Weighed my car yesterday......

[pelotonracer2]

Yeah, you're 26 and you're in the Navy... That's all I need to say about that!! Like I said, you were 8 years old when I graduated college and started my own engineering R&D company in the marine industry. There's definately alot of brainwashed (ie: close minded) and ignorant people on these boards! It's no wonder there's nothing "new" as far as these cars are concerned in the last 2-3 years! Everyone reads something here and thinks it's the "end all".

I work with and consult for some of the biggest automotive and marine companies in the world. I also work with, through and around patents and patent rights. I get paid to look at OEM parts ("one offs", racing parts and made out of alot of exotic materials) and I do ALOT of testing (using chassis and engine dynos, Stalker rader gun with acceleration software (STATS) which is the industry standard in the automotive/marine industries for performance data aquisition, flowbench and wind tunnel testing. I also find ways to implement technology in the marine industry that is used in other industries (my specialty is actually fluid dynamics).

This little car is nothing too advanced or fancy from a technology point of view compared to what I work with every single day at work... It's more like a little "toy" (and I will enjoy playing with it).

I only share my findings with you people because I'm an enthusiast just like yourselves. Perhaps I should just keep it to myself since no one takes the time to read my posts (or just read bits and pieces which would no doubt make very little sense to anyone). I haven't seen any real indepth discussion on any of the things I've touched on based on my searches. This forum is 98% 1 or 2 liners and that's about it. Bottom line is: I learned along time ago just because the vocal majority "says so" doesn't mean it is....

Perhaps if you READ what I had to say in the first place, you wouldn't ask dumb and redundant questions like:

"I'd like him to try the stock coil verse the aftermarket one to see what, if any difference there will be"

I already said the car wouldn't run smootly without the aftermarket coil with the plugs and "mod" I'm running.

Please explain to me how I can test my "mod" on a dyno without the benefit of the stronger/better spark when it won't idle and it misses with the stock coil and wires?? Isn't it the general consensus you can run a wider gap with the aftermarket coils???? I could care a less if the coil does anything by itself. I never said or implied I saw any gains with the coil by itself on the dyno (in fact I've never even attempted it).

I'm sorry you don't like reading my posts. Like I said before, if you think I'm so FOS then by all means stop reading and responding to my posts!

Originally Posted by SpeedOften

The Charger weighed 2750lbs and is a perfect example of your arguement of what weight savings can do. Figures someone so advanced in the art of taking a step outside the box and looking in couldn't see that, not to mention reading.


When you say you have much more experience, you sir... are assuming. You are assuming that I am some 18yr old, of which I'm not. I'll leave it at that.

Try a 6 to 3rd gear drop at 60 mph.

You should be able to hit 60mph in 2nd gear.

The redline in the SVT is 7200rpm, 100rpm short of your "last car". Tom's tune, unless asked for somehting different, normally resets this to 7400rpm.


As for German engineers... Have you heard that the SVT, was actually the ST170 from Ford of Europe, err it's more like the rest of the world...


Poppin, no where did I try and tell him the "shut up". I just said, in my opinion, which is what IMO stands for... That he fluffs his points up way too much, which in my opinion makes his posts annoying. We don't need to hear about how many years he's been in the industry or about how he's praised for seeing things that other don't.. I read that, and my reaction was, "So, what?"... He talks about the TB being restrictive.. yeah.. I'm pretty sure it's been covered... He expressed his opinion about the gearing, but most likely due to his ECU not having the most up-to-date reflash, he isn't feeling what I'm feeling when I ravage my whore around town (2nd, 3rd and 4th gears)?

Actions have always spoke louder than words, to me...

I'd like him to try the stock coil verse the aftermarket one to see what, if any difference there will be.

[jestercow]

Originally Posted by pelotonracer2

...I only share my findings with you people because I'm an enthusiast just like yourselves....

we're "those people" now, and I was just trying to learn

I'm sorry we're not all billionaires with 9845364 years of experience in the field. I'm 24. I bought the car because it was inexpensive, fun to drive, and not a Honda - the majority of people here probably share at least two of these reasons. I don't feel like getting trashed, but it seems inappropriate to come here with such a ridiculous superiority complex and make everyone who's here to learn and help each other feel like we somehow owe you something for being the be-all end-all of the focus world. I appreciate the useful ideas and posts you've contributed as I've learned quite a bit here, but please keep it clean...the rest of us are here to have fun.

