Transmission/Clutch Slipping (OBD2 Plots)

[raptor1956]

If it were software alone then why is my car fine -- no problems?

I'm not saying software isn't playing a role, but if you and I are running the same software then why should we have a different experience?

It seems to me that leaky seals are the root cause of most of the transmission (DCT) issues and that, perhaps, the software doesn't handle the unexpected conditions well. If leaky seals have hosed up the clutches they may slip at times the software is expecting no slippage.

So, if, like me, the clutches are fine then the software is fine...


Brian

[PratoN]

Originally Posted by raptor1956

If it were software alone then why is my car fine -- no problems?

I'm not saying software isn't playing a role, but if you and I are running the same software then why should we have a different experience?

It seems to me that leaky seals are the root cause of most of the transmission (DCT) issues and that, perhaps, the software doesn't handle the unexpected conditions well. If leaky seals have hosed up the clutches they may slip at times the software is expecting no slippage.

So, if, like me, the clutches are fine then the software is fine...

I agree. I think the software has a pre-determined criteria for slippage (Who knows what it is? rotational speed, torque, etc.)

Say for this example it is RPM and the range is 700-1300 RPM. If the car starts slipping at 1400 RPM because of seals leaking oil onto the plates, the car doesn't really know what to do since the RPM criteria is already saturated. Chances are the engineers didn't expect to see slippage at this speed (remember, this is just my made up example).

But if that's really the case, you'd think a drivetrain malfunction message would come up or something!

[raptor1956]

Originally Posted by PratoN

I agree. I think the software has a pre-determined criteria for slippage (Who knows what it is? rotational speed, torque, etc.)

Say for this example it is RPM and the range is 700-1300 RPM. If the car starts slipping at 1400 RPM because of seals leaking oil onto the plates, the car doesn't really know what to do since the RPM criteria is already saturated. Chances are the engineers didn't expect to see slippage at this speed (remember, this is just my made up example).

But if that's really the case, you'd think a drivetrain malfunction message would come up or something!

Yes, exactly, if there is slippage when not expected or if the slippage is greater (or less) than some range it should indicate an error. It may be that Ford is trying to dodge fixing the problems and have chosen to prevent such messages as that would drive service calls. I'm not saying this is for sure the case, but it would not surprise me...


Brian

[Borko]

I have a similar issue. when I'm accelerating changing from 4th to 5th i can easy notice that my clutch slipps. The transmission behaves exactly like if it was manual and I'm changing the gear with slow clutch. Also if I drive in manual mode on 5th gear let's say and if a take off my food and after that when I step on the gaz pedal, the RPMs go up and down exactly if I was releasing the cluch slow. So it is really hard to convince the dealership that this is a good reason to take a look at my car. So I'm still fighting. Last time the technician just made a cirle in the quarter and didn't feel anything. After all my explonation that this happens on higher gear.

I'll try to make a video to share it with you guys. But I think that it is the sowtware anyway. Because even if it is the same for everybody, it is kind of learning soft and you never know how it changes with the time.

[FordCustomerService]

Originally Posted by Borko

I have a similar issue. when I'm accelerating changing from 4th to 5th i can easy notice that my clutch slipps. The transmission behaves exactly like if it was manual and I'm changing the gear with slow clutch. Also if I drive in manual mode on 5th gear let's say and if a take off my food and after that when I step on the gaz pedal, the RPMs go up and down exactly if I was releasing the cluch slow. So it is really hard to convince the dealership that this is a good reason to take a look at my car...

Hi Borko,

I wanted to reach out and see how things are going with your Focus. If you haven't already, I recommend reaching out to my colleagues at Ford Canada. Give them a call at 1-800-565-3673; they'll be happy to help!

Crystal

[Borko]

Thanks a lot :) I'm going to do it.

[PratoN]

One of my coworkers is letting me use his scanner (with a built in plotter) this weekend, sooo.... I guess I'll have some more data to add.

In addition, if my transmission input shaft speed is fluctuating more than 250RPM between peaks and valleys, I'll have some concrete evidence to show the dealer to perform TSB 13-4-5 when I do take it in.

[TiPilot]

I had a rental 2013 SE hatch earlier this week - compared to my 2012 Ti, it shifted noticeably harsher, maybe quicker.

Not sure what all the technical differences are (if any?) between the models, but it was the first thing I noticed when I started driving it.

[PratoN]

Just thought I'd let you guys know that the tool I used to monitor my transmission input shaft speed must not update/refresh fast enough because I wasn't able to get a clear plot of the shudder.

[raptor1956]

Originally Posted by PratoN

Just thought I'd let you guys know that the tool I used to monitor my transmission input shaft speed must not update/refresh fast enough because I wasn't able to get a clear plot of the shudder.

I think the shudder problem between gears is likely to be bad timing of the handoff between the two clutches. If this is the case it could be the mechanical linkage in the actuators is bent/too-long/too-short/etc so that this messes with the timing of the handoff.

What would be nice is a user set of timing offsets to adjust things. I have to believe Ford engineering has such tools and it may well be they know what the problem is and have decided to do nothing to fix it.


Brian