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Looking at a 2013 SE 5spd - Talk me into a Powershift

14K views 125 replies 44 participants last post by  DraKhen99 
#1 ·
Looking seriously at 2013 SE Hatchbacks
So far we have only driven a couple of 5spd manual transmission cars.

I had sort of discounted the Powershift 6spd auto versions based on what Car and Driver said about the 2012 SE they tested.
The complaints I've seen relate mostly to the transmission frequently being in the wrong gear for the conditions.
The only negative I can see to the 5spd is that at 75 or 80mph the engine is turning a bit faster than I expected. (Too bad its not a 6spd).

Is the Powershift 6spd reliable and how long has Ford been using this type of transmission?
How do you like yours and the gear change decisions it makes?
It also sounds like creeping up to something slowly is a bit different, can someone describe how it compares to an auto with a torque converter?

What type of life is expected from the dual clutches compared to a standard clutch in a 5spd?
Is the 6spd Powershift geared a bit higher in top gear than the 5spd?
I know your supposed to get another 1-2 mpg but what is acceleration like?

Any advice and information is appreciated.
 
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#58 ·
Is MFT as good as the German units? No. I can only wish it was as great as MMI.

But having had cars with and without such systems I don't think I could buy a car again that didn't at least have the functionality of non-navigation equipped MFT.

As far as the DCT goes? Sue me for being satisfied with it and I would absolutely pick it again.

6 Speed DCT that has worked over 5 speed manual that has also worked. If they offered the 6 speed for us, things could change.
 
#59 ·
I like both of ours, too!



I have had pretty much this kind of experience. I would add that things that concerned me have smoothed out considerably for me since I switched to 93 octane. Not related to transmission? In this digital age of cars adjusting things for different fuels, is it not possible that the transmission is somehow involved? Perhaps, and perhaps not. [dunno]
I have two of them in the garage, because I liked the first one that much! [driving]
 
#64 ·
Do this: go to the stickies and subscribe to all the dct and problem threads. Watch how often someone new posts with an issue. There have been dozens of posts made by unique people since I joined this site about the dct. People stalling on the freeway, slamming into gear hard enough to scare the wife into thinking they got rear ended, not accelerating when turning in front of oncoming traffic, etc.

If you've figured out how to minimize your issues by changing your driving habits or if you're lucky enough to be unaffected, terrific. But odds are high that if you buy a dct car you will have issues. Ford is fixing them now, but if this is happening already, what happens when these cars get some real miles on them?
 
#72 · (Edited)
People stalling on the freeway, slamming into gear hard enough to scare the wife into thinking they got rear ended...
I didn't realize that there were a significant number of DCT owners stalling on the freeway or having their transmission slam into gear.


If you've figured out how to minimize your issues by changing your driving habits...
No need to change your driving habits if you know how to drive properly to begin with.
 
#65 ·
I'm pretty lucky, I've just now been able to drive both for quite a few miles. My car is in for a remote starter to be installed, and I got a loaner 2012 WITHOUT MT.

I can see how some would not like it. When moving from a stop you can feel the clutch engaging and I could feel a shudder. I also noticed the issue of going around turns and it acting weird. I also know that if you are to do as some stated above, and THINK about the foot input, and how you want it to shift, and where, the transmission will react the way you want it to.

I really like the 6th gear, and how it drops the RPM's.

Overall I am impressed actually by it, and think after driving it some more, I could get used to it, although the car is getting 10mpg less than my 5 speed, and that doesn't bode well with my commute.
 
#66 ·
My car is in for a remote starter to be installed, and I got a loaner 2012 WITHOUT MT.
You have a 5spd that's getting a remote start?
Isn't there a switch on the clutch that prohibits starting unless its pressed?

Also, when I build one on Ford.com it seems to indicate that remote start is only available on a DCT. What's the cost to add it later?
 
#71 ·
The DCT has been the Focus' biggest black eye and maybe Ford should have kept a simpler tranny in place til the technology had the bugs worked out better. If people need to learn this tranny then why hasn't Ford made it a better priority to familiarize customers with this new tranny? The bottom line is this transmission is more buggy than should be accepted and shouldn't require a class to learn to use it but it might help.
 
#73 ·
Thanks mp223 for defending me, yes I have driven the DCT and have owned a VW with DSG, the manual is the way to go. Don't take my word for it take car and driver.
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/ford-focus-se-manual-hatchback-test-review
I can downshift into a turn and adjust the heater and fan controls at the same time without taking my eyes off the road (knobs don't need to be looked at).
 
