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Old 07-24-2012, 12:10 PM   #1371
suss6052
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Originally Posted by rsilvers View Post


Both of those models are not flex fuel compliant per the window sticker or running the vin through www.etis.ford.com, as they say unleaded fuel only. That's why the sticker mpg is 1 less as they had to be labeled according to the old standard.

As to the avg trip mpg it can't immediately go to where it was before, there is not enough data if you reset it while getting some specific mpg figure, ex. 40 but then you reset it the amount of data stored is zero initially, so it starts off low as it begins to average before converging on the average. That is actually what you'd want to see happen, not it instantly come back with the same number from before. We don't have an instant mpg feedback on the car, so if you're looking for instant data you'd need a scan guage type device.
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Old 07-24-2012, 12:20 PM   #1372
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Originally Posted by suss6052 View Post
As to the avg trip mpg it can't immediately go to where it was before, there is not enough data if you reset it while getting some specific mpg figure, ex. 40 but then you reset it the amount of data stored is zero initially, so it starts off low as it begins to average before converging on the average. That is actually what you'd want to see happen, not it instantly come back with the same number from before. We don't have an instant mpg feedback on the car, so if you're looking for instant data you'd need a scan guage type device.
There is no reason why it cannot refer to the previous results window back in time a bit (that it must have internally) and use that for the starting point of the computation. Ford simply chose not to implement it the way everyone else does.

The way they do it brings into question if the average results are trustworthy at all because at no point in my several mile highway drive was I getting only 25 mpg - so that value should never be figured into the average. Maybe it is not figured in, but I have no way of knowing.
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Old 07-24-2012, 12:24 PM   #1373
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My vehicle says 38 on the sticker. Not sure if the VIN says flex fuel?

Focus (C346N), 2.0L Duratec DI TIVCT (160PS), Oxford White.

Primary Features
Build Date: 25.06.2012
Vehicle Line: Focus (C346N)
Body Style: 4 Door Saloon
Series: SE
Engine: 2.0L Duratec DI TIVCT (160PS)
Transmission: 6 Speed Auto Transmission DCPS
Drive: LHD FWD
Emission: 50 State Emission Requirements
Air Conditioning: Manual Air Conditioning
Paint: Oxford White



