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Old 02-26-2013, 09:09 AM   #1
BlkNite713
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Daily Driver Engine Build 350-450whp>:D

Hey guys:

I am finally deciding its time to do my turbo engine build. Yes i know i would get a better response in the f/i section but i cannot access that for reasons unknown. Just wanted to get some input and see what you guys thought i could improve on/add what im missing. Most of the work will be done by myself on a spare SVT block I was able to get cheap :D

Quick Questions First.

1. Will the stock block(Completely Built) be able handle 400-450whp?

2. With a Qual LSD and a stg 5 clutch upgrade, will the getrag/Stock axles be able to even handle torque over 350lbs?

3.I have seen alot of people including Tom saying the stock head does not need to be touched for 300whp, what about 350-400whp? Just port and polish, replace val and ret, leave cams stock and call it a day?

Your going to notice i have mods that might not be a "Neccessity" and i am missing alot of little things. Any help would be appreciated; I want to do it right the first time incase i decide to change from 350 to 450hp and so on.

Engine

-Massive Speed Supertech Pistons 85.5mm 8:7:1
-Eagle Rods
-If Head Needs Porting and upgrading will go either(Topspeed Stg2 Or Massive Ultimate) Which One is better?
-Stock Cams...(If Needed To Change, Will Go Cat Cams)
-CFM High Performance Oil Pump(Needed?)
-Replace Water Pump(For Reliability)
-ARP Studs(Main, Head)
-Crankshaft.....(I Have No Idea)
-Replace/Clean Exsisting Oil Cooler
-PVC Delete
-Topspeed Intake Manifold (Buy:Hp Gains Are Very Promising )
-CFM 67mmTB (Already Have)
-Obviously Full gasket replacement

Drivetrain

-Qual LSD
-Spec Stg 5 Clutch, Aluminum Flywheel
-Arp Flywheel Bolts
-Axles...?(Not Sure On Handling Capacity)



Thanks ahead of time before hand. I really appreciate it!

Best Regards,

Anthony


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Old 02-26-2013, 10:39 AM   #2
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Tires, deffinetly tires haha.
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Old 02-26-2013, 10:40 AM   #3
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Hahaha that's your advice. Yeah I have a whole electronics part of this build but I'm choosing to exclude it because I'm mainly concerned about engine support as this is my first engine build, but not my first boosted car
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Old 02-26-2013, 11:19 AM   #4
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Just a thought, I saw you mentioned water pump for reliability. I presume this is a build on an older car with high miles? I thought about the same thing on my SVTF when it comes time to either overhaul or buy a new car.

If I were doing a full engine build, I personally would replace EVERYTHING possible. All pulleys, tensioners, etc on both the timing belt and accessory belt. Water pump for sure.

I had a shop do my timing belt & clutch. I gladly paid for all the pulleys and tensioners and water pump. Those parts are cheap, stupid cheap, and there's no reason not to replace them if your into the build that deep. It'd be a shame to do such a monumental build and have a timing belt failure caused by a $25 pulley or tensioner that failed. It's rarely an issue of the belt physically breaking. For most timing belt failures the belt may have been fine until a pulley failed.

I'd consider checking all hoses, both for coolant and vacuum. It will save you headaches later. Stupid little things can be annoying, like the rubber hose on the PCV valve is stupidly close to the exhaust manifold, it dry rots easily.

You may as well change all the little crap like that to ensure you don't have to try and chase down something annoying like a vacuum leak while trying to tune a newly built and turboed engine. I know you mentioned a PCV delete, but just using that as an example. Rubber hoses on 9-11 year old cars could definitely use refreshing if you're building up an engine!

As far as axles handling the torque, or heads flowing enough for 350+ hp, I don't have the expertise to address. But wanted to wish you best of luck with the build!

And when you get it done I'd consider a trip to Reading to see it and buy ya a beer for a chance to ride shotgun and see if I want to spend this kind of money on my SVTF down the line.
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Old 02-26-2013, 11:36 AM   #5
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Just as a quick thought, I would think if you can get oversized valves, every extra mm in diameter you can get will help. Especially if you have thoughts of going as high as 450 hp!

I think I personally would be more than happy with 350 FWD! I'm considering a LS3-480 in the Mazdaspeed Miata down the line, and even with RWD my friends laugh at me for thinking I'll do anything but light tires on fire when I try and accelerate!

If you want to daily drive it, 350 hp might be more than plenty. I've seen pics of FWD drag cars that can put that kind of power down, but you can't drive to the grocery store with those crazy wide wheels and non-DOT tires.

Might be worth a call to Tom, I am pretty sure he's done this kind of thing multiple times, he might be able to offer much better advice in regards to the head, crank, etc.
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Old 02-26-2013, 12:37 PM   #6
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Thanks for the advice. The motor I'm using is a 60k motor. Regardless most oem misc stuff will be replaced ie water pump and gaskets. All bolts will be arp or felpro. I will take you up on that offer when I finish the build hahaha. Most people think fwd is hard to control, but I'm going to use a launch controller and a boost by gear box to slowly stage the psi progressions to control traction. Yes all hoses that look damaged will be replaced and any bushings in the suspension will be checked or replaced. As far as headwork if I go massive speed I will also be upgrading to their 1mm valves. I have emailed Tom but I know how busy he is with current projects to I have not "spammed" his mail box lol. Hopefully he will see this thread and chin in because honestly I want him on board for the tuning. I personally don't trust anyone else with this type of extensive work plus he's the best of the best so yeah it's a no brainer
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Old 02-27-2013, 06:43 AM   #7
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So some research has led me to the conclusion that the block and crank are good for well over 500hp as claimed by other foci members. So that takes care of that question. But does anyone know about the axles or Getrag tranny itself? Some members are saying that over 300whp to do a 5speed swap because the MTX-75 holds high TQ, but some say the opposite...... Tom is claiming over 350tq with a LSD. Im just a little worried about longevity because like i said this will be a DD, and im not sure Tom drives his as much as i will...... Anyone have direct experience with Axle failure or Tranny failure do to high TQ numbers?????

Please help Lol
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Old 02-27-2013, 08:45 AM   #8
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Might be worth googling around the Mini Cooper S world, they have the same Getrag tranny. I know a guy that boosted his to 400 hp, he didn't mention any tranny or axle upgrades or failures, but that's not to say 1 data point is enough to call it safe.

Just thought another car with the same trans might be worth surfing forums to see how that community feels about high power int he Getrag trans.
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Old 02-27-2013, 10:13 AM   #9
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Yeah im still coming up with mixed numbers. Im sure with a LSD and supporting clutch it shouldnt be a problem as long as your not partial clutching and slamming the shifter into gears. I am coming to the conclusion that i will have to find out the hard way LOL.
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Old 02-27-2013, 10:41 AM   #10
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if you're looking for DD reliability I'd strongly advise stay to the low end of your power goals. 350 hp is still more than double the stock output! The higher you push the more things are going to break.

Oh and with "Great Power comes Great Cooling Responsibility!" The stock cooling system was designed to handle the thermal load of the stock engine, by doubling the output you're going to have a much higher heat load, even ignoring engine bay ambient temps from the space heater like turbine housing.

If you intend to daily drive in the summer, I'd highly suggest a big radiator, possibly a dual pass? But managing your extra heat load will help reduce the stress on other stuff in the engine bay. Keeping things sufficiently cool will hopefully help things break less
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