|11-10-2013 12:56 PM|
Found some more info on running 93 oct E10 vs adding E85 to make it E65. Notice what knocked and what didn't and also timing. suss, hopefully you're reading this.
Here is some information from the 1/4 mile testing of the 2014 Silverado with gasoline and then E85. Some of the chassis dyno comparison tests were done on the same day but the acceleration tests were done on different days so they aren't exact apples to apples comparisons (see the IAT differences for example).
The engine appears to run a little more spark (1.5 degrees peak, 1.7 degrees average) and run a little leaner (0.6 average and 0.5 peak in terms of lambda, not AFR of course). With the added fuel volume and the DI they may also be getting adding charge cooling benefits.
9% alcohol content
Maximum timing: 21.5 degrees
Average for entire run timing: 17.2 degrees
Max lambda: 0.83
Average lambda: .79
Max airflow: 264.7 gps
Avg airflow: 209 gps
Max MAP: 98 kPa
Avg MAP: 95 kPa
Max ECT: 107 deg C
Avg ECT: 102 deg C
Max IAT: 36
Avg IAT: 34
65% alcohol content
Maximum timing: 23.0 degrees
Average for entire run timing: 18.9 degrees
Max lambda: 0.89
Average lambda: .84
Max airflow: 273.6 gps
Avg airflow: 218 gps
Max MAP: 98 kPa
Avg MAP: 96 kPa
Max ECT: 102 deg C
Avg ECT: 99 deg C
Max IAT: 29
Avg IAT: 27
Also, two of four gasoline runs showed knock during the acceleration test (including the fastest run). Neither of the E85 runs showed knock during the acceleration tests (only did 2 runs with E85 since they were so similar). Interesting to note that when not at high throttle angles the ECM shows a lot of knock with either fuel.
|11-09-2013 01:47 PM|
|11-09-2013 10:13 AM|
Taking advantage of the ’14 model’s Flex Fuel capabilities, LPE dumped in some E85 and repeated its tests. The on-board sensor read 65% ethanol content, with 1/8 tank of E10 diluting the mixture, when the dyno read 321hp and 355 lb-ft of torque. This certainly seems in line with GM’s 380hp crank horsepower rating when using E85 (355hp on gasoline) as well as the subsequent acceleration tests.
|11-09-2013 09:10 AM|
|IngotMK3||Testing out my 1st tank of E85 - it was 2.71 here.|
|11-08-2013 06:10 PM|
I'll keep using it with only a tiny extra cost unless I go on a roadtrip so I will have a longer tank range. Now if the price of E85 goes up or normal petrol goes down it wouldn't make that much sense unless I pay the extra price for slightly better throttle response.
|11-06-2013 03:04 PM|
But, that 94-96 (in the SUMMER, it's lower in the winter at many pumps) is higher than the 93, or even 91 or 89 available elsewhere (I've been places where the pumps run 85, 87, and 89. Especially at high altitudes.) So if you are running crazy amounts of boost or compression and are forced to retard ignition due to knocking, it could be advantageous then, as it would allow you to advance timing to take advantage of that compression/boost.
But again, it all comes back to a need for people to understand what the Anti-Knock Index (aka Octane) really is. It's NOT cleaner, better performing, higher power, or any of that. It simply resists knock. If your engine isn't knocking, it won't benefit from higher octane fuel. The EXCEPTION to that, and why there are Dyno results showing more performance with higher octane fuels, is the advent of the 'Knock Sensor'. It detects knocking from lower octane fuel and adjusts timing and other variables to prevent it. It effectively 'detunes'. But even there, the higher octane did not increase horsepower on it's own, it simply enabled the engine to run closer to 'peak' performance without knocking. That DOES mean that higher octane fuel nets you a performance gain; but it's important to know that the fuel just enabled that, it didn't actually do it.
|11-06-2013 01:00 PM|
Again E85 doesn't have a super high octane rating.
Pure ethanol has an aki (RON+MON)/2 rating of around 100.
Depending on what octane rating the 15% gasoline has E85 generally has an AKI rating of 94-96 or marginally higher than E10 premium fuel at 93 AKI.
Generally you never see the octane rating listed for E85 since they don't want you to know that they are using a variable product.
Any pump claiming 110+ octane for E85 is talking about the marginal blending value of Ethanol.
|11-06-2013 12:44 PM|
|11-06-2013 12:09 PM|
BUT; it has a super high octane rating. That means it's capable of handling tons of boots or super high compressions, resist heat, resist knocking, and will even burn COOLER inside your engine, which is a huge advantage.
Again, I'm not saying E85 doesn't have it's advantages. Just saying people should be aware of what it does. It's kind of like a supercharger. Takes power to make power. A supercharger may take 60+ horsepower away at full boost, but it puts more than that back into the engine. The end result is more power at the rear wheels, because the supercharger makes more power than it uses. E85 with a boosted engine is like that because it allows you to run more boost and/or tune the engine differently to really open her up. Running E85 on a stock Duratec though, is like running a supercharger that isn't hooked up to the intake. You're only getting the 'takes power' part, but not the 'makes power' part. If you're using it for cost savings or for environmental reasons, then that's great. But for power, that it won't do on a stock engine. Octane does NOT equal power, all Octane is, is a resistance to knocking!
|11-06-2013 11:36 AM|
|Noriceplease||Lol this thread is silly ... I stopped running e85 because I kept getting check engine lights .. dealer says it's because of the exhaust and cai and the computer getting confused. I was getting around 26-28 highway mpg which isn't too bad. All I know is I ran my evo on e85 and it made a difference that's forsure and when forced induction come out for this car I will be tuning on it again and then you will all see. But with out boost e85 won't make much of a difference, it's supposed to be good in high compression engines also but once again I haven't seen dyno results on this car so who knows.|
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