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Old 02-04-2013, 07:51 PM   #31
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There's a few too many manufacturers putting in M1 5W-30 at the factory for me to believe that it's shearing to the point of engine damage. While I don't dispute that it shears, I do dispute that it's killed any engines.
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Old 02-04-2013, 08:14 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cbdallas View Post
There's a few too many manufacturers putting in M1 5W-30 at the factory for me to believe that it's shearing to the point of engine damage. While I don't dispute that it shears, I do dispute that it's killed any engines.
If you know something breaks down prematurely, why run the risk? Do you also take expired medication? Some engines are more sensitive to it than others, like a flat four, but the Subaru forums have noted many cases of spun bearings with cars on Mobil1 5w30 and the oil analyses to prove it. The ST is still unknown territory, but why not try something that has been proven both on and off the track. Plenty of data shows it holds up well. Some people just get very defensive when new-to-them information surfaces.
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Old 02-05-2013, 06:37 AM   #33
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I know you know this, but comparing M1 5-30 to Rotella 5-40 is apples to oranges. The Rotella is all around thicker oil. In a stock short block equipped car, the only thing the Rotella is going to do is cause extra parasitic losses and if something happens with it in the engine, possibly void warranty due to (please note the sarcasm, because I hate dealerships too) excessive oil pump stress, lowering oil flow and increasing system pressure. (end sarcasm) A built short block done the right way will have the intended oil thickness and intent of use in mind when being built, and the builder, if they are worth their salt, will build this a little on the loose side so that the oil pressure isn't too high from tight clearances when using high viscosity oils.

Additionally, there are many other factors than just minor oil quality differences that can cause a spun bearing. The extra shock load on a bearing due to detonation, overrevs, or even extremely high power on an engine not built for such, such as a little extra rod bearing clearance to allow for a thicker oil film protecting the rod bearing from the forces beating on it.

In short, on an engine with bolt-ons and a tune, the change from 5-20 to 5-30 may be a good idea for peace of mind. DEFINITELY install a real oil pressure gauge and get the real story. If the oil you put in pushes oil pressure too high, it can be just as bad as too little oil pressure.
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:47 AM   #34
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I have used mobil 1 on every car i have owned and have had nothing but good luck

1992 Oldsmobile cutlass supreme = sold at 195,000 miles, still running strong without any issues

2001 Focus SE Sport = sold at 145,000 miles, still running strong without any issues

2005 Saleen focus = sold at 120,000 miles, still running strong without any issues

2013 Focus ST = Running Mobil 1 currently and dont plan on switching

Is Mobil 1 the best oil available? probably not, Amsoil and Royal purple may be better but i dont know. But cost per performance wise its a great oil. Every mechanic friend i know uses Mobil 1 in his personal car and tells me to use it as well. Every mechanic also tells me to stay away from Penzoil products. Are they bad? i dont know ive heard of buildup issues from it but i personally dont know for sure.

What i do know is that mobil 1 is a good oil and obviously doesn't ruin engines due to my own experience. And i was never nice to any of my cars. I took care of them, but i ran several of them very VERY hard.
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Old 02-05-2013, 12:45 PM   #35
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I can say this , I use M1 in ALL my turbo builds from 200HP to over 700HP nd have had no issues

We built roughly 35-40 race engines a year for dirt track and road racing among other engines for other forms of racing (dozens of engines yearly for race app) , Our customers have less issues with M1 then the brands they use to run and have engine failures , Till I have issues / engine failure from M1 I will be sticking with it ,

I use it in every Focus engine and trans I build and thats a lot , 10 years of building the Focus engine boosted and NA , find some one with an engine failure ???

Tom
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:19 PM   #36
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Ford designed and built the engine to run on Motorcraft 5w30 with a motorcraft filter. The people who warranty and know more about the engine than anybody should know best...The Variable Cam Timing Actuators are very susceptible to damage with anything than what is recommended. The VCT's have failed over and over in the 04-up F-150 5.4L with wrong oil and filter. Stay away from anything that says Penzoil on the bottle or Fram oil Filters for that matter.
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:48 PM   #37
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Kind of a cop out. Ford also designed the car with a paper air filter and a squishy motor mount... to say no oil is better than motor craft for the car is silly. Cost always factors into car design. But I agree on a big no to penzoil
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:50 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slo86GT View Post
I know you know this, but comparing M1 5-30 to Rotella 5-40 is apples to oranges. The Rotella is all around thicker oil. In a stock short block equipped car, the only thing the Rotella is going to do is cause extra parasitic losses and if something happens with it in the engine, possibly void warranty due to (please note the sarcasm, because I hate dealerships too) excessive oil pump stress, lowering oil flow and increasing system pressure. (end sarcasm) A built short block done the right way will have the intended oil thickness and intent of use in mind when being built, and the builder, if they are worth their salt, will build this a little on the loose side so that the oil pressure isn't too high from tight clearances when using high viscosity oils.

