Well based on the most recent prices I could find for my region on E85/regular:
Using the above for combined, city/hw, the cost based on 400 miles:
E85@$3.35 ~ 400/23mpg = 17.39gallons x $3.35 = $58.26
Regular87@$3.55 ~400/31mpg = 12.9gallons x $3.55 = $45.81
So using the less costly gas will cost you an extra $12.45 here in Ohio to travel 400 miles (about $10.50/14.41 for highway/city driving.)
true,, i've always maintained that any partial or full ethanol fuel was a waste of money.... unfortunately in my state 10% in now mandatory .... i long for 'real' gas again...
That has always seemed to be the story with alcohol based or blened fuel. It may burn cleaner but it takes more of it to get the same or more out of it than gas. Look at some race cars, they get insane power out ethenol or methenol or whatever, but its like putting a garden hose into the engine to get that power.
I used ethanol a couple of tanks and let me tell you it ZAPS your mileage! I went from getting 26 in the city to MAYBE 20 and on the highway expect maybe 25 MPG! If I remember correctly it only got like 200 miles per tank so I stopped using that quickly.
that and whenever it got remotely cold outside it took it three times as long to start up
I just drove my 2012 with about 8500 miles to a town 35 miles away on E85 here in NW Iowa. Readout is 30.2 mpg and E85 is priced $2.999 vs E10 @$3.499 and E0 87octane @ $3.599. My share of production at three different ethanol plants is 220,000 gallons per year so I'm sticking with the E85.
Don't know if any of you pay attention to the CBOT or New York Harbor wholesale prices but if you look today at the May 13 contracts you will see ethanol at $2.34 a gallon and RBOB gasoline at $3.13. The ethanol industry can't help it that the middlemen and retailers are ripping the public off.
So hybrids and electric cars make more sense if you don't care about power or fuel economy, and want to stick it to the guys in suits in the Middle East. I want great handling first and MPGs second. Looks like if I lived in an E85 area I'd have to buy a supercharger for my Focus. Great compromise.
As you all know (and i forgot to mention in my O.p.) ethanol has far fewer BTUs of power per unit than gasoline hence the drastic drops in mileage. IMO, i don't feel ethanol is a viable alternative to reg. gasoline considering all the fossil fuel it takes to grow and transport ethanol (which can't be transported by pipeline due to corrosiveness) to me it just doesn't make sense.. I say grow food to feed people not vehicles.
Amen. All mandates and quotas need to be eliminated. E10 just needs to go away, leave E85 out there for those who think it is some how a viable alternative, and make the ethanol industry prove it is without government mandates and or subsidies. If the producers can get it to market at a competitive price for it's reduced MPG and consumers buy it, great. If they all go out of business, well that is the free market economy at work.
You guys need to read this and do what you can to stop oil subsidies also. Some are listed at the end.
U.S. Representative Mike Pompeo (R-Kan) has introduced a bill dubbed the “Energy Freedom and Economic Prosperity Act.” The bill eliminates tax credits for new industries attempting to compete with petroleum while maintaining billions in taxpayer subsidies for Big Oil. Furthermore, the bill would immediately eliminate every tax credit for alternatives to petroleum, including cellulosic ethanol, biodiesel and wind. Yet the bill only eliminates two petroleum tax credits (marginal well incentives and enhanced oil recovery credits) that only go into effect when crude oil prices are well below current levels. Ironically, despite the immediate elimination of all things alternative, the oil tax subsidies would not be eliminated until the end of 2014.
“Rep. Pompeo’s bill ought to be named the ‘Petroleum Monopoly and Big Oil Prosperity Act,’” said Monte Shaw, executive director of the Iowa Renewable Fuels Association (IRFA). It’s hard to take seriously the Congressman’s comment that we can’t afford ‘taxpayer-backed subsidies to companies that don’t need them’ when his bill does not eliminate a single oil subsidy currently in use. Rather the bill leaves intact oil subsidies that date back literally 100 years for the most profitable industry in the history of the world. If the question is, ‘When can Big Oil stand on its own two feet without a taxpayer crutch?’ then Rep. Pompeo’s answer is apparently ‘not yet.’”
If the bill were to be passed as is, the petroleum tax subsidies that currently cost taxpayers billions each year including:
Percentage depletion allowance
Intangible drilling costs expensing
Deduction for tertiary injectants
Exception from passive loss limitations for oil and gas
Oil and gas excess percentage over cost depletion
“This bill simply tilts government policy even further in favor of petroleum,” continued Shaw.
thanks for that.. interesting... personally, i don't think either the oil nor the ethanol industry should have any of the taxpayers' money... no subsidies... the oil industry, esp , makes enuf w/o sucking at the teat of the taxpayer.
Something else to think about if you live in the city.
Ethanol is good for taking harmful particles out of automobile emissions, but a group committed to cleaner air is worried that gasoline makers might just end up putting more particulates in the blendstock.
“The [ultra-fine particulates] profile of the ethanol is very, very consistent,” but Greg Krissek, Director of Government Affairs for ICM, part of the Urban Air Initiative, told Joanna during the recent Iowa Renewable Fuels Association (IRFA) Renewable Fuels Summit that as ethanol blends get higher, gasoline makers are increasing the amount of particulate-forming ingredients on their end.
But Greg is still optimistic that higher ethanol blends will be used in the future. “I think there are very positive discussions with automakers about how to use mid-level blends. What we don’t want to happen is the unintended consequence down the road of what happens to that gasoline blendstock.”
You can find out more on the Urban Air Initiative’s website.
For the people that wanted real world mileage, I ran it for the 3 out of 4 months I had my car. My mpg was 22.3avg, that's combined but more city driving than highway. BUT, I also dynoed 175whp, 156wtq with only a green filter and rear muffler delete. I enjoyed it for sure, but I'm also not too stuck on economy.
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