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Old 07-02-2013, 10:58 PM   #1001
AZfocus2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by riparke View Post
Changes in Gasoline IV - The Auto Technician's Guide to Spark Ignition Engine Fuel Quality

Production of this manual has been funded through an educational grant from the Renewable Fuels Foundation

that's like the tobacco industry talking about the health effects of smoking.
I agree 100%, and I ain't gonna read any article by the renewable fuels lobby. Especially if it tries to tell me there is any benefit to E10. My own experience in multiple vehicles tells me E10 is nothing but ethanol contaminated fuel, period. E85 is a whole other story, and I have no problem with E85 and flex fuel vehicles.
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Old 07-03-2013, 08:51 AM   #1002
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Originally Posted by AZfocus2012 View Post
I agree 100%, and I ain't gonna read any article by the renewable fuels lobby. Especially if it tries to tell me there is any benefit to E10. My own experience in multiple vehicles tells me E10 is nothing but ethanol contaminated fuel, period. E85 is a whole other story, and I have no problem with E85 and flex fuel vehicles.
Guess what? Before I read the paper, I didn't think ethanol should be put in fuel either. Then I read the paper, and I STILL don't think ethanol should be put in fuel.

I recommended the paper because it has a lot of good technical information on topics like:

- What additives are used in gasoline
- How different additive mix ratios affect the available energy in the fuel
- Where the octane rating on the gas pumps comes from and how it's measured
- Why fuel mixes are different between summer and winter and different altitudes and how that affects available energy and thus fuel mileage
- The relationship between compression ratio and octane rating and how some engines are more flexible with modern technology.

Which is basically what we've all been talking about for this entire thread.

It also has background on the history of gas and engine technology and the history of legislation that led us to required fuel and technology on cars today, which is good to know so that you understand why things are the way they are. It doesn't mean that they should be like that, but how are you going to change things you don't understand? I mean come on do you want to complain about E10 on the internet all day or learn why we use it so you can debate against its use with facts and knowledge if the opportunity arises?

I realize that it's funded by the renewable fuels foundation and obviously they're a fan of ethanol, but it's the most comprehensive write-up on modern fuel and engine technology that I've found yet. If a person has one opinion that you don't like, do you really completely dismiss everything they have to say from then on? If you have a technical paper that you feel is better or shows more sides to the ethanol debate, I would genuinely like to read it because it's a very interesting topic to me.
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Old 07-03-2013, 11:29 AM   #1003
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Originally Posted by frinesi2 View Post
I recommended the paper because it has a lot of good technical information on topics like:

- What additives are used in gasoline
- How different additive mix ratios affect the available energy in the fuel
- Where the octane rating on the gas pumps comes from and how it's measured
- Why fuel mixes are different between summer and winter and different altitudes and how that affects available energy and thus fuel mileage
- The relationship between compression ratio and octane rating and how some engines are more flexible with modern technology.
I read the paper before and these are the exact points I found interesting myself. However... I don't believe the topic debate is about whether we should be using E10 or E0 or E85 or E(w/e). As far as I know, we've been chiming in on what type of results we've been getting and whether it's worth the $$$ using one type of fuel over the other in OUR cars.

Right now I'm running 87 E10 with Injected's 87 tune... And not only am I getting better throttle response, so far I'm getting similar results to that of 91 E0 I'm going to run about 4 or 5 more tanks and see what I net, and then switch over to a different tune (hopefully 91 tune) with 91 E0.
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Old 07-08-2013, 04:23 PM   #1004
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So I haven't followed this topic recently. However with the recent upgrade to the Road Trip app it now charts mpg vs fuel type. I did note that on a particular tank of gas I did see a better average mpg and the engine seemed to run smoother.

I have gone the following amount of miles on each grade:

regular - 15,267
midgrade - 4,821
premium - 1,306

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Old 07-10-2013, 03:43 PM   #1005
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I have just under 29,000 miles on my focus and have put premium in the gas tank for the first time on my past 3 fill ups and I have definitely noticed that when I accelerate it is much smoother than with regular and I'm running 91 not 93. I'd like to say that I noticed an increase in mpg but I only notice the increase when I reset the mpg counter on the freeway way. I haven't really noticed better mpgs on the street but it might be because the increased performance has made my lead foot even heavier


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Old 07-10-2013, 04:44 PM   #1006
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Thanks twitchboy. I was wondering if 91 would really make a difference. I'm gonna try it now...
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Old 07-10-2013, 09:13 PM   #1007
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I had a 2008 Lexus. I cringed when I saw morons putting 87 oct in there. The difference was like $3.00 a tank full. Those cars are tuned for premium. . I use regular in my Ford for about 10 tanks and switched to premium and haven't looked back. The car is more responsive and I get around 28 MPG. I am a lead foot. So I am a big proponent on premium for this car. I also ave a mint 2001 Taurus SES tHat just clicked at 60,000 miles a few days ago. And a 2003 MPV with 75,000 both purr and USE regular. Bth suck down gas like a sieve lol. My experience is real world. The bottom line if the car is tuned for reg use reg it will not make any difference using premium. I only use premium in the focus because the manual says it can and I see the difference It must be able to adjust to both grades.
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Old 07-11-2013, 08:14 AM   #1008
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I just put in my third tank and I'm not sure I've noticed any difference in performance but Im sure its probably there. I hadn't really had the car long enough to establish any baseline before I started using premium though. I also haven't noticed a difference in mileage either but the cars still breaking in and frankly I didn't really expect a difference anyway. It is like a difference of maybe 5 bucks a tank though so yeah really why not do it it sure can't hurt.....
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Old 07-11-2013, 08:40 AM   #1009
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I was a skeptic on this subject but have been converted. The car certainly runs better on premium with less bogging, surging, stumbling (still present, though) and making the same 375 highway trip repeatedly I do notice a 2 mpg or so improvement. Of course there are lots of variables effecting mileage and my sample size is small, but I've bought-in. The improved mileage doesn't offset the added cost of the gas, but when added to the better driveability it seems worthwhile to me.
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Old 07-11-2013, 09:25 AM   #1010
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+1 I did not notice any gas mileage improvement, just performance. The tiny engine does have a little more pep in its step. What Dan has mentioned.
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