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Old 10-05-2012, 09:07 AM   #121
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Good morning!

I want to start aggregating the information of people who are happy with their vehicle's performance after turning off Traction Control. Please send me a PM with your VIN and also let me know if you've had TSB 12B37 applied.

Thanks!
Crystal
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Old 10-05-2012, 09:44 AM   #122
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Originally Posted by FordCustomerService View Post
Good morning!

I want to start aggregating the information of people who are happy with their vehicle's performance after turning off Traction Control. Please send me a PM with your VIN and also let me know if you've had TSB 12B37 applied.

Thanks!
Crystal
PM sent ... thanks for your attention and efforts!
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Old 10-05-2012, 09:49 AM   #123
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Originally Posted by hotleadsingerguy View Post
That's precisely the problem -- Ford says "This is the way the car is meant to operate" and leaves it at that. They don't listen to reason or logic beyond and including that statement, so getting them to change it will be downright impossible unless they realize it themselves.

I have a conference call today with one of the "Corporate Engineers" (read: not really an engineer at all) to discuss my issues with the transmission. Having driven more than 15 concentric dry dual-clutch systems across various platforms I feel I have a fairly strong understanding of how this transmission *should* operate. We'll see if I'm able to make my case, or if I get the same old "We know what we're doing" speech.

If I do, the options are either that they buy it back or I bring up a lawsuit. I'm done messing with this car after they drastically changed the operation of it without my approval. I didn't buy a $30k that drives like this, and I'm not going to be expected to keep it for 10 years in this condition.

The whole ... that's the way it's supposed to operate thing is just a legal statement designed to delay or deny service for a problem they know they have. I wouldn't be as unhappy if it was just a delay as I understand they need to get a handle on the range and scope of issues they're dealing with, but if they dig there heals in to deny service then they will open themselves up for a class action lawsuit. I hope it doesn't go there...

The thing is, the world has changed and this forum is an example of the social media that has changed it. In the past a company could say, with a straight face, you're the only one with that problem, but now a days, we can all see other on FocusFanatics with this problem and know that the company is not telling us the truth. If it comes to a class action suit, and again I hope Ford smartens up to avoid that, then this site and other no doubt will serve as a recruiting ground for the suit AND provide proof, through the correspondence with them that's been documented here, that they have been aware of the problem.

Again, I do not have the problem and hope I never do but I have no doubt that other are and that it is not as it should be...


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Old 10-05-2012, 09:50 AM   #124
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To be fair, 12b37 did help a lot of us. In my case it moved the DCT from being completely unacceptable to merely annoying. One would hope there's another update in the works...
That very well may be, but it also did the opposite for a *lot* of people. It's the reason multiple consumer reporting websites and magazines are blasting Ford for their update process. My car was operating wonderfully before the update. I bought the car *because* it was operating the way that I liked it. Then Ford forced me to get an update under penalty of losing my warranty coverage...and now it drives like a completely different car, in the worst way possible.

This is the kind of thing that lawsuits are born from.
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Old 10-05-2012, 10:07 AM   #125
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Originally Posted by hotleadsingerguy View Post
That very well may be, but it also did the opposite for a *lot* of people. It's the reason multiple consumer reporting websites and magazines are blasting Ford for their update process. My car was operating wonderfully before the update. I bought the car *because* it was operating the way that I liked it. Then Ford forced me to get an update under penalty of losing my warranty coverage...and now it drives like a completely different car, in the worst way possible.

This is the kind of thing that lawsuits are born from.
I'm sure not defending Ford, just saying the update was not a disaster for all. Ford has screwed this up in a way I didn't think possible for a major companyin the 21st century. The Focus was my 5th new Ford and, in all likelihood, my last. Problems with a new model are understandable, but their persistency, the avoidance and denial, unprepared dealer network, remedies that aren't after working on the issue for almost 2 years, et al are not.

Anyone looking at a new Escape, CMax or Fusion? You are indeed a brave person.
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Old 10-05-2012, 10:49 AM   #126
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I'm sure not defending Ford, just saying the update was not a disaster for all. Ford has screwed this up in a way I didn't think possible for a major companyin the 21st century. The Focus was my 5th new Ford and, in all likelihood, my last. Problems with a new model are understandable, but their persistency, the avoidance and denial, unprepared dealer network, remedies that aren't after working on the issue for almost 2 years, et al are not.

Anyone looking at a new Escape, CMax or Fusion? You are indeed a brave person.
I think they are feeling the growing pains of high-tech and they're not alone. Look at all the massive recalls all the major car companies in the last few years and it's kind of incredible.

The point above about the social media thing. That is huge. Expensive products like this can't be half-assed anymore or people will organize.

In my further experimenting with the traction control, I can't really see any difference. I need to drive around with it on for a bit and pay more attention.

It might be that just turning it on and off fixes shudders. Who knows.
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Old 10-05-2012, 11:42 AM   #127
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Even if they messed up; who really cares? It's not an issue to have a company mess up as long as they fix their problems (holds true for people as well). Recalls are good things. Expecting absolutely no problems for something as complex as a completely new machine (car, computer, whatever) is not something I'm personally prepared to do. I'm hoping for it, but I won't blame a company for having issues. Where I can blame a company is if they don't fix their issue, or worse, if they deny there's a problem. In my book, that's the worst thing a company can do.