[pelotonracer2]

No disrespect was intended. I was only letting you guys know my background so that you understand that I'm not some knumbnut off the street with no prior experience. I don't like having to "defend" myself from utter stupidity (ignorance is bliss to some folks I guess), especially since the person(s) who are attacking me obviously either can't read or choose to only read what they want and then can't comprehend what I'm saying. It's like trying to have a constructive conversation with a brick wall.

For what it is worth, I never once claimed to be the "God" of Foci. In fact one of the other reasons I read and post here is to get an idea of other peoples experiences, as well as sharing my own. When I have a part sitting on my work bench, I just know what I'm looking at when I see it, especially when it comes to "why something does or doesn't work". After searching for two hours last night I still haven't found anything regarding the points I touched on, other than the MSD coil doesn't improve power by itself, which has nothing to do with what I originally posted.

I would advise everyone to just take what *ANYONE* says on this forum with a grain of salt.

I for one will be much more careful what I share from here on out due to so much cynicism from people who TRULY think they know everything. When I'm finished with this project I'll provide some info then.

Originally Posted by jestercow

we're "those people" now, and I was just trying to learn

I'm sorry we're not all billionaires with 9845364 years of experience in the field. I'm 24. I bought the car because it was inexpensive, fun to drive, and not a Honda - the majority of people here probably share at least two of these reasons. I don't feel like getting trashed, but it seems inappropriate to come here with such a ridiculous superiority complex and make everyone who's here to learn and help each other feel like we somehow owe you something for being the be-all end-all of the focus world. I appreciate the useful ideas and posts you've contributed as I've learned quite a bit here, but please keep it clean...the rest of us are here to have fun.

[SpeedOften]

Originally Posted by pelotonracer2

Yeah, you're 26 and you're in the Navy... That's all I need to say about that!! Like I said, you were 8 years old when I graduated college and started my own engineering R&D company in the marine industry. There's definately alot of brainwashed (ie: close minded) and ignorant people on these boards! It's no wonder there's nothing "new" as far as these cars are concerned in the last 2-3 years! Everyone reads something here and thinks it's the "end all".

I work with and consult for some of the biggest automotive and marine companies in the world. I also work with, through and around patents and patent rights. I get paid to look at OEM parts ("one offs", racing parts and made out of alot of exotic materials) and I do ALOT of testing (using chassis and engine dynos, Stalker rader gun with acceleration software (STATS) which is the industry standard in the automotive/marine industries for performance data aquisition, flowbench and wind tunnel testing. I also find ways to implement technology in the marine industry that is used in other industries (my specialty is actually fluid dynamics).

This little car is nothing too advanced or fancy from a technology point of view compared to what I work with every single day at work... It's more like a little "toy" (and I will enjoy playing with it).

I only share my findings with you people because I'm an enthusiast just like yourselves. Perhaps I should just keep it to myself since no one takes the time to read my posts (or just read bits and pieces which would no doubt make very little sense to anyone). I haven't seen any real indepth discussion on any of the things I've touched on based on my searches. This forum is 98% 1 or 2 liners and that's about it. Bottom line is: I learned along time ago just because the vocal majority "says so" doesn't mean it is....

Perhaps if you READ what I had to say in the first place, you wouldn't ask dumb and redundant questions like:

"I'd like him to try the stock coil verse the aftermarket one to see what, if any difference there will be"

I already said the car wouldn't run smootly without the aftermarket coil with the plugs and "mod" I'm running.

Please explain to me how I can test my "mod" on a dyno without the benefit of the stronger/better spark when it won't idle and it misses with the stock coil and wires?? Isn't it the general consensus you can run a wider gap with the aftermarket coils???? I could care a less if the coil does anything by itself. I never said or implied I saw any gains with the coil by itself on the dyno (in fact I've never even attempted it).

I'm sorry you don't like reading my posts. Like I said before, if you think I'm so FOS then by all means stop reading and responding to my posts!

You obviously have no idea what a Nuke is in the Navy, nor do you know anything about the Navy, or else you wouldn't be assuming like you are. And woopidy doo dah on fluid dynamics.. I learned about that as well and I'm f'n electrician. So What makes me so inferior about being a Nuke in the Navy than anyone else, b/c that is what you're implying right? Did you know 99% of the Nuclear reactors in the entire US are being run by former Navy Nukes? Three Mile Island was saved by a ex-Navy nuke... It could have been much worse.

So how does a 21 yr old straight out of college afford to build his own business and actually have any worth customer base?

