: Holy Sh... AE: One of Big three pulling out of NASCAR


igor
04-19-2006, 01:47 PM
by Ethanol Boy

Thinking The Unthinkable.

Detroit. It has come to our attention that serious discussions are taking place for the first time in the conference rooms of one domestic manufacturer in particular on a subject heretofore unthinkable in Detroit. The subject? Pulling out of NASCAR. Yes, it has been mentioned before, and I have predicted it for months now - ever since the announcement was made that Toyota would be buying its way into the France family circus - but we have confirmation that not only are the discussions taking place, they're so far down the road that a timetable for a pullout has been created, taking into account the end dates of existing contracts with individual racing teams currently aligned with this particular manufacturer.

The fact that it has finally come to this is no real surprise. Several years ago, we pieced together evidence that each of the Detroit-based car companies were spending in the neighborhood of $140 million each, annually, on their NASCAR endeavors. That figure accounts for engineering and wind-tunnel work, direct payments to the teams, personal services contracts with the drivers, promotional programs, race sponsorships, advertising, etc., etc. In the Big Picture of things, when multinational companies are spending double that amount for the "privilege" of competing in Formula 1, that would seem like no big deal, but taking into account the factors that matter most to the Detroit car companies right now, that dollar figure is a very big deal.

And what are those factors? Beyond the obvious pressures being generated by Detroit's dire financial straits, one thing in particular is driving these "pulling out of NASCAR" discussions to critical levels - and that is NASCAR's full-on push and investment in its much-hyped "Car of Tomorrow." The COT is NASCAR's new "spec" car, and it takes NASCAR's template philosophy to its logical conclusions. The COT could easily be called a "NASCAR Special" or whatever the marketing name that the hype-masters in Daytona Beach will want to call it, because any connection to what the manufacturers are producing has been well and truly broken. I contend, of course, that the connection was broken long ago, but the Detroit manufacturers have been clinging to a shred of a connection and amusing themselves with the annual massaging of their various models' grille openings, nose shapes and headlight decals.

Until now, anyway.

Now, the realization has finally sunk in for one manufacturer, apparently, and taking everything into account and putting everything on the table, there's no longer the blind allegiance to NASCAR at this company, which is a seismic shift if you know anything about this town's slavish devotion to all things NASCAR on and off for the last 50 years.

NASCAR has been living large off the Detroit car companies' cash trough for so long now that they don't even care anymore, as all sense of reality left the NASCAR offices in Daytona Beach and New York long ago. The NASCAR attitude goes something like this: If a Detroit manufacturer drops out, it's "whatever" - because Toyota is stepping up to the plate. And if another manufacturer drops out, no worries, because eventually we'll just market our own NASCAR "Specials" and then we won't have to pay any manufacturer rights fees ever again.

But for one particular Detroit manufacturer it's no longer "whatever" - and messing with the sanctity of the NASCAR budget is no longer unthinkable - it's very real, very calculated and very imminent.

This Detroit manufacturer has decided that if it competes in motorsports in the future, it will only compete in three basic areas: 1. In production-based racing series that by rule and specification retain more than a passing resemblance to the cars they sell and the competitors they compete against in showrooms. 2. "Technical" efforts, in other words, engine programs for open-wheel and prototype racing series, but stopping short of Formula 1. And 3. Developing an effort to compete for the overall victory at Le Mans. Any other efforts, grass-roots racing, drag racing, etc., would be covered as the need and budget allow.

This particular manufacturer has finally come to the stark realization that their NASCAR involvement has done more for NASCAR than anything else. NASCAR exists for its benefit and profitability first and foremost - everything else is secondary to that fundamental premise. The relentless hype of NASCAR and its sponsors by NASCAR itself and its enablers at the TV networks has resulted in dramatically diminished returns for the participating manufacturers - and pretending that NASCAR's popularity has done wonders for these car companies in the showrooms amounts to the Big Lie. The fact of the matter is that the increase in the popularity of NASCAR over the last ten years has seen a corresponding decrease in the participating domestic manufacturers sales fortunes. And there's not one NASCAR-sponsored survey that can possibly suggest otherwise, no matter how hard they try to "cook" the numbers.

