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How the OEM speakers stack up to upgrade speakers (pictures)

74K views 69 replies 27 participants last post by  95maxrider 
#1 · (Edited)
A few months ago i wanted to upgrade the stock speakers in my 07 SE i found a guy on craigslist with a set of Alpine and a set of CerwinVega then decided if i get a double din with DVD i may want the same speakers in the front as the back so i decided not to mismatch the front and the rear.
I found another guy selling a kenwood single din and 4 pioneer so i went with those insted since they were all 4 the same.
When i went to replace the spakers i noticed that some one who owned the car before me replaced the drivers door with one of the "shaker" componet drivers so thats why i have one. (i think they are the shaker componet drivers?) or premium speakers, mach?

Also i bought these 6X9 tweeter add on things from parts express it has a big plastic cross holding the tweeter to the speaker basket (middle speaker)

The 5 speakers i tested


Here is the plot for all 5 speakers


next to the componet speaker the oem has decent bass and good high end even though its just a "whizzer" type. Tlhe componet driver uses a seperate dome style tweeter yet it doesnt seem to be much better in the higher frequencies.


By adding the seperate "super tweeter" to the stock speaker it gained some more high frequencies but took a big dip between 4-10K


Whats the most interesting is how well the stockers do against the well known brands. The alpine seems to have a tad bit more bass around 100-200hz and seems to go lower then the stocker and vega between 40-60hz


The vega has the most top end but its a "3way" so i figured the 2 extra tweeters on the top give it more top end. compareed to the OEM speaker the Alpine will probobly sound warm. The vega brighter then all of them, not as much bass as i figured it would have.

What i found the most shocking was how flat the FORD componet driver is. It must have a crossover in it how the bass slopes. IMO it has the best curve of them all if you run a sub. The stockers are better then i figured they would be though. IMO i would keep the stock speakers and save money for a better head unit.
 
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#2 ·
This is neat..... How did you test them anyway?

I have been impressed by the stock speakers..... I was actually disappointed when i installed my kenwoods because i lost a good amount of bass, though it did gain on the top end. This was with my kenwood head unit on the same settings for both speaker sets.Posted via FF Mobile
 
#3 ·
Yeah i felt the same way with my stock speakers after i upgraded to the pioneer that is in the car now.

After i found the alpine and the vega speakers another guy had a kenwood radio with 4 pioneer speakers for $75. I put the radio in the next day but it took me a few weeks before the weather was nice enough to work outside and replace the speakers. So i drove around a while with the stock speakers in it. I noticed a big improvement when i changed the radio out but when i changed the speakers out i was disapointed that there was really not much gain in bass or top end. The stock speakers really arnt that bad IMO.

The program i used is called "REW" its a "room equalizer program" for tunning speakers, the room, sound panels, subs. Its a free download if you search google. I used it for home theater speaker setup and placement but its a good tool for other audio stuff like this as well.

I installed it on a laptop, hooked the "headphone" out to a small amp, the microphone into the mic input and just ran the calibration and tested each speaker. I modified a small klipsch speaker box to fit the 6X8 speakers so i could clip the leads to each speaker after each test.

Its pretty easy to setup and use if you have different speakers to test.
 
#4 ·
My friend has an older 3000 GT with some nice speakers and his back panel speakers sound bad so he bought some sound baffels. He ran the program and then he is going to run it again after he installs the speaker baffels. Another good tool to see if the changes he makes do anything to help or hinder the sound.

I think it will rob all the bass but it might flatten the overall sound similar to the ford componet speakers. He is planning to run a sub later also.
 
#7 ·
Its kinda fun messing with this stuff, ive wanted to do it for a while just couldnt gather up all the stuff.

I kinda like the flat curve of that ford componet speaker so i went looking on e-bay and im finding they are made by JBL? are the oem 6x8s made by JBL too?

I might go and look at some junk yards in the area and try and find 4 of em when the weather warms up some. A guy on e-bay had 4 pulled from a lincoln town car. They must come with the premium speaker setup
 
#8 ·
I used to 'mess with this stuff' a long time ago. The key is getting the specs for the particular driver (not easy to do most times). Then tuning the enclosure for the driver. But as most car speakers fit into such weird spaces, I never mastered how to do that exactly (internal volume is what???). Add in sympathetic vibrations and, well, I just threw my hands up. Anyway, I agree that it appears that the ford component driver has some sort of filter on it. Note the total lack of 'Q' in the 50-80hz range. Very odd without a bandpass filter.
 
#9 ·
Its fun, audio stuff is very fun interesting stuff to me.

I took the componet speaker apart and WOW this thing is NICE! the quality is really good for a factory speaker i must say.