I personally can't relate to the issues you guys are having with the transmission because a bought a manual (hehehe), but a good example is a power supply I had bought for my computer a while back. It broke. I got good support from the company, and because of this I won't scratch the company from my book when the time comes to buy another one.

The fact that dealers have been telling people that this is expected behavior is unacceptable. However, the fact that customer support from Ford is on this forum is a good thing. That said, pardon me, but I'll remain skeptical to see much changes even if customer support sends this higher in the chain.
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Old 10-05-2012, 01:44 PM   #128
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Even if they messed up; who really cares? It's not an issue to have a company mess up as long as they fix their problems (holds true for people as well). Recalls are good things. Expecting absolutely no problems for something as complex as a completely new machine (car, computer, whatever) is not something I'm personally prepared to do. I'm hoping for it, but I won't blame a company for having issues. Where I can blame a company is if they don't fix their issue, or worse, if they deny there's a problem. In my book, that's the worst thing a company can do.

I personally can't relate to the issues you guys are having with the transmission because a bought a manual (hehehe), but a good example is a power supply I had bought for my computer a while back. It broke. I got good support from the company, and because of this I won't scratch the company from my book when the time comes to buy another one.

The fact that dealers have been telling people that this is expected behavior is unacceptable. However, the fact that customer support from Ford is on this forum is a good thing. That said, pardon me, but I'll remain skeptical to see much changes even if customer support sends this higher in the chain.
That's exactly the problem. The regional customer service managers are saying the same basic thing, that "It's meant to work like this". It's malarkey.

I just got off the phone with Ford customer service. I was supposed to have my conference call with a "subject matter expert" in the engineering department on the matter and, what do you know, he couldn't make the meeting. I ended up talking to a different regional service manager that said, "He told me it's supposed to be like that". I'm super surprised.

Either way, I told her that a TSB actually existed to even fix this issue and then she said, "Oh...well would you like me to schedule an appointment to get that performed?". It's as if they don't really care to research an issue and just spout that line because it appeases most people...but then when caught in the lie they do as little as possible to make the customer happy. Even worse? The dealership told me the other day that they plugged in the computer and didn't get an error code, so didn't do anything more. I asked why they didn't physically check out any of the parts I said were potentially problematic and the service manager *literally* said, verbatim, "We did what was required of us".

I suggested they do more than what was required of them if they ever wanted their customers to be satisfied with their work, and took my car home. If all you do is what's required of you, you're not doing enough. He should be ashamed of himself for even saying that.
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Old 10-05-2012, 01:59 PM   #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hotleadsingerguy View Post
That's exactly the problem. The regional customer service managers are saying the same basic thing, that "It's meant to work like this". It's malarkey.

I just got off the phone with Ford customer service. I was supposed to have my conference call with a "subject matter expert" in the engineering department on the matter and, what do you know, he couldn't make the meeting. I ended up talking to a different regional service manager that said, "He told me it's supposed to be like that". I'm super surprised.

Either way, I told her that a TSB actually existed to even fix this issue and then she said, "Oh...well would you like me to schedule an appointment to get that performed?". It's as if they don't really care to research an issue and just spout that line because it appeases most people...but then when caught in the lie they do as little as possible to make the customer happy. Even worse? The dealership told me the other day that they plugged in the computer and didn't get an error code, so didn't do anything more. I asked why they didn't physically check out any of the parts I said were potentially problematic and the service manager *literally* said, verbatim, "We did what was required of us".

I suggested they do more than what was required of them if they ever wanted their customers to be satisfied with their work, and took my car home. If all you do is what's required of you, you're not doing enough. He should be ashamed of himself for even saying that.
Dang, I was foolishly expecting you to receive better service and get somewhere with the engineer.
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Old 10-05-2012, 02:54 PM   #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hotleadsingerguy View Post
That's exactly the problem. The regional customer service managers are saying the same basic thing, that "It's meant to work like this". It's malarkey.

I just got off the phone with Ford customer service. I was supposed to have my conference call with a "subject matter expert" in the engineering department on the matter and, what do you know, he couldn't make the meeting. I ended up talking to a different regional service manager that said, "He told me it's supposed to be like that". I'm super surprised.

Either way, I told her that a TSB actually existed to even fix this issue and then she said, "Oh...well would you like me to schedule an appointment to get that performed?". It's as if they don't really care to research an issue and just spout that line because it appeases most people...but then when caught in the lie they do as little as possible to make the customer happy. Even worse? The dealership told me the other day that they plugged in the computer and didn't get an error code, so didn't do anything more. I asked why they didn't physically check out any of the parts I said were potentially problematic and the service manager *literally* said, verbatim, "We did what was required of us".

I suggested they do more than what was required of them if they ever wanted their customers to be satisfied with their work, and took my car home. If all you do is what's required of you, you're not doing enough. He should be ashamed of himself for even saying that.

Sounds to me that either the promise to have you talk to an engineer was a lie or they decided it was a bad idea to have a customer, with access and awareness of social media, talk to an engineer on the chance that said engineer reveal something they'd prefer remained in house.

Very disappointing.

I'm not one to run to a lawyer for the least little thing, but it's looking to me that this issue is probably going to require dragging Ford through the public spectacle of a trial.

Sad...


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