My Oil Change Interval Debate Rant

[TboneZX3]

Originally Posted by Elizabeth

So.. has ANYONE ever seen all sorts of reports from Corvette owners (who start with Mobil One OEM) about how Mobil One screwed them due to the high NOACK??(( Mobil One DOES mention it's NOACK level if you search the fine print, and they comment it is 11% 12% range))

Corvette engines and other port-injected engines aren't as subject to valve deposits from oil vaporization (volatility) like direct-injection engines such as in the Focus are, so I'm not sure how relevant that argument is.

At least the "super best motor oil in the world" freaks are mostly presenting good information in this thread, rather than ranting.

[dan50]

Originally Posted by Elizabeth

I will just comment that the very low NOACK is just a 'selling' note.
The one company which has a very low "XXX" makes it a big deal for folks who love to spout statistics to others about stuff which really does not mean shit.
Sorry but it is true.

So the 'golden wonder oil" has an ultralow NOACK, at 5/6% vs Mobil One with 11%. So.. has ANYONE ever seen all sorts of reports from Corvette owners (who start with Mobil One OEM) about how Mobil One screwed them due to the high NOACK??(( Mobil One DOES mention it's NOACK level if you search the fine print, and they comment it is 11% 12% range))

NO. Because it is a red herring. it may have SOME meaning, but no where near being as important as the 'super best motor oil in the world" freaks want it to be.

Just me ranting. Do not worry super oil freaks, I am CERTAIN your oil IS better..

I am only putting on about 5,000 miles total this years. 95% of that is city short freeway trips. So irregardless of mileage, i will change the oil at one year.
I had already changed it at 1,000 mi, and again at 2,000 due to nOT being able to get the OEM filter off at 1,000mi.
So probably in October i will change my oil (Mobil One 0-W20) and the OEM Motorcraft filter.

You could be right. On the other hand, Corvette engines don't have direct injection, which is where low-Noack oils may be attractive.

[Elizabeth]

When my engine and all the hundreds of thousands of other direct injection engines all fail due to problems with these 'high' NOACK oils.. I will be the first in line to apoligize. Untill then i am still laughing...
And ranting...

[cbdallas]

While the issue of NOACK can be of some concern to owners of D.I. vehicles, there are other ways around it. While it is a higher one-time investment, it can save you money in the long term versus paying for expensive boutique oils with low NOACK numbers. It's called a catch can.

The oily & corroded intake valve horror stories started at Audi and has since filtered its way down to Mazda & GM owners, and I'm sure Fords will now suddenly become afflicted with it now that D.I is becoming mainstream in their vehicle lines.

I guess I'd just prefer to stop the problem upstream (PVC system) rather than try to fix it with oil that doesn't evaporate as much (but still evaporates to some degree). Catch can usage is rampant in the Mazdaspeed community, and they're even catching on with Hyundai 2.0T owners now that that engine is growing in numbers in the enthusiast groups.

I rather spend my oil dollars on oil that concentrates on its most important jobs...lubricating, cleaning and cooling. Amsoil seems to have a handle on all these attributes, PLUS NOACK, but it's not as readily available to me as Mobil1 or Pennzoil Platinum, and it's pretty pricy if I'm to include "preferred customer" membership dues, shipping, or the gas it costs me to go pick it up 40+ miles away. If there was an Amsoil store down the street from me, I might be inclined to buy it, but there IS a WalMart just down the street, so my choice is simple. In addition, I can't use Amsoil in my Camaro until it attains a DEXOS certification, which I won't hold my breath for. So, "Candy" will have to make do with Mobil1, & possibly a catch can down the road.

[TboneZX3]

Originally Posted by Elizabeth

When my engine and all the hundreds of thousands of other direct injection engines all fail due to problems with these 'high' NOACK oils.. I will be the first in line to apoligize. Untill then i am still laughing...
And ranting...

I doubt any oil that meets Ford's specification will cause those engines to fail. Yet, you must be putting faith into Mobil 1 over the cheaper Motorcraft oil for some reason. Is it for better protection, perhaps? If not for specs like better NOACK, what is it specifically that you feel is better about the Mobil 1 product? Could it be that an oil that has better specs than Mobil 1 actually protect your engine better than Mobil 1?

If we didn't have specs like NOACK, how would we know what oils out-perform others?

[BiggerBoat]

Originally Posted by Elizabeth

When my engine and all the hundreds of thousands of other direct injection engines all fail due to problems with these 'high' NOACK oils.. I will be the first in line to apoligize. Untill then i am still laughing...
And ranting...

Nobody said anybody's engine was going to fail. We are looking for ways to keep it free of deposits and minimize friction which equals less wear and greater efficiency, l. (You know... horsepower and MPG!! at max even after 100K.) I know you are an MPG hound so I am surprised you are not getting the motivation here.
I'm not looking to break the bank on an oil change or waste money but if I can accomplish a small improvement for $10 more on an oil change which is only twice a year, I'm gonna do it. The Focus is not the cheapest car on the market so it's inconsistent to say its spending 'too much'. If $20 more a year is too much you should have bought an Elantra or a Corolla.