One thing i never liked about some companys was how they rate the wattage of speakers. specialy companys like pioneer 240watts!? these componet speakers are rated for 25 to me that is so much more realistic.

any way look at the quality of these speakers!


look at the crossover, thats somthing you would see in a home speaker



The drivers are beefy, specialy the tweeter[ohcrap]

big healty magnets



even took the time and cost to add foam packing



i went ahead and rebuilt iy but removed the grills, i might have to test them again and see if the sound changes any with the grills removed



The woofer driver kinda reminds me of bose outdoor drivers, they have a similar look as somthing ive seen in a bose speaker
 
#11 ·
The rated wattage is a function of many different areas of the driver. The coil, magnet, spider etc. High wattage drivers are made (more or less) for use without an enclosure (as in they will not destroy themselves). There very forgiving in that area, but they loose in efficiency. BTW: Old trick. If you remove that foam pad and (carefully) work some batting to fill up the enclosure, you will increase the internal audio volume by 1.2%. Do NOT let the batting come in contact with the spider or cone. When you tested the woofer, did you still have the crossover in place? If so, test just the woofer (no crossover). the lack of a lower resonance ('Q'), well, it's a tad hard for me to believe.
P.S. What are you using for a signal generator? Is it pure sign or quasi?
 
#12 ·
Whats hard to believe? what is batting?

I tested the speaker just like i did the other day but with the grills removed so they didnt block any sound.

I can try the speaker without the crossover but im sure it would blow the tweeter without it hooked to the tweeter and im not about to do that.

The signal is generated by the REW program. It will to a sub type signal or a speaker type. You can set it to sweep threw what ever range of frequencies you want. say 0-20,000 or i have mine set to 40-20,000 you can also set it at any level you want. Im using the default 75db

This is one thing that the program doesnt do, or it can if you want to take the time is how the speaker can change at louder levels.

One speaker may have a nice curve at 75db but not at say 80-85 i probobly listen to mine between 75-85db ide guess
 
#14 ·
I didnt remove the crossover i just tested it like it came from the factory. I dont really think it will be much better though its in a factory sealed enclosure so i didnt even need to really mount it into a box.

The box i used is from a 7" klipsch woofer. Its 10X11X9.5 made from 1/2" mdf with a 2.25 X10" port. My calculation tool says its .44 cuft with a tunning of 50hz that seems pretty close to ideal demensions for this size of speaker dont you? The woofer this box was designed for is a 7" ROUND driver but a 6x8 oval looks very simmilar in size IMO its close enough.

The white stuff in the back of the componet enclosure is some sort of batting, its not class but its somthing simmilar.
 
#15 ·
Doing this bottom to top. Some trivia info for you.
Batting or Fiber Fill. The stuff they use in stuffed animals for kids, quilting etc. It's use is based on the theory of the "infinite baffle" as I recall. Per your pic, What there trying to damp is a standing wave.

Your text box is fine. But again, just trivia if you really want to get into this. There are established standards for testing drivers. Now this is from memory, but there close. Standard test box is 1 cubic foot 'infinite baffle' (regardless if the woofer is made for a port) . DB meter or mic is placed 3 ft from front of driver. Box with driver is 3 ft from ground. Techinically, all this is supposed to happen in a anechoic chamber, but real world, any space that has carpeting, lots of soft furniture (or people) works pretty well for the average quality of test equipment. I cannot recall what the standard drive level (in DB) was, but I think 75 is right on or very close.

As I said, if you have an driver that has an integrated tweeter, or is mounted to an enclosure and you cannot remove it, then you work with what you got. I would only 'mess' with it if something was obviously wrong, broken etc (or your just intensely curious). This is especially true for car speakers.

OK, so where are we going with all this? Only in that I think you have a real interest in it, with proper tuning, you can make damn near any speaker sound good to great (within there loudness specs of course). I am talking about nuance where you can tell the lead guitar is using a tube amp (and the plate is overdriven), or a violin actually sounds good (note: I hate "whiny" violins). It's called 'detail', and admittedly it's my number one beef with most car (and many home) audio systems (although the space is very challenging/intimidating to design in. Hence why I throw up my hands and walk away anymore). I have gone to a few car audio contests, and I got to tell you, most times my initial thought is a lament of how much money the person just wasted on that system. Wife and I came up with a word that for these systems. "Flobberbot", which is an attempt to describe the sound. [;)]
 
#16 ·
I just used the box to test all the drivers so that they were all in an enclosure that was the same for all of them. The box that im using has poly fill in it.

you said 1 cuft for a 6X8? that seems a little over sized for such a small driver.

I didnt do these test at 3 feet i did them all at 1 foot. Ive dont the test at different distances before though, the high end is usualy lower is all that really changes. Other then that the plots will still be pretty much the same overall. What i mean is the cerwin vega will still have the most high end, the alpine will still have the most bass it will just change the curves a little on them all.

Ive messed with mic placement, distance, using a wall or corner to increase bass i found for testing the general sound of a speaker 1-3 feet is the best.

The plots pretty just confirm what i thought i heard. What i heard was the stock speakers didnt sound bad and compaired to other 6x8 speakers they hold their own pretty well.
 
