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Old 12-09-2011, 10:09 AM   #51
zak404
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSR84 View Post
The manual also states that running premium will result in increase performance.

Most engines are tuned with high and low ignition tables. Which if is true for the Focus it would make sense why they recommend regular but also state that premium will increase performance(Page 354 "Octane recommendations" last sentence in the owners manual.). One day I'll hook it up to my Dash Hawk and try and figure it out.

My G8's had high and low octane tables and running on the low octane table the car made around 8HP less than the high octane table (Stock). It switched to the low octane table when it detected a predetermined knock count withing a set time frame. It was kind of a PITA when trying to tune the thing because it was pretty sensitive and switch over when it wasn't needed. I ended up just cloning the high table on to the low since I wasn't planning on running anything less than 94.
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Old 12-10-2011, 12:29 PM   #52
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The owners manual does state that using Premium Unleaded gas will increase performance. I just don't see the need to spend 10% more on premium fuel when the most I will get out of it is 2 - 3% more horsepower.
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Old 12-10-2011, 02:24 PM   #53
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Actually on pg 354 it talks about some parts of the country regular gas is 85 octane and that the car will run better on premium than 85.

It does not say it will run better with premium than the 87 octane available to most of us.

This is the third time in this thread i have mentioned this.
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Old 12-10-2011, 02:38 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dgc333 View Post
Actually on pg 354 it talks about some parts of the country regular gas is 85 octane and that the car will run better on premium than 85.

It does not say it will run better with premium than the 87 octane available to most of us.

This is the third time in this thread i have mentioned this.
And you are correct, but many don't want to be bothered by facts. The fact is, if your car knocks moderately or heavily under load, including when starting from a stop, then it may be due to fuel with a low octane rating. In this case, change stations and run 87 octane, or switch to mid-grade or premium fuel with an indicated octane rating above 87.
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Old 12-30-2011, 05:06 AM   #55
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Here in Australia the Focus uses the same 2 Liter GDI engine. However, all performance figures supplied by Ford here for the Focus, are explicitly stated as being in relation to Premium gas (the USA equivalent of 91 Octane).

In other words, the recommended fuel for the Focus is 91-98 RON (87-94 in USA) and I've read elsewhere that while it will run on regular, Premium is preferred.

The engine is rated in the USA at 120 kW (160 HP) and that's on regular. Here, the engine is rated at 125 kW (167 HP), but that's on Premium. No figures are available here for Regular.

It could be that the car is tuned differently here - I wouldn't know. However, the implication is that Premium gives an extra 7 HP.
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Old 12-30-2011, 12:26 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dgc333 View Post
Actually on pg 354 it talks about some parts of the country regular gas is 85 octane and that the car will run better on premium than 85.

It does not say it will run better with premium than the 87 octane available to most of us.

This is the third time in this thread i have mentioned this.
Just because you've mentioned it 3 times doesn't mean you're correct.

Focus Owner's Guide Two Thousand & Twelve, Page 354, Para 4. (Canada)

"Your vehicle is designed to use "Regular" unleaded gasoline with a pump (R+M)/2 octane rating of 87. Some stations offer fuels posted as "Regular" with octane ratings below 87, particularly in high altitude areas. Fuels with octane levels below 87 are not recommended. Premium fuels will provide improved performance."

Now I'm not an English major but the last sentence doesn't have a dependent clause linking it to the previous sentences, nor does it have any conjoining words. This paragraph is providing us with 4 key pieces of information 1) You vehicle is designed to run on 87. 2) Some stations offer fuels with an octane rating below 87. 3) Running fuel with octane ratings below 87 is not recommended. 4) Running premium will improve performance. 1 and 4 are a bit conflicting but I think I covered my theory on that is my previous post. (Provided below)

Listen, I'm not saying your wrong, because I have no actual proof and the last sentence is a bit ambiguous however, from my interpretation of the manual it states that "Premium fuel will improve performance". It doesn't say ", therefor running premium fuel in areas where (R+M)/2 87 is not available will improve performance. I said right in my post "One day I'll figure it out" because at this time all I have is my interpretation of the manual.

My original post for your convenience.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JSR84 View Post
The manual also states that running premium will result in increase performance.

Most modern engines are tuned with high and low ignition tables. Which if true for the Focus, it would make sense why they recommend regular but also state that premium will increase performance(Page 354 "Octane recommendations" last sentence in the owners manual.). One day I'll hook it up to my Dash Hawk and try and figure it out.

My G8's had high and low octane tables and running on the low octane table the car made around 8HP less than the high octane table (Stock). It switched to the low octane table when it detected a predetermined knock count withing a set time frame. It was kind of a PITA when trying to tune the thing because it was pretty sensitive and switch over when it wasn't needed. I ended up just cloning the high table on to the low since I wasn't planning on running anything less than 94.
God I miss that car.
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Old 12-30-2011, 01:36 PM   #57
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The reason regular gas at high altitudes has a lower octane is because the thinner air lowers compression levels, and therefore makes detonation less likely with a lower octane fuel.
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Old 12-31-2011, 08:00 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSR84 View Post
Just because you've mentioned it 3 times doesn't mean you're correct.

Focus Owner's Guide Two Thousand & Twelve, Page 354, Para 4. (Canada)

"Your vehicle is designed to use "Regular" unleaded gasoline with a pump (R+M)/2 octane rating of 87. Some stations offer fuels posted as "Regular" with octane ratings below 87, particularly in high altitude areas. Fuels with octane levels below 87 are not recommended. Premium fuels will provide improved performance."

Now I'm not an English major but the last sentence doesn't have a dependent clause linking it to the previous sentences, nor does it have any conjoining words. This paragraph is providing us with 4 key pieces of information 1) You vehicle is designed to run on 87. 2) Some stations offer fuels with an octane rating below 87. 3) Running fuel with octane ratings below 87 is not recommended. 4) Running premium will improve performance. 1 and 4 are a bit conflicting but I think I covered my theory on that is my previous post. (Provided below)

Listen, I'm not saying your wrong, because I have no actual proof and the last sentence is a bit ambiguous however, from my interpretation of the manual it states that "Premium fuel will improve performance". It doesn't say ", therefor running premium fuel in areas where (R+M)/2 87 is not available will improve performance. I said right in my post "One day I'll figure it out" because at this time all I have is my interpretation of the manual.

My original post for your convenience.



EDIT
The last sentence is related to the others because it is part of the same paragraph, that is english grammar. If that sentence was not related it would be part of another paragraph.
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Old 12-31-2011, 09:24 AM   #59
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Why not just find the gas you like and use it? Who really cares if it is better or not? None of it is going to hurt your engine or void warranty.
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Old 12-31-2011, 10:33 AM   #60
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The manual is clear. Premium improves performance. Manual notwithstanding, it stands to reason that higher octane is beneficial for a car with 12 to 1 compression. There are two questions the manual and common automotive sense don't answer. First, does premium solve any of the complaints like shuddering? Some on this forum have reported that it does. I use premium and have had no shuddering or other issues. Second, is the added cost worth it? I doubt premium's added cost is worth the performance gains or MPG gain (if any -- regular may give better MPG).

So as I see it, premium is worth a try if you've had shuddering or other performance issues, or if you're a leadfoot who wants to see whether there is a power improvement.

Once I have about 4k miles, I intend to switch off premium to see how regular compares in the fuel economy department as that is my principal concern.
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