Charcoal Black Interior
Rack/Gecko / Charcoal Black (H-C)
Less Front Door Sill Protection
Accessory Media Hub 1XUSB
Less Interior Pack
With Hill Launch Assist
SE Sport Upgrade Package
Michigan Plant Built
Ford Corporate Badge
SE Badge
Feature Content Group 1
For Normal Temperature Zones
With English Language Label
Owner Hand Book Pack
Less Tyre Repair Service Kit
Power Frt Window-1 Tch Dwn-Dr Only
With Electric Rear Windows
Grille - Upper Blk Msh/Chrome Surnd
With Mini Overhead Console
Low Line Cubby Box
Int Environment Clr-Charcoal Black
Int Feat Colour - Charcoal Black
Less Floor Mat Kit
Front Floor Carpet Mats
Less Rear Floor Mats
With General Stowage Box
Sunvisor-Driver Vinyl W/Mirr Insert
Sunvisor-Pass Vinyl W/Mirr Insert
With Aluminum Interior Door Handles
Less Load Area Cover
Less Decklid Liner
With Load Floor Carpet
Grille-Lower Surround Hgh Gls Chrm
Rocker Panel Moulding -Cladding C/K
Less Exterior Door Frame Mouldings
With Rear Spoiler
With Dipping Rear View Mirror
Dual Power Mirrors-Manual Fold Back
With Body Coloured Exterior Mirror
Less Driver Seat Back Map Pocket
Passenger Seat Back Map Pocket
With Front 4 Way Headrest
Driver Seat Recliner - Lever
With Fixed Rear Seat Cushion
With Full Fold-Down Rear Seat
Less Rear Seat Centre Armrest
Less Driver Seat Lumbar Support
Less Temp Control Driver Seat
Less Temp Control Passengers Seat
With Driver 4 Way Mnl.Seat Adjuster
Less Fuel Economy Pack
Body Coloured Exterior Door Handle
Body Coloured Tailgate Handle
Key-Integral Fob
With Leather Gear Shift Knob
Less Keyless Entry System
Capless Fuel Filler Without Lock
Less Rear Window Wiper/Washer
With Variable Intermittent Windscreen Wiper
Less Sun Roof
Front Bumper - Painted Body Colour
Rear Bumper Body Coloured Plastic
Less Front License Plate Bracket
Side Air Bag - 1st & 2nd row
Less Tether Anchorage Restraint
With Mini Steel Spare Wheel
7 X 16" Alloy ET 50MM Style 2
Limited Service Mini Spare Tyre
Less Wheel Covers
With Kysor Radiator Shutter
Less Immersion Heater
Less Remote Starter
50 State Emission Requirements
Less Evaporative Emissions
Touring Suspension
Single Exhaust
With Mechanical Parking Brake
Standard Duty Fr/Rr Calp And Pads
With Rear Disc Brakes
Brakes-HLA/ESP/TC/ABS
Normal Fuel Fill
Less Keyless Entry/Elect - FIA
Less Rear Bumper Protector
Less Cargo Net - FIA
Less Remote Starter - FIA
Less Tape Stripes - FIA
Select Shift Tech (SST) W/Pad Shift
FFV-(Ethanol) Fuel
Standard Foot Pedal Pad Design
With Electric Power Steering
4 Spoke Leather Steering Wheel
With Speed Control
Less Auxiliary Heater
Conventional Instruments - Level 3
With MPH/KMH Speedometer
With Trip Computer
Less Instrument Gauges
With Compass Display
MFD High TFT Screen
With Message Centre
Less Navigation Data
With Perimeter Anti-Theft
Less Rear Parking Aid
Less Front Parking Aid
Less Automated Parking System
Standard Duty Battery
Less A/V Jack
Sgl Tun/Sgl CD + Sdars (LXF)
ICE Feature Pack 23
Extended Sync ICP Less Nav
With 6 Speakers
Less Cell Phone Interface System
With Media Gateway Module
With Steering Wheel Radio Controls
Less Column Stalk Radio Controls
Less Smokers Package
With Power Point Plug - Rear
Less Camera
Less Style Pack
Less Homelink
With Auto Headlamps
With Chrome Fog Lamp Bezel
With Halogen Headlamp
Less Daytime Running Lamps
With Front Fog Lamps
With Aluminium Headlamp Bezels
Less Interior Light Group
With Footwell Lights
With Header Mounted Map Light
With Front And Rear Lamp Bulb
Tail lamps - Level 1
With Automatic Headlamp Control
Oxford White
Generic Country Group 1
BV61-5310-NG* Left Front Coil
BV61-5310-NG* Right Front Coil
BV61-5560-NG* Left Rear Coil Spring
BV61-5560-NG* Right Rr Coil Spring
Outside Air Temperature Present
(+)"USA"
(-) GVMT Service Administration
(-)"CDN"
(-)"GU"
(-)"BZ"
(-)"BS"
(-)"KOR"
(-)"AW"
With Convenience Package
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Old 07-24-2012, 12:48 PM   #1374
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rsilvers View Post
There is no reason why it cannot refer to the previous results window back in time a bit (that it must have internally) and use that for the starting point of the computation. Ford simply chose not to implement it the way everyone else does.

The way they do it brings into question if the average results are trustworthy at all because at no point in my several mile highway drive was I getting only 25 mpg - so that value should never be figured into the average. Maybe it is not figured in, but I have no way of knowing.
It can't refer to results which were "erased" when you reset the trip computer. For it to start off higher than reality then drop is more suspect in my mind than giving it time to work out the actual average over a distance traveled. Its not going to give you instantaneous feedback.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rsilvers View Post
My vehicle says 38 on the sticker. Not sure if the VIN says flex fuel?

Focus (C346N), 2.0L Duratec DI TIVCT (160PS), Oxford White.

