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Old 08-03-2007, 11:36 AM   #21
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A "UDP" on these engines amounts to nothing more than an extra addition to your "mods" list. If someone stole your UDP and replaced it with a stock one, you wouldn't notice a difference until you looked at it.
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Old 08-03-2007, 11:41 AM   #22
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yes all engines wear a little unevenly in our imperfect world. but thats what makes maintenance so important. to keep that to a minimum. whats the maintenance record like for these high milage, uneven compression engines? or engines that wear so unevenly it causes failure?
Good point, mine tests 175-185-190-185 at 160k miles, great maintenance.
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Old 08-03-2007, 11:43 AM   #23
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A "UDP" on these engines amounts to nothing more than an extra addition to your "mods" list. If someone stole your UDP and replaced it with a stock one, you wouldn't notice a difference until you looked at it.
hahaha I can imagine coming out to your driveway one moring and seeing some guy with a bigass wrench.."what the...HEY!!!" lol

Someone said recently in another thread, its like driving with your a/c off when your a/c is actually on.
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Old 08-03-2007, 12:05 PM   #24
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So, why dont aftermarket UDP manufactures make the gear with a little rubber damper...win win?

And people, its DAMPER. You can dampen, or damp. Dampener is a laymans variation of the actual term damper.

And as far as rotating assemblies go - heres some food for thought. I'll preface this by saying that I have quite a bit of experience with the physics and engineering involved with rotating assemblies, resonance, harmonics etc etc.

Facts:

1) The stock pulley is a relatively poorly balanced, heavy cast piece. If left without a bushing, it would contribute to harmful vibes at specific RPM's. This is why, and is THE reason why ford put a bushing on there. It costs less to do this than it does to CNC / mill the pulleys individually from light materials. Duh.

2) The aftermarket UDP's are essentially zero balanced and very light. They are NOT the controlling factor in the equation due to their lessened mass and excellent balance. The cannot contribute to harmful resonance in the assembly.

3) If you rotating assembly has certain resonant RPM's, the little bushing on your stock UDP is NOT going to do all that much to damp the amplitude of the vibes. Sorry. Couple kilos of high-rpm rotating mass vs. a little piece of rubber. Rotating mass is the controlling factor everytime, and by a longshot.

So, while this was fun the discussion simply isn't even fruitful. Come to your own conclusions about the UDP argument. The facts are laid out for you. In the end, however, the 1-2 HP you may or may not see just might not be worth the trouble.
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Old 08-03-2007, 12:20 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by illinipo View Post
Good point, mine tests 175-185-190-185 at 160k miles, great maintenance.
one more question. what was the compression on your motor from the factory? i doubt any motor will have exactly the same compression on all cylinders even straight off the assembly. uneven compression doesnt necessarily mean uneven wear.
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Old 08-03-2007, 12:55 PM   #26
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Pete, your compression look fine by my book. Most zetecs are in the 170-175 range. Your higher average numbers probably relates to the carbon buildup on the piston crowns and head creating a slightly higher overall compression.
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Old 08-03-2007, 01:09 PM   #27
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Dont know my factory compression, I inherited the car at 135k.

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Pete, your compression look fine by my book. Most zetecs are in the 170-175 range. Your higher average numbers probably relates to the carbon buildup on the piston crowns and head creating a slightly higher overall compression.
I agree! It's proof of iammaxwell's point and a refute of my earlier statement about compression inconsistency, and me forgetting about how it relates to maintenance. Yeah, I said it, I WAS WRONG ABOUT THAT lol it's okay to be wrong sometimes...

anyway, dougoefresh has it right on, both in the engineering and in the end. The facts are here, its your decision. I recommend sticky status.

If Karl posts dyno slips of something he recently told me, I'm sure a lot of peoples decision would be made in the "get it" way tho.
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Old 08-03-2007, 05:06 PM   #28
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Well, I suppose hearing it from a Ford designer that helped develop the Zeta engine way back when tips me off as to the nature of the balance. .
There is no Ford engineer that has ever stated that the Accessory drive/harmonic balancer is anything but that. And again the Harmonic balancer has NOTHING to do with if the engine is internal or external balanced , The Zetec is Internal but if it was External and had the rubber in it it would still be a Harmonic Balancer

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The stock pulley is NOT A DAMPNER. ITs a BIG chunk of iron that would other wise ADD undesirable harmonics to the motor if is was not.
a. balanced
b. bushed with rubber .
I cannot beleive you know so little about engines and people trust you to build them for you and you dont even know a HARMONIC BALANCER when you have it in your hand. And on top of that post MISINFORMATION for others to read about parts you sell and how they work

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So the strip of rubber is there as to not harm the engine or add vibrations. Something that is NOT a factor when running a well made pulley that is of essentially inconsequential weight. .
No the rubber is there to help deal with unwanted harmonics through the rotating Assy. And yes is a factor with yours and ALL other UDP because NO rubber is added to help with the harmonics that Ford engineers felt was needed
Weight? You have got to be kidding me ? Do you realize that if you take the Accy belt all the way off and do a run on the dyno you only gain 3.8 to 4.6HP. UPD are a sucker scam to sell parts and we both know it they dont come close to giving a return in HP/TQ vs cost

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If Im SUCH A MORON then I guess everyone at Ford Racing, Esslinger, FocusSport, Mac and Focus Central are as well... I guess im in good company.
I didnt even know it was you (massive) till you posted this and I saw your SN . You have posted misinformation and it has got back to the FF forums. Its hard for me to tell for sure but I beleive that you truely dont think the stock crank pulley is a Harmonic balancer and your not just doing it to sell parts. This is an opertunity for you and everyone else to learn something and that is that the rubber in the stock accessory pulley is for HARMONICS

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Old 08-03-2007, 05:11 PM   #29
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Pete, your compression look fine by my book. Most zetecs are in the 170-175 range. Your higher average numbers probably relates to the carbon buildup on the piston crowns and head creating a slightly higher overall compression.

Your kidding right? Just how much carbon build up would it take to go from 175/180 to a compression of 185/190 cranking compression?

It isnt carbon build up that is causing you compression to very by that much. Why would you post things like that ? Do you not realise that people read this and might beleive that

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Old 08-03-2007, 05:19 PM   #30
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Does anyone know whether top-caliber sports car race teams (LeMans series, Grand-am, etc...) run a damper on their crank pulley? Because their engines damn well better be balanced internally, and if they run one I sure would want to run one as well.

The proof is in the pudding, I want pics not opinions.
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