Ford Buy Back!

[fordblue]

Originally Posted by cbdallas

Fortunately, mine has never exhibited any of this lurching / grinding behavior, but I'm not ruling it out for occuring down the road. There are quite a few people on here stating that the grinding didn't start until they reached 12,000 + miles.

It just defies logic how some cars are so seriously afflicted and seem unfixable, and others like mine never misbehave (other than my buggy MFT and neglecting to upshift past 4th gear after downshifting to pass, when in S mode). But the evidence is really piling up against this transmission and its 3 seemingly seperate issues (software not actuating clutches correctly, leaky seals causing bad clutch behavior, and some defect inside the gearbox causing that nasty grinding). The odds are really against it when it has so much to overcome.

This mess really makes me aware that I need to join and sift through specific-brand car forums BEFORE I make a purchase. As for me, I'm just going to work toward the goal of trading my Ti for an ST. I love everything else about this car. Trading MFT & DCT for a turbo & manual transmission is sounding better & better. If only it hadn't depreciated worse than a 90's era Hyundai.

I agree with that. I dont think I could trade mine in if I wanted too. Its worth what 14 thou? Way upside down..........way.

[revhigh]

Originally Posted by fordblue

I agree with that. I dont think I could trade mine in if I wanted too. Its worth what 14 thou? Way upside down..........way.

That's why you don't buy loaded econoboxes ...

The big-buck options have virtually zero retained value.

Most people will ALWAYS buy a new lesser equipped model rather than a used loaded model for the same price.

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[e30og]

Originally Posted by revhigh

That's why you don't buy loaded econoboxes ...

The big-buck options have virtually zero retained value.

Most people will ALWAYS buy a new lesser equipped model rather than a used loaded model for the same price.

REV

Most people buy a car as loaded as they can afford. If you had the dough for navi or leather or other goods, would you hold back? And I dont know about you but i'm not interested in getting rid of this car for well after its paid off, and at that point it will definitely be worth more than nothing.

Lets remember again that in the first place, cars are totally worthless investments. You will NEVER get your investment back, no matter how loaded or stripped it is, no matter what car it is, no exceptions. If your dying for retained value, put down 30-50% of the value and it will never be upside down. The only way a car is a sound investment is if you work your way up...buy a car for 2 grand, drive it for 2 years and invest maybe a grand in repairs while in that 2 year time you save up 2500. Sell it for 500, and now you have 3 grand. Repeat that process for a decade and youll have thousands in your pocket and never make payments

[cbdallas]

As often as I trade cars, and only putting around 5,000 miles on them per year, I really should be leasing. Approximately the same money spent (or in some cases, less if you factor in the tax savings) and I don't have to worry about a trade-in. I just drop it off and either walk away or get something else. But then again, I'm not sure I want to keep this car for 24 - 37 months if it's gonna start acting up.

[revhigh]

Originally Posted by e30og

Most people buy a car as loaded as they can afford.

Then you live with the risks and huge losses associated with that practice .... if that's OK with you ... go for it !!

Lets remember again that in the first place, cars are totally worthless investments.

True !! But some investments are worse than others. Namely ... loaded $30K econoboxes. There are soooo many other choices for people to buy when they look at a used loaded econobox vs the rest of the market. They can get a lesser equipped car a class or two up, they can get the same model BRAND NEW with a few less options for thousands less, etc, etc.

When you take into account that these cars are selling for an absolutely ridiculous percentage of their MSRP's ... it's easy to understand that theier value plummets like a rock compared to their MSRP.

My car listed for$21K. After roughly $1000 in Ford sticker discounts, $1000 in dealer discount, and $2500 in rebates ... I'm in to the car for $16,500. Even if I can only get $14 for it ... I've done well as cars go. If you buy a loaded Focus stickered at $30,000, get a $1500 discount, and $3500 rebate .. you're into it for $25K. It's worth $20K max ... probably less.

So .... if you go by your theory that you 'buy the most options that you can', you better like that car because you're gonna be in it for a long time. If you like it, and don't have issues ... you're golden, but if it has tons of issues that make you hate it ... you're not so golden.

To be honest ... I've never seen a factory nav system that was any better than my $89 Garmin. Most are worse. I've had lots of cars with leather, and can easily live without it ... or if you really want it ... put a Katzkin leather package in it that's better than the factory leather for $1000.

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[revhigh]

Originally Posted by cbdallas

I'm not sure I want to keep this car for 24 - 37 months if it's gonna start acting up.

It's hard to find a reasonable lease for much less than 24 months.

But you're right ... you probably should be leasing if you change cars that often, and do low miles.