How do you know that the stock coil won't provide the voltage needed? Have you tried it? You have yet to say whether you have or not. In earlier posts you said you hadn't performed the mod yet, so have you? If not, how can you say yay or nay on whether you need an aftermarket coil or not. I have not had any misses or idling issues with the stock coil and aftermarket wires on my car. Couldn't that just be a tune related issue you have yet to resolve on your car. How do you know whether by upgrading the three major ground wires on this car whether that will help - people have noticed a major difference in the smoothness at which the engine runs. I think you're not understanding what I'm asking... And you're being as much of a douche as I was to you earlier. Resistance, Current, and Voltage.. is my shit, so please divulge what numbers you have to prove any gains...


General consensus is that we're already gapping the plugs and running the stock coil with just aftermarket wires with some minimal results... From what I have read / saw / experienced, changing to an aftermarket coil has not lead to increasing the distance of the gap compared to that of the gapping when using the stock coil.

Did I say in my last post that you were FOS?

[pelotonracer2]

Originally Posted by SpeedOften

You obviously have no idea what a Nuke is in the Navy, nor do you know anything about the Navy, or else you wouldn't be assuming like you are. And woopidy doo dah on fluid dynamics.. I learned about that as well and I'm f'n electrician. So What makes me so inferior about being a Nuke in the Navy than anyone else, b/c that is what you're implying right? Did you know 99% of the Nuclear reactors in the entire US are being run by former Navy Nukes? Three Mile Island was saved by a ex-Navy nuke... It could have been much worse.

So how does a 21 yr old straight out of college afford to build his own business and actually have any worth customer base?

How do you know that the stock coil won't provide the voltage needed? Have you tried it? You have yet to say whether you have or not. In earlier posts you said you hadn't performed the mod yet, so have you? If not, how can you say yay or nay on whether you need an aftermarket coil or not. I have not had any misses or idling issues with the stock coil and aftermarket wires on my car. Couldn't that just be a tune related issue you have yet to resolve on your car. How do you know whether by upgrading the three major ground wires on this car whether that will help - people have noticed a major difference in the smoothness at which the engine runs. I think you're not understanding what I'm asking... And you're being as much of a douche as I was to you earlier. Resistance, Current, and Voltage.. is my shit, so please divulge what numbers you have to prove any gains...


General consensus is that we're already gapping the plugs and running the stock coil with just aftermarket wires with some minimal results... From what I have read / saw / experienced, changing to an aftermarket coil has not lead to increasing the distance of the gap compared to that of the gapping when using the stock coil.

Did I say in my last post that you were FOS?

What do Nuclear reactors have to do with how a car is designed?

"So how does a 21 yr old straight out of college afford to build his own business and actually have any worth customer base?"

I was involved with the "motorsports" end of the personal watercraft industry since I was 16 years old (I raced in the Expert and Pro classes in IJSBA closed course events for 5 years with success against big money factory race teams). After successes there and graduating from from college in upstate N.Y. with a mechanical engineering degree, it was a natural fit for me to start a business. I started it with a dollar in my pocket and a few good ideas... my time spent in the sport and my reputation is how I managed to secure a customer base.

By 2004 my company and our in-house corporate race team had won 33 regional championships, one National Championship and one World Championship. In 2005, I closed my retail establishment and now I work closely with the OEMs doing consulting work (it pays three times as much and I only have to work 1/3 of what I used to). That's pretty much a no brainer! I'm also very much involved in the cycling community and plan on unveiling my own line of high end road bikes in the next 12-18 months.

The stock coil puts out less voltage than the MSD. I've tested it. It's not a huge difference but it is enough. Perhaps you should too. And for the third and last time, using the stock coil caused problems running the plug mod and the MSD didn't. That's all that I care about. I wouldn't have even tried the MSD and wires otherwise (I tried it without first). Other than more voltage, I have no idea why it works better than the stock coil, and I didn't question it. The car ran fine with the stock plugs, stock coil and stock wires so I know nothing was wrong with any of those parts (the stock plugs had nice coloration between the shell and the porcelin part of the plug). With the copper plugs and the modified electrode, the engine ran rough and missed. The plugs were wet with fuel, so you tell me what that means? Hmmmmn...

I guess it's impossible for anyone to come up with anything new AND MAKE A CLAIM THAT IT ACTUALLY WORKS in this forum, especially if it's the general consensus that it's been done before. I don't sell anything and I have nothing to gain or benefit by sharing my findings. Indexing the plugs and the electrode modification with the copper plugs works. I had to buy two hours of dyno time to do the testing. I did before and after and then went back to everything stock. Right now I'm just trying to verify fuel economy and longevity before I come out and tell people what I did to the plugs.

