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Old 09-30-2012, 12:18 PM   #31
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The wagon is 0.86" longer then the sedan and 7.83" longer then the 5 door hatch.
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Old 09-30-2012, 03:06 PM   #32
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NO FAIR! Shame on Ford for not bringing the ST Wagon to the states!
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Old 09-30-2012, 03:21 PM   #33
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NO FAIR! Shame on Ford for not bringing the ST Wagon to the states!
Well to be fair they presume that wagons won't sell here at all, but wagons can't sell if they won't sell any in the first place.

If they had brought us the standard wagon I can see the point of griping about just the ST wagon, but they didn't even give us that option. Preferring to push people into the C-Max hybrid or the Escape in our vehicle's size class.
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Old 09-30-2012, 03:29 PM   #34
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"legal form of assisted suicide" <--Now theres an extremely close minded view. I'm not wanting to start a flame war, but I bet you've know a efw people to have been killed on a sportbike, and my further guess would be that they were doing something stupid when it happened. Otherwise you've view would include all vehicles without a seatbelt.
You're the one with closed view, I lost a few friends who were bike enthusiasts and were almost always saying more or less the same stuff you do now, I've also seen 2 biker deaths as they happened caused by other users of the road, which just wouldn't happen if they were driving a car. That, and knowing a few dozens full time paramedics around the world who working on the streets for years have all the right to have their opinion respected - and their opinion is that bikes indeed are "legal form of assisted suicide" so to say, even tho some of them are/were riding bikes themselves.
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But.... why read facts and investigate a claim when it supports your ideology?
...that should be written as 'The First Law of Internet Forums'
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Old 09-30-2012, 03:36 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by suss6052 View Post
Well to be fair they presume that wagons won't sell here at all, but wagons can't sell if they won't sell any in the first place.

If they had brought us the standard wagon I can see the point of griping about just the ST wagon, but they didn't even give us that option. Preferring to push people into the C-Max hybrid or the Escape in our vehicle's size class.



I understand the reasoning of their decision, buddy. I just happen to be one of the few that likes the look and practicality of a wagon over a CUV.

But awesome of you to put that out there for those who may not understand why we don't have it. :-D
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Old 09-30-2012, 05:07 PM   #36
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You're the one with closed view, I lost a few friends who were bike enthusiasts and were almost always saying more or less the same stuff you do now, I've also seen 2 biker deaths as they happened caused by other users of the road, which just wouldn't happen if they were driving a car. That, and knowing a few dozens full time paramedics around the world who working on the streets for years have all the right to have their opinion respected - and their opinion is that bikes indeed are "legal form of assisted suicide" so to say, even tho some of them are/were riding bikes themselves.
"Legal Form of Assisted Suicide" implies that the people riding bikes in general are out to kill themselves. You're argument breaks down really quick in definition alone, not even beginning to look at the logic behind it. You've obviously been hurt more times than any amount of our talking can undue. I'm sorry for your loss, however essentially calling all bike riders out as being in a mental state of suicide consideration is far from called for. Surely you've never lost someone important to you while sky diving, rock climbing, white water rafting, flying in an airplane, or driving in a car. We each accept a certain amount of risk in our lives, your acceptable risk level is clearly much lower than others. Your view is on the extreme end of the spectrum, it sucks you've been pushed that far on this particular issue.

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Originally Posted by GhiaFan
The wagon is 0.86" longer then the sedan and 7.83" longer then the 5 door hatch.
Thanks for the info. I'm off to figure out if the wheelbase changes on the sedan vs hatch. That info should be on Fords US website somewhere. I'll tell you though, that wagon sure looks more than 7.83" longer than my hatch. Wierd, must be the perspective or something.
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Old 09-30-2012, 05:14 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by 2kwik4u View Post
Thanks for the info. I'm off to figure out if the wheelbase changes on the sedan vs hatch. That info should be on Fords US website somewhere. I'll tell you though, that wagon sure looks more than 7.83" longer than my hatch. Wierd, must be the perspective or something.
The wheel base is exactly the same for the hatch, sedan, and wagon. Just the rear overhang is different. 104.3" long wheel base. The hatch is 6.9" shorter than the sedan in terms of overall length.
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Old 09-30-2012, 10:03 PM   #38
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I've been riding since 1977, 3 Hondas, 2 Harleys. It's not so different now as it was way back when. I use my peripheral vision the same today as I had to back in '78 when someone tried to run me off the road several times.