Primary Features
Build Date: 25.06.2012
Vehicle Line: Focus (C346N)
Body Style: 4 Door Saloon
Series: SE
Engine: 2.0L Duratec DI TIVCT (160PS)
Transmission: 6 Speed Auto Transmission DCPS
Drive: LHD FWD
Emission: 50 State Emission Requirements
Air Conditioning: Manual Air Conditioning
Paint: Oxford White

FFV-(Ethanol) Fuel
That bolded line indicates that at least according to Oasis and the ETIS page your car was built with the Flex Fuel compatibility.
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Old 07-24-2012, 01:02 PM   #1375
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suss6052 View Post
It can't refer to results which were "erased" when you reset the trip computer. For it to start off higher than reality then drop is more suspect in my mind than giving it time to work out the actual average over a distance traveled. Its not going to give you instantaneous feedback.
Surely the Ford internally knows the instantaneous result, even if it does not display it. My way (which is actually the Honda and Toyota way as well) does not start out higher than reality and drop. It just starts out with an instantaneous result and then keeps a running average.
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Old 07-24-2012, 01:10 PM   #1376
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rsilvers View Post
Surely the Ford internally knows the instantaneous result, even if it does not display it. My way (which is actually the Honda and Toyota way as well) does not start out higher than reality and drop. It just starts out with an instantaneous result and then keeps a running average.
The car is constantly monitoring fuel flow, as well as air flow, but I couldn't tell you without knowing how they calculate fuel economy how it actually works.

Ford deliberately made it an average mpg display in the trip computer, there is no code for it to calculate an instant mpg on Focus Models sold in North America. If you're looking for instant feedback you'd need to tap into the obd II port with a scan tool of some sort, but even this is not necessarily accurate if its making an interpretation of the same data as the trip computer/ car itself.

It appears that while it might start off nearer to where it was before it tends to have to think about it first starting from a lower number as its sample size is too small to give an accurate reading until eventually stabilizing somewhere near the steady state condition.

The average is constantly shifting through out the entire trip and or tank due to various driving conditions and it does take them into account, not always successfully however. Sometimes the end result is higher or lower than that shown by the mi/gallon method, but which is more accurate is hard to tell in small scale 1-2 tank measurements, you need to average both over longer periods of time, but this is off topic to the discussion of the DCT.
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Old 07-24-2012, 01:33 PM   #1377
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suss6052 View Post
Ford deliberately made it an average mpg display in the trip computer, there is no code for it to calculate an instant mpg on Focus Models sold in North America.

It appears that while it might start off nearer to where it was before it tends to have to think about it first starting from a lower number as its sample size is too small to give an accurate reading until eventually stabilizing somewhere near the steady state condition.
I am not looking for a real-time instantaneous display. I am quite fine with the fact that Ford chose not to have an instant MPG mode, as I think they are useless.

Are you saying that the car, internally, does not know how much fuel it is injecting and what speed you are going? That is impossible.
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Old 07-24-2012, 01:42 PM   #1378
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rsilvers View Post
I am not looking for a real-time instantaneous display. I am quite fine with the fact that Ford chose not to have an instant MPG mode, as I think they are useless.

Are you saying that the car, internally, does not know how much fuel it is injecting and what speed you are going? That is impossible.
What I said was that it will not use that instantaneous data in the MPG calculation until a sufficient sample size has occured such as to generate the moving average again.

It needs the fuel flow data in order to figure out what the injector pulsewidths need to be and all the rest of the internal parameters, it just won't give them to you in the form of a real time instant fuel economy measurement.

Again, could we please get back on the topic of the DCT, its behaviors and the updates that have gone on so far.

I just past 2800 miles on my car and so far apart from me provoking it in manual mode at low speed and maybe one or two times in drive when it was in too low a gear after coasting down and would wind out to 3-4k before shifting after slowing down to a light then accelerating again before shifting up. It assumes that I want power and decides to hold the gear which is nice, although it may feel abrupt compared to having just been slowing down.
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Old 07-24-2012, 03:05 PM   #1379
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The PCM does not monitor fuel flow per se.
Fuel flow (consumption) is derived from the intake air flow (MAF sensor).
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Old 07-26-2012, 04:55 AM   #1380
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Upgrade

I had my 2012 Focus upgraded and it seemed to make the shudder and hesitation worse. I am hoping it will smooth out over time.
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