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[kam327]

Originally Posted by e30og

Most people buy a car as loaded as they can afford. If you had the dough for navi or leather or other goods, would you hold back? And I dont know about you but i'm not interested in getting rid of this car for well after its paid off, and at that point it will definitely be worth more than nothing.

Lets remember again that in the first place, cars are totally worthless investments. You will NEVER get your investment back, no matter how loaded or stripped it is, no matter what car it is, no exceptions. If your dying for retained value, put down 30-50% of the value and it will never be upside down. The only way a car is a sound investment is if you work your way up...buy a car for 2 grand, drive it for 2 years and invest maybe a grand in repairs while in that 2 year time you save up 2500. Sell it for 500, and now you have 3 grand. Repeat that process for a decade and youll have thousands in your pocket and never make payments

Originally Posted by revhigh

That's why you don't buy loaded econoboxes ...

The big-buck options have virtually zero retained value.

Most people will ALWAYS buy a new lesser equipped model rather than a used loaded model for the same price.

REV

You guys are missing a BIG part of the picture, the intangible value of being comfortable and satisfied in a space most people spend an hour to an hour and a half of their days in. If someone feels that a computer gadget to play around with while sitting at lights will make them enjoy their commute more, then by all means they should pay extra for MFT in their car. So what if it's not worth anything when you get rid of it? How many hours of enjoyment did you get out of it at the end for that money? It's no different than most electronics out there.

Same with houses. Many folks spend money upgrading their houses to their own personal taste to enjoy them more while they live in them and often do not get that money back at selling time. Pools may be the #1 example.

[revhigh]

Originally Posted by kam327

So what if it's not worth anything when you get rid of it? How many hours of enjoyment did you get out of it at the end for that money?

This discussion arose because the people that are complaining about the value loss are trying to get out of their cars quickly, because they can't stand the issues with them. Therefore ... they didn't get many hours of 'playing' with them at stoplights, and if they did, and valued that aspect ... they wouldn't be complaining about the lack of resale value ..... because it would have been worth it to them.

As I said ... if you end up liking the car and are going to keep it forever (or a long time), buy whatever you want to ... but if you get a problem car that you end up hating ... and you bought all the bells and whistles .... you're gonna keep it ... or get wrecked on the resale or trade-in value.

You make your purchase and live with the consequences.


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[kam327]

Originally Posted by revhigh

This discussion arose because the people that are complaining about the value loss are trying to get out of their cars quickly, because they can't stand the issues with them. Therefore ... they didn't get many hours of 'playing' with them at stoplights, and if they did, and valued that aspect ... they wouldn't be complaining about the lack of resale value ..... because it would have been worth it to them.

As I said ... if you end up liking the car and are going to keep it forever (or a long time), buy whatever you want to ... but if you get a problem car that you end up hating ... and you bought all the bells and whistles .... you're gonna keep it ... or get wrecked on the resale or trade-in value.

You make your purchase and live with the consequences.


REV

That's fair, I never said folks weren't being irrational about the depreciation issue.

But your posts indicated your strong opinion that everyone should be buying lesser equipped larger cars than highly equipped smaller cars.

I don't agree. Everyone should equip their car to the minimum that will make them not regret their purchase in 6 months. And if that means buying a smaller car so they can enjoy those extras, so be it. Like me: if I had cheaped out and gotten cloth seats and steel wheels, I'd really be regretting my purchase right now and would hate driving it until the point when I can get out of it without taking a bath.

[revhigh]

Originally Posted by kam327

But your posts indicated your strong opinion that everyone should be buying lesser equipped larger cars than highly equipped smaller cars.

Actually what I'm saying is that the smartest thing to do is to buy the size car you need ... equipped REASONABLY ... neither stripped .... nor loaded.

Do we REALLY need cars that tell us we're out of our lane ?

Do we REALLY need cars that park themselves ?

Do we REALLY need cars whose speed controls use radar to work ?

Do we REALLY need cars that let us look at a TV screen instead of looking in a mirror or out the back window ?

If the answer for you (not you specifically kam) is yes ... then buy them and live with the consequences of crushing depreciation.

My car was $16,500 ... it has a sunroof, mag wheels, it's a great color, it has lots of power options, it DOESN'T have a transmission that has tons of problems, and it DOESN'T have an 'infotainment' system that locks up, needs constant updates, reboots without warning, and has a crappy nav system to boot. It's a pretty nice car, and if I needed to sell it right now I could probably get pretty good money for it .... especially since Ford changed all the option packages around for 2013 so that the same car would be thousands more if equipped the same way today.

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