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Old 11-09-2011, 03:18 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by lscrx View Post
The powerband of a supercharged car is more linear, so at lower rpms it makes more torque than a comparable turbocharged car. That doesn't mean that a supercharger is "better", but to ME it sees better for a daily driver/auto-x car.

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Hmm...check this dyno...it's a stock RS MK2 Focus....turbocharged..starting making boost at 1600 rpm. AT 2000 it has 206 lb-ft at 2770 maximum of 350 lb-ft is produced.....which SC can do that ? ;-) Im doing autox with procharger, my friend with powerworks and it ain't easy to keep up with turbo cars....for bottom tq is TDI the best...you should see what one highly modified 330d can do ;-)
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Old 11-09-2011, 06:19 AM   #22
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I am not saying that superchargers are better than turbochargers! They are different, with different power curves... i've had multiple turbo cars, i am familiar with their powerbands.

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Old 11-09-2011, 07:32 AM   #23
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You also made a false statement, though. You said a supercharged car "at lower rpms it makes more torque than a comparable turbocharged car." He just posted a dyno showing the opposite. That's what I've been trying to say the whole time.
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Old 11-09-2011, 10:55 AM   #24
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You're joking, right? Mazdaspeed3 on stock turbo @ 23psi running e85 makes 415 ft-lbs at the wheels (not my car, but a guy I know). That will shit on any supercharger power curve for a 4 cyl, but whatever.

My 50 trim is pretty responsive and makes plenty of torque from 3k up.
lol cool story?

That's exactly what I'm saying, from 3k up. That's where the focus power band already is, where the focus needs help is the lower power band which will be most helped by a supercharger, not a turbo. It's a common fact. I'm not stating that either one is better, but in my opinion the 2012 focus will be more rounded out with a supercharger because the power band will be more willing to give you power all throughout your rpms...


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You said a supercharged car "at lower rpms it makes more torque than a comparable turbocharged car." He just posted a dyno showing the opposite. That's what I've been trying to say the whole time.
You have to get into a deeper point about this. Centrifugal superchargers won't make very good power until 3k. Twin screw superchargers will. There are also many other reasons why superchargers like a twin screw are advantageous. Like how they have very little moving parts compared to a turbo, the screws don't actually touch so there is not much wear, very little heat which means no need for an intercooler. The disadvantage is they are still running during cruising, decelerating etc, but they've gotten pretty good at still getting good gas mileage.
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Old 11-09-2011, 11:50 AM   #25
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There are also many other reasons why superchargers like a twin screw are advantageous. Like how they have very little moving parts compared to a turbo, the screws don't actually touch so there is not much wear, very little heat which means no need for an intercooler. The disadvantage is they are still running during cruising, decelerating etc, but they've gotten pretty good at still getting good gas mileage.
??? Twin Screw who here has seen any twin screws for the focus?

kennebell back in 04 said they were making one but they never did.

You can bet your ass the rouscharger isnt twin scroll.

Superchargers are in no way ever going to be advantageous to a turbo. Coming from the guy that has the best supercharger on the market for his zetec and ended up going turbo... Small turbos spool and make better power faster then a supercharger because I have yet to see a 400whp supercharged root style blower because their not capable. IJS A comparable small turbo with a max 275-300whp will spool at 2000 or less.. I know what kind of heat I saw from 5000-7000 rpm. 200+ degrees compared to a turbo being only a couple over ambient.. How can you compare?
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Old 11-09-2011, 02:14 PM   #26
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??? Twin Screw who here has seen any twin screws for the focus?

kennebell back in 04 said they were making one but they never did.

You can bet your ass the rouscharger isnt twin scroll.

Superchargers are in no way ever going to be advantageous to a turbo. Coming from the guy that has the best supercharger on the market for his zetec and ended up going turbo... Small turbos spool and make better power faster then a supercharger because I have yet to see a 400whp supercharged root style blower because their not capable. IJS A comparable small turbo with a max 275-300whp will spool at 2000 or less.. I know what kind of heat I saw from 5000-7000 rpm. 200+ degrees compared to a turbo being only a couple over ambient.. How can you compare?
You do realize that not everyone is trying to have 300, 400, 500 horsepower, right? To me, there's really no point to it, because I don't go to tracks or 1/4miles to actually put it down. Plus that much horsepower in a front wheel drive car is just dumb IMO, torque steer will kill you and it just makes it annoying. We're talking about an econobox that needs some low rpm power. Yes, you could use a small turbo. However, turbos you're going to have to drop in into the exhaust, then you also have to get an intercooler, and you gotta tap the feed for oil etc. etc. Turbos are more work. Plus, you can add an intercooler with your supercharged setup if you're using a roots charger which is notorious for making heat...

If turbos were far superior then people would stop making superchargers, yet they still sell. People have different needs and wants, so a turbo works for you but maybe not other people, so what's it to you?
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Old 11-09-2011, 07:12 PM   #27
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You're wasting you breath with this argument. Some people just jump on the Turbo bandwagon and never venture off it.

I had a jrsc'd SVT and now drive a turbo'd Subaru. They each have their qualities and there are times that I miss my supercharger for various reasons.

One thing is for sure, and many turbo folks agree, NOTHING sounds as cool as a roots blower.

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Old 11-09-2011, 07:17 PM   #28
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One thing is for sure, and many turbo folks agree, NOTHING sounds as cool as a roots blower.
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You hit the nail on the head with that quote!
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Old 11-09-2011, 10:35 PM   #29
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You're wasting you breath with this argument. Some people just jump on the Turbo bandwagon and never venture off it.
Turbo bandwagon? ROR

I drove in my friend's pullied/header MINI Cooper S and was like "Uhhhh, cool, I guess..."

I got my MS3, punched it for the first time in 2nd gear, lit the hell out of the tires with a huge grin on my face, and wasn't even tuned yet. But yeah, you're right, it's a bandwagon...
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Old 11-09-2011, 11:30 PM   #30
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Just from my experience


Top fuel dragsters are Supercharged, not turbo'ed. Apparently the right setup from a supercharger makes more power sooner, and a more linear powerband.


Thats an entirely different story though, as the superchargers we are using on our little 4bangers are barely good for 8psi, as compared to a mild turbo running 14-15.

So yes, turbos for our cars are the best option, but only because the available range of superchargers for our car (or any compact car that ive ever seen for that matter) were never been designed to produce big numbers.
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