#74 ·
That review is dated May 2011.
What improvements have been made to the DCT since then?



I can downshift into a turn and adjust the heater and fan controls at the same time without taking my eyes off the road (knobs don't need to be looked at).
Any Titanium owner can do the same so I must be missing your point.
You can upshift/downshift with SelectShift.
Focuses with DATC have knobs and buttons for the climate control.
 
#79 ·
I'm fairly satisfied with my gearbox. It's a little wonky at lower speeds, but I've yet to see any DCT that doesn't get that complaint. It's pretty fantastic when you're having a little fun. It could likely greatly benefit from some aftermarket tuning, that's for sure. It also seems to like deliberate throttle input from the driver.

To those who don't like it, the solution is simple: get a vehicle with a traditional auto. I like the dual clutch just fine, and a lot of others are in the same boat. If you don't like it then don't use it. It would seem that a test drive would've brought up these issues immediately.
 
#80 ·
wrong.

The car has to "learn" your driving habits and would be rough/jerky when first driving it during a test drive. This obviously does not give you the true feel of the car, nor does it hint that it will improve(like it should) or not.

Not to mention the over heating problems quite a few members have experienced before.

You seem to be also ignoring the other problem with this DCT which are the leaky seals, which even 2013 owners are experiencing. Ford "redesigned" the seals MY ASS. [rant]

Although my DCT is fine...in my mind the question is not if the seals will fail, but WHEN.
 
#81 ·
Ignoring it how? I haven't had the problem...so why should I complain about it?

People here would probably be better served to pay more attention to how their car is working, and a bit less about how everyone else's is working, especially when you're using an internet forum (read: small sample) to base most of your worries.

Some of you make it appear as though I should worry about my vehicle because some other person had issues with theirs. I don't understand that method of thinking...
 
#82 ·
You are ignoring well documented and real issues with the DCT if you suggest "It would seem that a test drive would've brought up these issues immediately."

A 15 minute test drive would not demonstrate how the car drives because the tranmission learns your driving style, nor would it show you leaking seals and bad clutches (which have been happening in some cases, under 10k miles). So research is key before pulling the trigger and buying the car.

It makes me laugh when people say internet forums are just a small portion of owners and those with complaints.

As many of you know I have on going steering issues with my car all stemming from a bad steering rack. It was back ordered for 6 weeks and had to be shipped from Canada for me. This is not a "small portion" of owners. The dealer that had to replace mine said I was the 3rd person waiting for a rack when I brought it in. He said they changed DOZENS so far.

So I am happy for you if you have 0 problems. Just because you, and maybe 10,20,30,100 other owners have perfect cars does not mean there isn't an equal number of people with trouble cars also.
 
#91 ·
I'e had three, THREE Focus's with the DCT. Admittedly one was for only 1500mi as it was traded after hailstorm damage. Point is, I have never had to wait for them to adapt to driving, they were fine from day one. Two of them were with 7mi and 9mi on the odo when I drove off the lot. All those I know who also have them have not had problems either so my experience would indicate the occurrences of issues is not that great. Of listing of compacts, I see the Focus still highly rated in spite of the negative reviews from early tests and that would also indicate it is a good car. If it were as bad as some would have us believe, there would have been a massive recall, as it stands, there have been only TSBs so the problems are not as endemic as we are lead to believe. However, if you are the one who is dealing with it and the poor service that is the current norm for all service industries I can see why you would be angry or less enamored of the car you bought. But to label the car junk due to a few problems is not helpful or informative. To ignore the problems is also not helpful. So I think we need to just say what we ourselves have experienced, and let others decide from that, not the hearsay or rumors, however seemly accurate, that we choose to believe because it follows our own thinking.
 
#92 ·
I finally got over treating mine like an automatic transmission at take off and it is working as well as I would expect. Use the throttle like it is a manual transmission. Easing into the throttle will net the same results as if you eased into the throttle on a normal manual transmission. Shudder. I believe it is because the PCM and ECM are taking over a bit of the throttle input to keep the engine from stalling, like what would happen in a normal transmission if you let off the clutch without enough throttle.

I have eliminated 100% of shudder at take off, with TC on, by using a bit more throttle at take off.
 
#93 · (Edited)
I have eliminated 100% of shudder at take off, with TC on, by using a bit more throttle at take off.
I tried to convey something similar a few pages back, all you have to do is adjust your driving style to the automated systems in place in the vehicle and most all of the DCT issues are gone, minus known mechanical ones.