Additionally, there are many other factors than just minor oil quality differences that can cause a spun bearing. The extra shock load on a bearing due to detonation, overrevs, or even extremely high power on an engine not built for such, such as a little extra rod bearing clearance to allow for a thicker oil film protecting the rod bearing from the forces beating on it.

In short, on an engine with bolt-ons and a tune, the change from 5-20 to 5-30 may be a good idea for peace of mind. DEFINITELY install a real oil pressure gauge and get the real story. If the oil you put in pushes oil pressure too high, it can be just as bad as too little oil pressure.
I'll agree with you to an extent. Not sure about parasitic losses with Rotella. As far as the MS3/EVO/STI community is concerned with the Mobil1 5w30, it has happened on a multitude on different cars. Some absolutely stock daily drivers, some lightly modded, some heavily modded, etc. All experienced same failures due to thinner oil.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chaz493 View Post
I have used mobil 1 on every car i have owned and have had nothing but good luck

1992 Oldsmobile cutlass supreme = sold at 195,000 miles, still running strong without any issues

2001 Focus SE Sport = sold at 145,000 miles, still running strong without any issues

2005 Saleen focus = sold at 120,000 miles, still running strong without any issues

2013 Focus ST = Running Mobil 1 currently and dont plan on switching

Is Mobil 1 the best oil available? probably not, Amsoil and Royal purple may be better but i dont know. But cost per performance wise its a great oil. Every mechanic friend i know uses Mobil 1 in his personal car and tells me to use it as well. Every mechanic also tells me to stay away from Penzoil products. Are they bad? i dont know ive heard of buildup issues from it but i personally dont know for sure.

What i do know is that mobil 1 is a good oil and obviously doesn't ruin engines due to my own experience. And i was never nice to any of my cars. I took care of them, but i ran several of them very VERY hard.
I'm talking about turbo only vehicles. Ignore anything non-turbo. Also, I know plenty of stupid mechanics who are full of myths and rumors, and have never taken a physics or engineering course in their life.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1turbofocus View Post
I can say this , I use M1 in ALL my turbo builds from 200HP to over 700HP nd have had no issues

We built roughly 35-40 race engines a year for dirt track and road racing among other engines for other forms of racing (dozens of engines yearly for race app) , Our customers have less issues with M1 then the brands they use to run and have engine failures , Till I have issues / engine failure from M1 I will be sticking with it ,

I use it in every Focus engine and trans I build and thats a lot , 10 years of building the Focus engine boosted and NA , find some one with an engine failure ???

Tom
Tom, I'm talking about the Mobil1 in 5w30 in a turbo car. Not Mobil1 in general. I don't believe that you run Mobil1 5w30 in all of those vehicles.


Quote:
Originally Posted by gzfocus View Post
Ford designed and built the engine to run on Motorcraft 5w30 with a motorcraft filter. The people who warranty and know more about the engine than anybody should know best...The Variable Cam Timing Actuators are very susceptible to damage with anything than what is recommended. The VCT's have failed over and over in the 04-up F-150 5.4L with wrong oil and filter. Stay away from anything that says Penzoil on the bottle or Fram oil Filters for that matter.
I have 0 issues with motorcraft, it is better than the mobil1 and cheaper. Not sure what issues people have been having with pennzoil platinum 5w30, but it has had better numbers via oil analysis than mobil1 5w30 in the vehicles I am talking about.


Again, I enjoy talking the subject, but data is ultimately necessary. I am the only one here with data to back my specific claim.
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Old 02-05-2013, 11:19 PM   #39
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All I know is in all of the many oil analysts we have sent to blackstone through our shop over the years motorcraft and mobil 1 performed with very high marks time and time again.
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Old 02-06-2013, 10:57 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gzfocus View Post
Stay away from anything that says Penzoil on the bottle or Fram oil Filters for that matter.
Since you test your oil, I'm curious about any facts you have behind this statement about Pennzoil. I've seen the evidence about Fram, but I've seen nothing but excellent UOAs from Pennzoil Platinum and consistenly get good recommendations about Ultra in regard to D.I. engines. I know that Pennzoil yellow-bottle garnered itself a bad reputation for sludge in the 80s, but I'm pretty sure they (and everyone else) has gone through a complete product overhaul since then.

What do you know that you can share with the board?

Last edited by cbdallas; 02-07-2013 at 07:39 AM.
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