#17 ·
1 cuft was the standard (don't think it would have changed but maybe so?). The point of the sealed box is to provide that infinite baffle for testing only. all the formulas I ever used assumed this volume. 3ft as I recall was the distance established by some audio institute. For testing, you place the driver in the standard box, 3ft up on some sort of table or what have you, away from any walls or surfaces that will artificially reinforce the bass. Middle of a typical living room generally works best (curtains, large stuffed furniture, carpet etc. you get the idea!). You place the mic 3 ft from the driver center (because that is the established standard). If you place the driver near a wall or in a corner, your not measuring the driver alone and it gives you false results. Basically, if your testing, you ignore what sounds good to your ears and test to the standard(s) to give a uniform and honest comparative result. Do you have a book? Radio shack used to sell a real gem for about 10 bucks. It would get you there for all typical configurations (note BOSE multi-chamber, but def your typical stereo store fodder). I really recommend it as it contains a wealth of data and won't set you back serious dollars for the pro stuff.
 
#18 ·
1cuft is what my 10" subthump box is i think thats a bit big for these drivers. Maybe you are right since these are so called "free air" drivers. I myself dont put much into that though. I feel a speaker needs to be in a good wood box to really sound its best.

What sucks is when you go to a car audio store to demo speakers look at the enclosure they are in. They arnt in a metal/plastic door panel they are in nice thick MDF enclosures then when you install them they sound so different. worse

Here is another test i ran with the stock OEM driver. at 1ft, then at 3ft then i put the driver in a different .44cuft sealed box and ran another test at 1ft (GREEN)

 
#20 ·
Thats cool but thats a little more then i want to get into. It might be nice to use that to figure the stock OEM speakers but i have a feeling they will all be pretty close to the same.

To me im not as concerned with bass or treble i want a good midrange sounding speaker. You can usualy dial in or out a little more bass with the sub and you usualy have treble controls to brighten up the sound. I want more middle, a nice warm middle is what im looking for most in these panel speakers.
 
#23 ·
I removed the grills because the door panel already has enough of a grill.

The grill on the tweeter is metal the midrange driver is plastic.

The fiber fill is still debated wether it works or not. Some people say it improves bass some people say its nonsence.
 
#30 ·
I am suprised just how much the stock speakers have improved over a short 6 years. I drive all the time for work, so I enjoy listening to active music like rap and pop. I just traded in my 2004 F150 for a 2010 Focus SE and on the way home, my girlfriend said, "let's see how these speakers are." She turned on some Lil Wayne and turned up the volume. I couldn't believe how great the speakers sounded and the bass was incredible! She said,"somebody must have turned the bass up," then she checked it. To our amazement, it was set at zero. I am so happy with my stock sound system.
 
#31 ·
Current stock speakers in Foci do sound pretty good for whizzer cone-equipped "one way" OEM cheapies. Upgrading to BA S85s recently, though, quickly revealed the stockers' shortcomings: bass is a bit muddy (pretty good thump, though!) and the high end is harsh and fatiguing to listen to at louder volume. Both low and high frequencies lack definition when compared to the Boston Acoustics.
 
#32 · (Edited)
Yeah thats one thing that would need more testing at higher volumes.

Paper and foam is probably the cheapest materials you can use for speakers and they probably dont handle the higher volumes as well as other materials do. The tone they have is what i was most impressed with. I think paper gives good bass but probably distorts faster then other cone materials.

Another thing about after market speakers is if you use materials other then foam and paper it will last alot longer. Foam rips easy, it dry rots and over time just goes bad. Same with paper

If you change any change the doors they will probably go bad before the rear panel speakers. I dont know about your car but water leaks in around my windows and runs down into the doors.

I think upgrading is still a good idea if you can afford it, but i would change the radio first then replace the speakers when you can afford it. My car is an 07 and the OEM speakers still look new, the cones are still nice and tight and the foam still looks new as well.
 
#36 ·
I have a 2010 SE and I will say the stock spk. is decent. I really like the placement of the spk. in the front door. Perfect for a point source location. I too (like ChrissyL) changed them (fronts) out early on for some Boston Acoustics SX-85's. Absolutely no comparison. You have no idea how great these spks. sound. I have Sirius radio and the stock head unit drives the BA's just fine. Fantastic spks. and worth every penny IMO.
 
#37 ·
all i can add to this is the stock 6x8 (non audiophile) units are friggen tanks. i ahve beaten the snot out of mine badly for the last 8 years my car has existed. and they still havent given up. i'd like to build a 3 way component setup up front but use the stock door speakers for the mid low (they have a pretty good mid low in my mind.)
 
#39 ·
Wow, superbe stuff. Way more than basic listeners can handle or care about. But love the info.
Couple things, since you got/had all that set up, would love to see MB Quart coparo. Not surprised by the JBL manufacture, they've been doing it for ford for years. But do you have any idea how hard it is to get JBL auto speakers? Yes, easy w/ internet now. Ran a pair of JBL 6x9 3ways and a 8"pyle sub for years, and it sounded awsome. Bass heads thought I had 12"s in there, but clear.

So, I was thinking of snagging some of those ford audiophile components, but second guessing now.

Any thoughts... thanks
 
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