This is my last post on this subject. If someone wants to continue the discussion based on our cars weight or power to weight ratio or want to post up your cars weight then I'd be glad to continue posting.

[SpeedOften]

Originally Posted by pelotonracer2

After successes there and graduating from from college in upstate N.Y. with a mechanical engineering degree

RPI? RIT? or somewhere else? If RPI, you probably had nukes in your classes since mechanical engineering is the easiest degree to aquire from the nuke program since we get the core credits from the 2 years of school before we even see a ship in the fleet.

Originally Posted by pelotonracer2

What do Nuclear reactors have to do with how a car is designed?

A Lot... Heat transfer, fluid dynamics, material composition - metals, chemistry and corrosions, anything electrical (for Electricians and ET's)... Without going in depth.. I'd say quite a bit...

Originally Posted by pelotonracer2

I had to buy two hours of dyno time to do the testing. I did before and after and then went back to everything stock. Right now I'm just trying to verify fuel economy and longevity before I come out and tell people what I did to the plugs.

So you have done the modifications... In your ealier posts it was confusing on whether you had actually performed the modification or not. So you dyno'd the car.. any dyno sheets of before and after?


I appologize for coming off like an ass.. but your earlier posts came across exactly the way Jestercrow posted, I should have been a little more civil in my response and in my way of informing you of my opinion.

If there isn't a significant difference in the output voltage between the stock coil and the aftermarket (Screamin' Demon?), there may be another reason why the engine was missing. Did you use dielectric grease on the plugs? Do you know what the current rating is on the aftermarket coil? It shouldn't be much different than stock b/c it doesn't blow the fuse or melt the wiring harness.

[pelotonracer2]

I used an MSD coil, not the Screamin Demon. Like I said before there is a noticeable difference in voltage between the MSD and stock coil (but it's not like thousands of volts). You can also "visually" see a difference in the quality and strength of spark by grounding the plug against the block and firing it. Perhaps my stock coil is out of spec (I didn't test two different stock coils) and I don't have a shop manual to verify the range. What I do know is the car runs fine with the stock stuff, but once you modify the electrode (which also facilitates a wider gap and a radically different ground electrode) the engine runs erratically, misses and idle quality is no good. With the MSD coil and wires it runs just fine. The actual power gain using the mod and indexing the plugs is approximately 2-3% which is about what I expected since I've done this mod to alot of different cars. Typically you see 1-2hp per cylinder depending on combustion chamber design, compression and intake/exhaust valve/port efficiency. It's not alot but it's still something... and on these cars every little bit helps!

I can see this working better than using an open style spark plug like Brisk for instance because even though it is "open" it still uses 4 points for the negative electrode, which means if the path of least resistance is the negative electrode on the back side of the plug, the actual extended length electrode of the longer plug becomes a restriction. With a standard plug with a single point electrode, you can actually point the plug directly at the exhaust port (the whole point in indexing plugs in the first place).

Yes, I have plenty of dyno runs of before and after and then back to stock again (12 pulls in all). The only mod I had at the time was a K&N panel filter in the OEM SVT airbox. I saw 148hp and 137 pft at the front wheels (average of first four runs). After swapping out the parts (which took 15 minutes), the average went to 152hp & 141pft (four runs total). Back to stock again and 20 minutes later we did 4 more runs and the average was 147hp & 135 pft. Pretty consistant I'd have to say. This power increase was pretty consistant from around 2500 to red line so yes it did add some power under the curve (and 4-5hp peak)

I plan on doing dyno tests every time I make a change. I don't have access to a scanner at the moment so you'll just have to take my word for it for now. However when I'm completely finished with this project (maybe spring/summer of 2008) I will make all my documentation available for everyone to read (including the results of removing as much weight as possible).

[HaveBlue83]

what the hell is going on in this thread.....

it's like great info in the wrong thread.......

[pelotonracer2]

Originally Posted by HaveBlue83

what the hell is going on in this thread.....

it's like great info in the wrong thread.......

Tends to happen alot on these forums, huh?

[SVTRSST]

Originally Posted by HaveBlue83

shit...I forgot how much gas I had.........I gotta go do it again today...lol....

only cost me $2 to do it.........at a grain scale....I'll try it and check the fuel this time...lol...

ahahahhahahahaha omfg LOL