Immersed in a battle for the hearts and minds of American consumers, this manufacturer has finally taken the blinders off and decided that the blind devotion to all things NASCAR has run its course and now must come to a stop.

In other words, the $140 million that was previously earmarked for NASCAR, will be put to very good use.

Stay tuned, because we'll have more on this story in the coming weeks.


link: http://www.autoextremist.com/page3.shtml#fumes

Now this is something... I personally (like most on this site) could not care less ABOUT NASCAR, but this seems like a huge step for an US based manufacturer... too bad AE could not tell which one of the manufacturers.. anyone knows?

Igor

213slayer666
04-19-2006, 01:50 PM
dodge maybe? since they are owned my MB now.

hopefully it is ford though, they could use the money to make some good cars

p0sitivevibez
04-19-2006, 01:52 PM
This is the 2nd scariest thing coming out of NASCAR. First, Toyota joined in. Now we might lose one of the bases...... It would either be GM or Ford, since they both are having big time money problems. The day a Honda races in NASCAR is the day that NASCAR dies.

svtguy21
04-19-2006, 02:02 PM
i think a little bit of every american has just died! or atleast the rednecks hehe(sorry)

dgualtie
04-19-2006, 02:07 PM
i am curious as to who it is

CrazyMatt
04-19-2006, 02:10 PM
Anything that shakes up the NASCAR world and brings it one step closer to destruction is fine in my book.

igor
04-19-2006, 02:13 PM
the three manufacturers of all of nazcar cars are Chevy, Ford and Dodge... for next season - add Toyota

Just to clarify.

SOURCE: www.nascar.com
Igor

igor
04-19-2006, 02:14 PM
Originally posted by CrazyMatt
Anything that shakes up the NASCAR world and brings it one step closer to destruction is fine in my book.

X2

Igor

MISVTfocus
04-19-2006, 02:55 PM
It has got to be GM, they have that huge restructuring plan going on now and are trying to save literally every dollar they can.

rfinger
04-19-2006, 03:02 PM
who cares im sorry but watching folks driving in a circle is boring as hell...................DIE NASCAR DIE muwahahaha

igor
04-19-2006, 03:33 PM
^^that is why we care .. .this could bring that to happen

I try to decide who I believe it will be, but there are too many possibilities.. I would say for onbe Dodge will not be it .. they have been iimarketing to rednecks and other "alpha males" naSCAR is the ultimate alpha male sport.. they will stay.

Mr-914
04-19-2006, 07:28 PM
Something to remember is that GM has two brands in Nascar, Pontiac and Chevy. I can't imagine Chevy pulling out, but Pontiac should have left years ago. However, from the financial side, the GM boys are the obvious suspect.

Thinking again, FoMoCo has been burned bad by racing for the last decade. Remember the Jaguar F1 debacle? VW management still uses Jag F1 as an example of why NOT to build an F1 car.

SuperFocusMan
04-19-2006, 07:35 PM
maybe then there will be more WRC on speed channel.

Duffman355
04-19-2006, 07:39 PM
Actually, I thought Pontiac dropped out. I thought they all went to monte carlo (gm GUYS that is)

DrkKnight614
04-19-2006, 07:46 PM
Its going to be GM, they have been having the biggest money issues and both Ford and Dodge have just introduced their new race cars, the Fusion and the Charger for nascar, so i dont see them suddenly pulling out when they just put all that work and money to have a new car into the sport. If GM pulls out i wonder whos going to get some of the racers using the monte carlo, such as Jeff Gordon.

WD40
04-19-2006, 07:46 PM
Originally posted by Mr-914
Something to remember is that GM has two brands in Nascar, Pontiac and Chevy. I can't imagine Chevy pulling out, but Pontiac should have left years ago.
Pontiac did leave...in 2003, right after Dodge's infamous return in 2001.
In fact, that's when Petty Enterprises went back to Dodge.
And, that's when Gibbs Racing switched from Pontiacs to Chevys.

