be more than happy to show you just how fun a diesel can be to drive, just because you think it is not good does not mean you cannot have fun driving it. Take your blinders off, and look at the forest around you. There is more to the world than what is in front of you.

Like all good engineers know, theory can always be changed by practical application. Thats why long term mules are used for data collection.



Again we are talking about ALL CARS IN THIS POST not just the Focus.

EDIT: When I bought my Jeep diesel was $7.50 a gallon, driving the miles I do in a year, it was the cost effective answer. It paid off, even when it hit $9.10 a gallon. No one here is making you drink diesel, that is YOUR choice. I have been to Europe as well, lived there for 13 years, own a house there with 2 cars, a dog and a wife. Besser ist diesel, de dinken ist nicht richtig.
If fuel hit $7.50 or $9.10, I'd probably stop driving altogether.
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Old 03-13-2013, 06:36 PM   #106
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Originally Posted by jinstall View Post
Your a ships captain now? What does that have to do with the automotive world? Reel yourself back onto topic.

I have provided several examples now, pay attention.

I don't brush up against pumps or anything else while I am pumping fuel, nor do I brush up against anything else, I'm pumpng fuel not taking a guided tour of the station. I have never had a issue with fuel on my shoes, I also avoid stepping in spill areas, I know better. I have an extra set of gloves that I use for working on cars that I use for filling up, they sit right next to the seat on the floor under my mag-lite, out of the way. 100F please 130F+ and you can start talking, we wore gloves and covered from head to foot to keep from gettng burned, add 15l of water, 2 MRE's 750 rounds of 5.56, 80lbs of gear and we can talk. Building ice block holders to cool intake charge lines on 350KW PPU to keep the engines from overheating while it is 120F+. Sounds like you have a PERSONAL issue with diesel fuel, which is understandable.

Towing, yes the Focus, since you cannot think of any other vehicle with a small displacement engine and is the TOPIC of this post, is not rated to tow in the US, but low and behold it is authorized to tow in every other market it is sold in. Go figure. You can even buy a FORD tow hitch and wire harness for it. Both my MKI Foci are rated to tow 1100lbs. I have hauled 4 people comfortably in my Foci, you must have some oversized associates. I'd be more than happy to show you just how fun a diesel can be to drive, just because you think it is not good does not mean you cannot have fun driving it. Take your blinders off, and look at the forest around you. There is more to the world than what is in front of you.

Like all good engineers know, theory can always be changed by practical application. Thats why long term mules are used for data collection.



Again we are talking about ALL CARS IN THIS POST not just the Focus.

EDIT: When I bought my Jeep diesel was $7.50 a gallon, driving the miles I do in a year, it was the cost effective answer. It paid off, even when it hit $9.10 a gallon. No one here is making you drink diesel, that is YOUR choice. I have been to Europe as well, lived there for 13 years, own a house there with 2 cars, a dog and a wife. Besser ist diesel, de dinken ist nicht richtig.
Deutsche arschlug, I never claimed to be a ship's captain, you're on crack or something.
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Old 03-13-2013, 06:43 PM   #107
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So, on an American website about Focuses, I'm off topic for talking about Focuses in America. Hard to believe, ain't it, sports fans?
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Old 03-13-2013, 08:25 PM   #108
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So, on an American website about Focuses, I'm off topic for talking about Focuses in America. Hard to believe, ain't it, sports fans?
I gotta agree with jinstall on that one. Based purely upon thread title, every Focus owner is off topic except for a couple fanboys googling over dead diesel concept cars or dreaming about USA bound diesels, whether they be mopeds, cars or lawn mowers. However I'm struggling to find anything sporty about putzmobiles.
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Old 03-14-2013, 05:50 AM   #109
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What we have here is failure to communicate...

Hey, there are a lot of pros and cons to both sides. Modern diesels are not the diesels of old, or even 10 years ago. There's world's of difference between the new Powerstroke (6.4?) and the old 6.0 or 7.3. Mercedes has been making comfortable passenger cars with diesel engines for a very long time now. These get outstanding fuel economy, and never seem to show up in the used car arena until after 300k+ miles.

At the same time, if I had the cheese to purchase a Mercedes diesel, but I purchased a new Focus instead- the Focus would cost less to drive. The comparison is completely unfair. The same goes for comparing the Cruze diesel to the VW TDI. Everything I've read indicates that the Cruze is underpowered and doesn't get very good fuel economy for what it is. I have no idea about the purchase price difference between the two would be- but that's something to consider.

You're not going to find a diesel for less than $25k new, so that price range is definitely in competition with hybrid vehicles. Then it's all about how you drive when you drive. Hybrids would be cheaper around town, and diesels would likely be cheaper on highway trips. Diesels do tend to have more oil in the crankcase than a similar gasoline engine, however, depending on the maker of the engine, you can go much further without an oil change. Diesels don't operate at high temperatures like gasoline engines do, and don't break down oil the same way. Diesels do make oil dirty- some are worse than others. Cummins was bragging about new valve seals that allowed the big 6 to go for 15k miles between oil changes. New Fords have an "oil life computer" that monitors the exhaust and tells the owner when to change oil. A quick visit through some forums tells that the most anyone has seen oil last when changing by the light is about 8k miles. If Cummins is to be believed- Ford needs to get on the ball before they come to the market with a diesel that has gasoline engine oil change intervals. For my personal driving, I'd probably be better suited to a hybrid, and that's what led me to bring up the defunct PNGV program which used diesel-electric hybrids. Series type hybrids seem better suited for diesel engines, but nobody makes one except the Volt. That being said, if you want value for your dollar, the hybrid is the way to go. Nobody is making a profit on a hybrid. Really, if you want to stick it to GM or Ford, buy a hybrid.

It could be worse really. Look at all the 3 wheel car failures recently. Even the outstanding implementation of a gyroscope balancer in a 2 wheel enclosed motorcycle was not much more than an expensive science project. What baffles me is why none of these decided to just be kit car manufacturers. I don't think it's possible for any company to be like Ford in 1910, or whenever the "T" plant was built.

Damn... I'm going to be late for work again fiddling around on here- LOL.
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Old 03-14-2013, 01:56 PM   #110
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I gotta agree with jinstall on that one. Based purely upon thread title, every Focus owner is off topic except for a couple fanboys googling over dead diesel concept cars or dreaming about USA bound diesels, whether they be mopeds, cars or lawn mowers. However I'm struggling to find anything sporty about putzmobiles.
I agree with you there, dieselheads will buy their oilburners no matter what.
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