I guess if you drove a manual for years and the clutch engagement point was high in the pedal travel and you bought car B and the engagement point was low in the pedal travel near the floor and the car constantly stalled in intersections because you failed to anticipate the engagement point and give the appropriate amount of gas at the correct time, the manufacture has failed, because you are going to have to adjust the way you drive the car to get the desired result? Every manual shift car and truck I have driven, and I have driven several, I have had to adjust the amount of gas given taking into consideration 4,6, or 8 cylinders and or diesel, and where and how the clutch engages. With a little practice, I am able to get the same drive ability out of each, but I can't drive them all the same way and expect the same results. So why is it so hard to comprehend, that you might have to make some adjustments to your driving style to get good drive ability out of a DCT?
 
#97 ·
Ordered an SE Hatch on Saturday!

When I started this thread I had no idea it would get so many reponses so fast, thanks to all who responded.

Placed an order on an SE Hatchback on Saturday for my wife.
Test drove a DCT but ended up ordering the 5spd, if this is a good car we will have it for many miles and the higher odds of getting a long term trouble free car was a factor. We like driving sticks too, and the Focus has a good one.

Ordered this car:

2013 Focus SE Hatchback - 5sp. Manual
Exterior - Ingot Silver
Interior - Charcoal Black
Package 201A (SE Appearance Package)
Winter Package
Power Moonroof
Exterior Protection Package

MSRP after delivery was $24,270, we took the best of four offers at: $19,300 after all rebates.
Seemed a pretty good deal for a car we really liked, now starts the long boring wait for it to arrive.
 
#105 ·
Maybe its just my car. but when ever I leave it in drive and let it shift whenever it wants to even with a slight prod on the throttle generally gets it to downshift one gear, usually I have to really mash the throttle down in select shift manual, and then sometimes it does the 6-4 or 6-3 downshift instead of just changing one gear, but in drive even a slight lift and prod, or just a prod will make the car shift gear readily.

Its not quite as twitchy as the 6F35 was in that one Fusion I had driven to my father's house while they had it as a rental, but its not like it flat out refuses to shift either.
 
#106 ·
Maybe its just my car. but when ever I leave it in drive and let it shift whenever it wants to even with a slight prod on the throttle generally gets it to downshift one gear [...] but in drive even a slight lift and prod, or just a prod will make the car shift gear readily.
Yeah, my car doesn't do this. lol
 
#113 ·
Well, I wish I could say my transmission has remained smooth. Just got into my moms in MD from MI. Did great on the highway, but pulling away from the first light off the highway the transmission shuddered so bad I thought something was going to break. It continued to misbehave at every light. A few times there was a rattling between gears that sounded like a heat shield was loose somewhere.

Traction control on or off makes no difference.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2
 
#114 ·
Well, I wish I could say my transmission has remained smooth. Just got into my moms in MD from MI. Did great on the highway, but pulling away from the first light off the highway the transmission shuddered so bad I thought something was going to break. It continued to misbehave at every light. A few times there was a rattling between gears that sounded like a heat shield was loose somewhere.

Traction control on or off makes no difference.

Sent from my MB860 using FF Mobile
Hi opies,

This is just a reminder that I can help by escalating your case. Send me your information via PM (VIN, dealer, mileage, daytime phone number, and full name) so I can get your regional customer service manager involved.

Crystal
 
#119 ·
I was wondering what you decided after 12 pages and just reading this thread would've made me not even consider a DCT. The DCT might shift quicker but at the dragstrip the 5 speed is the winner.
 
#120 ·
I was wondering what you decided after 12 pages and just reading this thread would've made me not even consider a DCT.
We started out looking at 5spd's and before reading much here, I posted this thread. Looks like quite a few are happy with the DCT, but the level of those who aren't would make me too nervous about getting a bad one.

The one we test drove had a a bit of shudder but nothing else I noticed.
I was driving it like I'd stolen it though, so not sure what it would be like under normal driving.
Anyway the wife is looking forward to her new 5spd, here's hoping it gets 40+ mpg like some apparently do.

I was surprised how few 5spd's were on local dealers lots, and to get what she wanted we had to order it.
 
#126 ·
My wife and I test drove a 2013 Titanium with the SelectShift 6-speed in it last weekend - I found no problems with it, and the car's got 50 miles on it.

I have a 2011 F-150 with the 6-speed Select Shift in it, and other than a few firm shifts, it's been great (read those forums, quite a few have problems with it).

My wife mandated we get an automatic - she doesn't like manual transmissions. Bummer for me, but with my stop-and-go commute, I imagine I'll drop it into S and cruise to work.

-John
 
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