Originally Posted by cbdallas

I rather spend my oil dollars on oil that concentrates on its most important jobs...lubricating, cleaning and cooling. Amsoil seems to have a handle on all these attributes, PLUS NOACK, but it's not as readily available to me as Mobil1 or Pennzoil Platinum, and it's pretty pricy if I'm to include "preferred customer" membership dues, shipping, or the gas it costs me to go pick it up 40+ miles away. If there was an Amsoil store down the street from me, I might be inclined to buy it, but there IS a WalMart just down the street.......

This is my frustration too. The shipping cost and inconvenience of acquiring Amsoil. If it was on the shelf at any local store for the same price they list on the Web site, I would buy it every time even though it's significantly more money. I don't know why Amsoil doesn't realize this of buyers.

[cbdallas]

The illusion of exclusivity & the intrinsic value (translation: $$$) it adds. Of course they don't want their oil sold at a discount retailer...their margins would go down when they were forced to discount it.

There once was a motorcycle shop just down the road that Amsoil MC oils at a very good price, and I figured he'd probably be able to order in some car oil for me, but then they went out of business. Just not meant to be!

Fortunately I do have a local source for Redline, although it's pretty pricy too. Their 5W-30 has a NOACK of 6, 5W-20 is 8.

[Elizabeth]

The Mobil One 0-W20 promises around 2% greater fuel efficiency just for using that oil. (over 5-W20 Mobil One)

[UnleashedBeast]

Originally Posted by Elizabeth

I will just comment that the very low NOACK is just a 'selling' note.
The one company which has a very low "XXX" makes it a big deal for folks who love to spout statistics to others about stuff which really does not mean shit.
Sorry but it is true.

So the 'golden wonder oil" has an ultralow NOACK, at 5/6% vs Mobil One with 11%. So.. has ANYONE ever seen all sorts of reports from Corvette owners (who start with Mobil One OEM) about how Mobil One screwed them due to the high NOACK??(( Mobil One DOES mention it's NOACK level if you search the fine print, and they comment it is 11% 12% range))

NO. Because it is a red herring. it may have SOME meaning, but no where near being as important as the 'super best motor oil in the world" freaks want it to be.

If you have never removed an intake manifold from a 1997+ LS1, LS2, LS3, or LS6 engine that was using ANY high NOACK lubricant which was "supposedly" a true synthetic, you would know the difference. I sure have, and it isn't pretty with the heavy deposits present.

Also, please provide a link to this "fine print". This I have to see.

Originally Posted by cbdallas

The illusion of exclusivity & the intrinsic value (translation: $$$) it adds. Of course they don't want their oil sold at a discount retailer...their margins would go down when they were forced to discount it.

There once was a motorcycle shop just down the road that Amsoil MC oils at a very good price, and I figured he'd probably be able to order in some car oil for me, but then they went out of business. Just not meant to be!

Fortunately I do have a local source for Redline, although it's pretty pricy too. Their 5W-30 has a NOACK of 6, 5W-20 is 8.

No matter how, where, or the method Amsoil is sold, everyone has the ability to buy Amsoil @ dealer/wholesale cost using one simple link.

Preferred Customer

Originally Posted by BiggerBoat

This is my frustration too. The shipping cost and inconvenience of acquiring Amsoil. If it was on the shelf at any local store for the same price they list on the Web site, I would buy it every time even though it's significantly more money. I don't know why Amsoil doesn't realize this of buyers.

If you would do as Amsoil intended everyone to do, use Signature Series only changing your oil once a year....it would be cheaper than buying off the shelf.

Amsoil isn't mainstream in Wal Mart because the owner of the company is loyal to his dealer network.

[dan50]

Originally Posted by cbdallas

While the issue of NOACK can be of some concern to owners of D.I. vehicles, there are other ways around it. While it is a higher one-time investment, it can save you money in the long term versus paying for expensive boutique oils with low NOACK numbers. It's called a catch can.

The oily & corroded intake valve horror stories started at Audi and has since filtered its way down to Mazda & GM owners, and I'm sure Fords will now suddenly become afflicted with it now that D.I is becoming mainstream in their vehicle lines.

I guess I'd just prefer to stop the problem upstream (PVC system) rather than try to fix it with oil that doesn't evaporate as much (but still evaporates to some degree). Catch can usage is rampant in the Mazdaspeed community, and they're even catching on with Hyundai 2.0T owners now that that engine is growing in numbers in the enthusiast groups.

I rather spend my oil dollars on oil that concentrates on its most important jobs...lubricating, cleaning and cooling. Amsoil seems to have a handle on all these attributes, PLUS NOACK, but it's not as readily available to me as Mobil1 or Pennzoil Platinum, and it's pretty pricy if I'm to include "preferred customer" membership dues, shipping, or the gas it costs me to go pick it up 40+ miles away. If there was an Amsoil store down the street from me, I might be inclined to buy it, but there IS a WalMart just down the street, so my choice is simple. In addition, I can't use Amsoil in my Camaro until it attains a DEXOS certification, which I won't hold my breath for. So, "Candy" will have to make do with Mobil1, & possibly a catch can down the road.

Not saying it isn't a fine lubricant, but Amsoil's top-of-the-line "Signature Series" (the one with low Noack and such) is not API "SN" certified. Amsoil points out reasons this is so but does have a proecudure for dealing with cases where warranty coverage is denied because of the lack of certification. So I guess it happens.

While it sure isn't likely to be a problem, I guess I would prefer to keep my life simpler and avoid it, at least during the warranty period.