Frankly, my vote is that Dodge is pulling out.
The Chargers have not done very well, NASCAR won't let the Intrepid race anymore,
and all of Dodge's whining has fallen on deaf ears at NASCAR headquarters.
IOW, they haven't gotten any help with the rules.

Now, will they pull out of the Craftsman Truck Series though???
Dodge has done rather well there...

maybe then there will be more WRC on speed channel.
^^^ [thumb]

Shadowrunner
04-19-2006, 07:57 PM
idk, i read in the paper a couple months back that dodge was pulling out. it said daimler-chrysler, but we all know that's dodge

Godzukidan
04-19-2006, 07:58 PM
WoW! Keep us posted if you find out who is droping out. I have a funny feeling it may be Ford. There are not that many Ford Teams in Nascar. If not for Jack Roush's race teams, Ford would only have about 4 or 5 cars in Nextel Cup. But then again...... GM is hurting. And if GM pulls out. It will look like they are running from Toyota and that will make them look real bad. I am a fan of Nascar and it will be a sad sad day when one of the big three back out of Nascar.......... a sad sad day indeed.

OrangeSVTguy
04-19-2006, 08:25 PM
i've seen those hillbillies with the old beat up toyota trucks with nascar stickers holding their bumpers on... now they finally have a team to cheer for [rofl] i don't see ford or gm pulling out. some odd reason i feel like dodge will pull out. they are getting the hell out and dodging for what's to come.

talonk4
04-19-2006, 08:45 PM
YES! one down.....


no, i'm jk. i know my fiance would be heartbroken if nascar went down, or if ANY teams lost a company

focusonthefocus
04-19-2006, 10:16 PM
Don't care for NASCAR. It's an American tradition but I'm not a fan. I bothers me that Speed Channel is mostly NASCAR anyway.

However, I can understand fans of NASCAR will be in quite an uproar. I do feel sorry for them, but I'm sure that it's a wise choice for the company. It does seem like it's a big waste of money and that NASCAR isn't helping anyone else but NASCAR.

GreenEnvy
04-19-2006, 10:21 PM
nascar used to be fun, but way too commercialised now. too overpriced for tickets and such.
id rather go watch the locals bang the hell out of each other on the dirt oval, way more entertaining.
if i remember right alls it takes to qualify for a brand of car in nascar is 2 body panels. think it was the decklid and roof, but not sure anymore.
went to kansas city for the races last fall (busch, nascar) 2 days 250 bucks...not again.

thinking its dodge leaving. think they got into it a few years back with certain expectations then nascar threw a bunch of demands at them which ended up costing them more than expected.

Sinan
04-20-2006, 03:21 AM
big waste of money if you ask me. Formula 1 is boring, but not as much as NASCAR. In F1 you got a better track, more turns etc...but this you just watch bunch of cars with too much stickers on them go around in circle. i don't see any fun in it appart from crashes and the winner burnout at the end.

if it dies, I won't be sorry. More money to go to real stuff, like making better cars.

TrixAreForKidss
04-20-2006, 07:32 AM
The only thing that differentiates a Ford, Dodge, Chevy, and soon-to-be Toyota in NASCAR is the body style. There is no difference in chassis, Ford uses small blocks, Chevy uses small blocks, Dodge uses a small block, and Toyota will use a small block. Im sorry if this sounds cynical, but NASCAR isn't going to die because of fibreglass body panels. Call me silly, but I actually like the look of the Toyota body, and back around the time of Christmas I got my first look at the Ford Fusion body style...the nascar body looked hideous (turns out it was Ford's paint scheme on the showcar"
As for the future of NASCAR, the Hendrick's, the Roush's, and the Childress's will all be cut down. Starting in '08 (I believe) a race team cannot have more than three drivers employed. I'm sure Hendrick and Roush have plans, (Mark Martin retiring anybody think he'll become an owner?) most of which would see not Jack Roush or Rick Hendrick as owners, but other people within the organization would run the teams. Ona humerous note, apparently Penske is allready regretting hiring Kurt Busch...that guy thinks his shit doesnt stink, so I laugh when he get's taken out. Sorry guys, I'm a fanatic about NASCAR.

