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Old 11-23-2010, 01:38 PM   #21
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Quote:
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So I'm wondering on a turbo application is the 2.3 would be better than the 2.0 on the 2.0L engine?
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If you have the 2.3 head then use the 2.3 intake manifold ,If you have the 2.0 use the 2.0 manifold

The 2.3 head breaths better then the 2.0 and the 2.3 intake flows better then the 2.0 if you cannot get the air through the head adding a better flowing intake would do much

On top of that you have boost so that changes everything , I would stay with what you have

I dont like engine sims because it leaves to many questions unanswered and the engine rarely makes what the sisms quotes

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Old 12-05-2010, 12:31 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by 1turbofocus View Post
I dont like engine sims because it leaves to many questions unanswered and the engine rarely makes what the sisms quotes

Tom
I agree that you can't trust a sim to be dead nuts on, first it depends on how extensive the sim is, and second it depends on the quality of the data put into the sim.

I have tinkered with 3 different sim programs, one "free" sim from somewhere on the internet, and 2 versions of the SIMs offered by Performance Trends.

The free sim was laughable, only using very basic inputs. The results were not horrible, but certainly unreliable.

The inexpensive basic version of the Performance Trends sim I started using for my engine build last year, included a good depth of info, taking into account port types, some advanced cam design features, and losses from friction and accy's etc. It actually did a decent job of helping with my cam design, but miscalcuated the torque curve, and peak HP.

At that point I upgraded to the Performance Trends Pro version which takes on a whole different level of detail. It's computational power is such that it can accept and utilize full cam profile info from "Cam Doctor" files etc, and will plot cylinder and port pressures etc. (Wish I had an actual engineering background to make better use of all that detailed info....)

The results I had with Performance Trends Engine Analyzer Pro simluation did a much better job at replicating my actual dyno curves etc. While still not a "perfect predictor" of results, I'm confident enough with it's output that I will continue using it for the development of some custom headers, and deciding if any other cam changes are worth the effort/cost.

My only regret is that I did not start out with the more expensive "pro" version of this software, as I could have had better results from the beginning instead of the less accurate predictions of the less expensive sim.

Like everything else in this world, you only get what you pay for. (if you are lucky)
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Old 02-12-2011, 01:42 PM   #23
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so any more on your build tb1999? i was looking at putn a 2.3 on my 07 ZX3. wonder if computer work the flaps. my car is more street strip. i stop auto cross like 8 yrs ago
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Old 02-17-2011, 12:20 AM   #24
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so any more on your build tb1999? i was looking at putn a 2.3 on my 07 ZX3. wonder if computer work the flaps. my car is more street strip. i stop auto cross like 8 yrs ago
I have updated my engine build thread, working on a custom header and need to get a billet crank too.

I got the runner control flaps to work by modifying the strategy for the tumble flaps. Since I deleted the tumble flaps that worked OK.

If you end up with larger cams, the longer runner does not seem to improve low end torque like I expected. My dyno session showed the long runners did not make any more power down low, but I have some radical cams. I still left the system operational, but I think its just about useless and would run OK on the short runners alone, but that will ultimately depend on what cams you select etc.
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Old 02-23-2011, 03:47 PM   #25
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I just unplug the selenoid for the runner control to leave it on short runners full time


Whats that do? how does it help the power?
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Old 03-16-2011, 09:51 PM   #26
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well i am now getting more into my build. so i am looking for the idea intake. i like all the info you have posted. i was about to ask a friend that makes intakes & headers for turbo cars to build me a intake. was going to try a idea i have. make all runners 11 or 12 inches. jst trying to get a good idea on how to make it. or may jst get the escape 2.3 intake & go with it.
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Old 02-19-2014, 04:01 PM   #27
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I know im bumping an old thread but what was used to fill the holes left from removing the tumble flaps?
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Old 02-20-2014, 03:51 PM   #28
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I know im bumping an old thread but what was used to fill the holes left from removing the tumble flaps?
Ill tell you how i did mine maybe his idea is better. When you get the intake off you will see a sleeve that holds the flaps this sleve has little holes that the flaps pivot in. I removed the flap then the flashing that prevents the flap from opening to far and closing to far. I used a dremel and just ground them down flat then polished them like the rest of the intake.

The holes the rod runs threw is larger then the hole on the sleeve. I found some vacuum caps made of rubber that i squished down and forced them into all the holes. Then i put the sleeve back in. Once you mount the intake back on the ports on the head hold the sleeves in tight.

Since the hols for the flap rod is larger the sleeve also helps keep the rubber caps in place.

I built one and ran it for about a year but i made a mistake when i did mine. Insted of just capping the line from the bottom of the block (block breather PCV) i plugged the hole and then hooked a hose from the bottom of the block down tot he ground. I hated it, my car always smelt like oil. The fumes would always creep up into the cab and fogged my window.

Im planning to build another one but this time im not going to vent the case outside but insted run it back threw like it is stock.

The problem i had with mine besides the smell was the lack of bottom end power. The top end screamed with this mod it was the best mod ive done to the car so far, the most noticable. I didnt spend enough time with Tom smoothing out the bottom. Once the flaps are gone it seems to run really rich and robs the bottom end alot. It stumbles and fumbles off the line but once past about 3K it is a BIG improvement.
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Old 02-20-2014, 08:22 PM   #29
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FWIW - 3,000 rpm is where the "tumble flaps" are supposed to open, so running well above that rpm with them removed would be normal.
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Old 02-21-2014, 05:05 AM   #30
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Right and below that the flaps close down causing the air velocity to increase helping the fuel mix better.

So when mine was removed it ran rich cruising on the highway and around town and it hesitated and was a dog from a start till i got up to 3K

Since my car is an auto thats where it seems to shift so it was always a dog unless i shifted it manually and let the RPMs ramp up.
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