Pay attention to what's around you no matter what you drive. I have no accidents on my record at speed, but I've been hit 5 times while at a complete stop, in cars, by people not paying attention - none of them had cell phones. 4 times at stop signs and red lights, and the last time (17 years ago) while parked in a parking lot with the ignition off.
Kinda off topic from both of us but you're saying you'd rather be hit by a car while parked on a motorcycle? Anecdotal statements are great and all but motorcycle fatalities have risen dramatically in recent years. Oh and I haven't spotted any STs lately.

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From 1997Ė2009, annual motorcycle deaths doubled from 2,116 to 4,462. On average, 12 motorcyclists were killed every day. Although motorcycles represent only 3 percent of the vehicles on our nationís roads, they account for 13 percent of highway deaths. According to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, head injury is a leading cause of death in motorcycle crashes. This alarming trend of increased motorcycle fatalities and injuries must be reversed.
http://www.ntsb.gov/safety/mwl-10.html
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The Facts
According to the U.S. Department of Transportationís National Highway Traffic Safety Administration:

Motorcyclists are 35 times more likely experience a deadly accident on the road than those in passenger cars.
In 2006, 88,000 motorcyclists were injured in highway accidents alone.
In 2006, 4,810 motorcyclists were killed in road accidents.
11 percent of all roadway accidents that occur in the United States involve motorcycles.
Head injury is the leading cause of death in motorcycle crashes.
A motorcyclist not wearing a helmet is 40 percent more likely to die of a head injury than one who wears a helmet.
A motorcyclist not wearing a helmet is 15 percent more likely to suffer a nonfatal injury than one who wears a helmet.
It is estimated that helmets reduce the likelihood of a crash fatality by 37 percent.
In 2007, a total of 7.1 million motorcycles were registered in the U.S.
In 2005, the motorcycle fatality rate was 73 per 100,000 registered motorcycles; meanwhile, the passenger vehicle fatality rate in the same year was 14 per 100,000 registrations.
Motorcycle use is growing disproportionately to fatality growth. For instance, in 1997 there were 3,826,373 motorcycles registered in the U.S. and 2,116 motorcycle fatalities. In 2005, there were 6,227,146 motorcycles registered in the U.S. and 4,810 motorcycle fatalities. So, between 1997 and 2005, registrations grew 63 percent while fatalities more than doubled.

http://www.motorcycleaccident.org/mo...ssible-causes/
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Old 10-01-2012, 08:43 AM   #39
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Cool

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Originally Posted by 2kwik4u View Post
"Legal Form of Assisted Suicide" implies that the people riding bikes in general are out to kill themselves. You're argument breaks down really quick in definition alone, not even beginning to look at the logic behind it. You've obviously been hurt more times than any amount of our talking can undue. I'm sorry for your loss, however essentially calling all bike riders out as being in a mental state of suicide consideration is far from called for. Surely you've never lost someone important to you while sky diving, rock climbing, white water rafting, flying in an airplane, or driving in a car. We each accept a certain amount of risk in our lives, your acceptable risk level is clearly much lower than others. Your view is on the extreme end of the spectrum, it sucks you've been pushed that far on this particular issue.
Very classy response .... you I respect!! Excellent perspective.

But .. back on topic.
For those that have seen the ST on the road and dealerships. Are they selling for MSRP? Any issues with ADMs? Just curious.
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Old 10-01-2012, 12:03 PM   #40
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Kinda off topic from both of us but you're saying you'd rather be hit by a car while parked on a motorcycle? Anecdotal statements are great and all but motorcycle fatalities have risen dramatically in recent years. Oh and I haven't spotted any STs lately.
Sorry, I just gotta poke in...from a guy with 36 years of road riding experience (44 with dirt included) and hundreds of thousands of miles on motorcycles, everyone dies but not everyone really lives. You don't like bikes, fine, but based on YOUR fears you better stay off of them...but leave the rest of us alone.
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