TrixAreForKidss
04-20-2006, 07:40 AM
Originally posted by Godzukidan
WoW! Keep us posted if you find out who is droping out. I have a funny feeling it may be Ford. There are not that many Ford Teams in Nascar. If not for Jack Roush's race teams, Ford would only have about 4 or 5 cars in Nextel Cup. But then again...... GM is hurting. And if GM pulls out. It will look like they are running from Toyota and that will make them look real bad. I am a fan of Nascar and it will be a sad sad day when one of the big three back out of Nascar.......... a sad sad day indeed.

Highly unlikely. For Ford "teams" you've got Roush, RYR, and the Wood Brothers.
Yes, Ford is the underdog, but to say just because there are 3 teams in Nextel cup that Ford is going to drop out is silly. Dodge has had lots of problems with their body styles since Dodge was introduced, the '03 Intrepid body style was so bad that most teams and drivers lobbied for a switch. Along came the Charger, and for the exception of a few teams have had little success with those. I guess we all will wait an see.

ACMarina
04-20-2006, 07:48 AM
Why bash NASCAR?? I don't bash anything vehicle-related, unless it's illegal.. I'll watch anything, honestly, boat races, motorcycles, the list goes on and on.. I'm an enthusiast of all things on motorized wheels..

violatedsohc
04-20-2006, 08:25 AM
Really though, there are reasons for each team in nascar to leave. Neither dodge or ford have that many cars in the circuit, and Dodge may not be in the public eye like GM but they certainly can't stand to loose any more money and end up looking like them. And as we all know GM is loosing its a** on the manufacturing side of things so there's a cut your ties and run feeling running about.

I know that when FoMoCo was designing and producing the 96-97 body style taurus they were gunning for the Camry to make sure that they got those buyers to buy from ford instead, maybe there's still a little rivalry there.

No matter what, it will look, to some extent like whoever is leaving is running away from toyota.

BagginWagon
04-20-2006, 12:40 PM
Wow, alot of NASCAR haters in here. "all they do is drive around a circle" yeah, obviously there's more to it, if you have to have an engineering degree to be in any part, of any team.

Jojos ZTS Focus
04-20-2006, 01:10 PM
I love watching cars go round in a left circle. Its so exicting. Blows WRX out of the water, I mean honestly, who wants to speed on a narrow two-track twisting and turning on some beautiful country side while doing 90 mph next to a ravine. Honestly, who?




J/K NASCAR blows.

I think it is Dodge that is leaving.


(Rally is where its at)

Fordcus Fan
04-20-2006, 01:39 PM
My moneys on damiler yavoll chysler. Even though FORD & GM been losing money at least they hav'nt gone bankrupt & begged for U.S. gov. (our tax dollors) help, & then merge with a import company yet. If dodge would dodge NASCAR I would'nt lose a wink of sleep. I think anything that helps automobile technology advance, is a good thing, including driving in circles @ high rpms for miles & miles & miles. I would'nt mind getting paid what those guys get paid for driving the shi# out of those cars.

S2
04-20-2006, 01:49 PM
I'm not a big fan, or much of a NASCAR fan at all, never watch it BUT bashing it for no real reason is just stupid. Please leave those comments out of this thread. As far as the topic, this is very interesting as any of the big three pulling out of something as traditional as this type of racing, is obviously a major step.

DrkKnight614
04-20-2006, 03:34 PM
the problem is that most of the bashers dont really know much about it, its not just driving in circles, its all about stradgey and having the right team, when to go to the pit, when to pass someone, or when you should stay back and wait till the right moment to over take everyone, drafting of the other people etc etc etc, theres so much more too it then just going in circles. Its not just the driver either, its about the pit team as well, b/c them being slower then your oppent by a second makes all the difference. Oh and they do go to some tracks that isnt just a big circle to let you guys know. Im not saying i watch it all the time or anything like that, i just wish people who bashed it were alittle more educated. I bet all you uneducated nascar haters laughed when Dale Earnheart got into that devistating crash b/c he bumped another car so his son Dale Jr. could win the race.