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Old 03-21-2014, 09:00 PM   #51
Kabigon
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Originally Posted by GTO_Greg View Post
You seem pretty sure that the PCM is programmed to do this, were you closely involved with the project in some way?
It's obvious considering that the throttle body is controlled by the PCM.
If you are unsure about this, you could check the wiring diagram and/or do a datalog.
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Old 03-21-2014, 10:55 PM   #52
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It's obvious considering that the throttle body is controlled by the PCM.
If you are unsure about this, you could check the wiring diagram and/or do a datalog.
And you don't think it's problematic that I have to come off the throttle for a full second or more before I depress the clutch pedal to keep the revs from either climbing (under hard acceleration) or hanging (under normal acceleration) rather than the revs decreasing immediately after I come off the gas pedal?

Is your Focus a manual or an automatic?

This car behaves unlike every other manual transmission automobile I've ever driven, which is why I posed the question to this forum in the first place. I seriously thought something was wrong with my car, but perhaps it's just the inexpensive (read: extremely slow responding) components in what I assume is a drive-by-wire system.

Thinking logically, I would think there's a sensor on the gas pedal that communicates to the PCM, which responds by sending a signal to the throttle body, so there's at least three system components that are either slow and/or defective in some manner. Does this make sense or am I completely off in my analysis?

Thanks for everyone's input on this!
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Old 03-21-2014, 11:14 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by GTO_Greg View Post
And you don't think it's problematic that I have to come off the throttle for a full second or more before I depress the clutch pedal to keep the revs from either climbing (under hard acceleration) or hanging (under normal acceleration) rather than the revs decreasing immediately after I come off the gas pedal?

Is your Focus a manual or an automatic?

This car behaves unlike every other manual transmission automobile I've ever driven, which is why I posed the question to this forum in the first place. I seriously thought something was wrong with my car, but perhaps it's just the inexpensive (read: extremely slow responding) components in what I assume is a drive-by-wire system.

Thinking logically, I would think there's a sensor on the gas pedal that communicates to the PCM, which responds by sending a signal to the throttle body, so there's at least three system components that are either slow and/or defective in some manner. Does this make sense or am I completely off in my analysis?

Thanks for everyone's input on this!
It's not a malfunction because it was designed/programmed to do just that. It's functioning properly in that sense. It is extremely annoying, and I hate it as well. It makes smooth upshifts more difficult.

It is done for emissions reasons as already stated.
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Old 03-22-2014, 12:45 AM   #54
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This "feature" has been around to some extent since the first "dashpots" on carbureted cars to help meet emissions. How big an effect has changed over the years, and has been a constant complaint on this Forum since the first Focus.

My Cable Controlled Throttle body car has the "normal" effect people have been mentioning here. I first noticed it being more dramatic than earlier cars by it's not slowing down when the foot came off appreciably until after a long wait - and then not much engine braking, which has been typical for a while.

When I got tach. cluster, I was amazed to see the RPM's pop up on every shift - hadn't been able to hear that effect without the tach. I was getting 5-6 hundred bump at each shift until I started pulling the foot of the gas before clutching, instead of the typical pedal movement at the same time.

I'm seeing current owners report the same reactions when working "normally". There have been exceptions thru the years when there were problems that made this worse - to the point of the ridiculous. That's when there is an issue that needs a solution - revs. always too high, like hanging at 2-3,000 most of the time, holding the brake hard to keep it stopped with an automatic, etc..

The delayed reaction & poor engine braking is the primary reason I've considered getting a "Tune" for mine, haven't spent the $ to fix this irritation yet but it would be a bigger improvement than any HP increase I'd get! Just for old time reaction & engine braking.

GTO_Greg - don't know how bad yours is, I can only confirm that "Foot Off - Foot In" for throttle & clutch is "normal" for these as opposed to my old habit of doing both at once.

Luck
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Old 03-23-2014, 08:30 AM   #55
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Yup, and also once you clutch in it will hold revs at the perfect rpms for an upshift for at least a few seconds before dropping down to idle!
This is what I experience too. The computer knows the RPM for the next gear (upshift only) and drops to that level and stays there for about a second as you shift.

example: accelerate in first gear to 3500 rpm, press the clutch and the RPM drops and stays at 2000 RPM (which is the engine speed in second gear at that MPH). If you hold the clutch in for longer, the RPM will drop to idle speed.

I think it's nice. This 5 speed is the best manual transmission in any car I've ever had (Honda, Saturn, Hyundai, Mazda, Corvette) The engagement is positive without being heavy, the ratio split between the gears is ideal, and it's quiet. Could use a 6th gear though.
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Old 04-03-2014, 08:17 AM   #56
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Originally Posted by GTO_Greg View Post
That's just it, that's not what it's doing. The revs don't drop if I don't come completely off the throttle and wait almost one full second ('one thousand one') before depressing the clutch pedal, they tend to stay the same when driving sedately or even keep climbing under hard acceleration. That one full section off the accelerator waiting to hit the clutch pedal seems to me like an eternity.



You seem pretty sure that the PCM is programmed to do this, were you closely involved with the project in some way?



As I stated in my original post, "When I upshift, the throttle 'sticks' - what I mean here is that, if I don't come completely off the throttle and wait almost one full second ('one thousand one') before depressing the clutch pedal, the engine revs climb."

Let me qualify that a bit. Under hard acceleration, if I don't come off the throttle for a least one full second before depressing the clutch pedal, the revs climb a bit. Under 'sedate' acceleration, if I don't come off the throttle for at least one full second, the revs hang rather than falling. Either way, when I engage the clutch in the next gear, the revs are not closely matched to the next gear, and that's hard on the clutch. I wasn't sure if there was something wrong with my Focus, as I've never had a manual transmission car act like that, or if that's just the way things are and I should learn to deal with it.

It's looking like the overwhelming opinion is that that's the way things are and I've learned to deal with it rather than taking it to my Ford dealer, beating my head against the wall, and being treated like an imbecile, which has been my typical experience with dealership service departments...
GTO_Greg, I'm in your court. Now there's two of us out of the 1000 we need. We just need 998 more to agree this is a problem and Ford to make the adjustments to the throttle by wire. It's not safe to have to take you foot off the gas before seconds. I'm not giving up!
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Old 04-03-2014, 09:43 AM   #57
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GTO_Greg, I'm in your court. Now there's two of us out of the 1000 we need. We just need 998 more to agree this is a problem and Ford to make the adjustments to the throttle by wire. It's not safe to have to take you foot off the gas before seconds. I'm not giving up!
I've basically given up and will just deal with it. If this is the way modern manual transmissions are designed/programmed to work, my next new car will be an automatic. No wonder fewer and fewer cars are being sold with manuals...

I don't have any of these types of problems with the 6-speed manual in my 2005 Pontiac GTO, but maybe because it's basically a Corvette drivetrain, and/or maybe because it's older than my 2013 Focus, and/or ???
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