Minivan Sales are up (but don't call it a comeback) (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/16/minivans-sales_n_1522422.html)

Well it's things I've always known. My sister was like the woman in the article. She wanted her Tahoe XL. Then she had to borrow my mom's Odyssey for a week. Now she drives a mini-van. My wife wanted an SUV. She got a Windstar. Now all her friends compliment her car as compared to the SUVs.

People are all about image when it comes to cars. Without considering image, the mini-van is the best family vehicle for most people- who don't take the family off-roading. Name one SUV that has electric opening doors that you can open with a key-fob? Which do you think will be broken into first- the SUV, or the mini-van? Furthermore, besides the Mazda5---- where are the mini-vans? All the vans I see are freaking HUGE!!! My old Aerostar was shorter than my ZXW by a foot. I had the short body Aerostar, the XL would be longer.

My mom has a 1998 Windstar Limited, they bought it new in March of 1998, and even 360,000 kms later, and all us three kids, it still keeps ticking, relatively trouble free. Ford should have continued on with the van instead of handing the market of domestic van buyers to Dodge. Although, My parents say their next vehicle will be a Flex.

I think that SUV's are becoming unfashionable, but the minivan and the station wagon are not yet cool. We have a few more years of "crossovers" as people want something besides an SUV, but not a minivan.

I continue to wonder why Ford and GM got out of the mini-van market, and left dodge as the only domestic. we have an uplander, and other than it being a chevy, and plain one at that, we do like it. would rather have snagged the used buick next to it, but it wasn't worth the extra $$. even though I prefer Fords, I just do not like the windstar looks. neighbors have 2, and I still think they are ugly, IMO.
Sorry part is, my uplander will smoke my zts. zts gets better in town mpg. focus about 20mpg, uplander 14/15mpg. but highway, uplander 25+ (30+ on colorado trip last summer), focus 25 best so far. really think the auto in my focus has way to hight rpm on highway for good mpg. oh well.

The major problem with vans is, it's just not cool. No matter what you do, a big oversized FWD car with sliding doors and room to spare isn't cool.

UNLESS!

You get one of these.

http://i436.photobucket.com/albums/qq85/Fordguy9916/saleen_windstar_side.jpg
http://i436.photobucket.com/albums/qq85/Fordguy9916/saleen_windstar_hood.jpg
http://i436.photobucket.com/albums/qq85/Fordguy9916/6bd5_12.jpg

Yes, that is a SALEEN windstar.

You can only polish a turd so much and just because it says Saleen doesn't make it cool. I'd rather drive my slow Focus.

I had to do a double take when I saw it. I have no clue who thought of it or why, but I thought it was neat, albeit a serious waste of money to do this. I read more into it, and this was custom done for Tim Allen. heres the article about it.

http://www.autoblog.com/2008/12/01/ebay-find-of-the-day-saleen-windstar-seriously/

The major problem with vans is, it's just not cool. No matter what you do, a big oversized FWD car with sliding doors and room to spare isn't cool...

You can only polish a turd so much and just because it says Saleen doesn't make it cool. I'd rather drive my slow Focus.

I dunno, I'd take one of these (Jaguar test mule for XJ220 powertrain):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxofMKDd0Os

But that's not a minivan. [:D]

Whynot, if you want a real minivan, there's always the passenger version of the Transit Connect. It's like a trip back in time to 1984.

Windstar still ugly, IMO, but might be able to get by with the Tim Allen version.
Really, though, a Saleen mini-van. I've about seen it all. Almost

http://www.truckinweb.com/brandpages/dodge/0608tr_2003_custom_dodge_caravan/
http://image.truckinweb.com/f/brandpages/dodge/8321512+w800/0608tr_01_z+2003_custom_dodge_caravan+front_angle.jpg
http://image.truckinweb.com/f/brandpages/dodge/8324979+w800/0608tr_11_z+2003_custom_dodge_caravan+side_view.jpg
http://image.truckinweb.com/f/brandpages/dodge/8324955+w800/0608tr_02_z+2003_custom_dodge_caravan+rear_angle.jpg
http://image.truckinweb.com/f/brandpages/dodge/8324961+w800/0608tr_03_z+2003_custom_dodge_caravan+grille_hood.jpg
http://image.truckinweb.com/f/brandpages/dodge/8324991+w800/0608tr_08_z+2003_custom_dodge_caravan+engine_supercharger.jpg

what about the c-max? is that a crossover? i know it doesn't have the sliding door but i always thought it was the europe minivan

You can lower it, turbocharge it, paint it all you like....it's still a bus.

Well... that Dodge Caravan looks a bit like... an engorged tick..

We used to have a 1995 Windstar, bought it in 1998 when we had just one kid but wasn't planning on a second just yet.. but low and behold son number two ended up being on the way... that van cursed me! [rofl] Ha, just kidding but he was a surprise! After having that a few years we traded up to a 2000 Windstar in 2002 and I actually loved that van. A couple years later we added an F-150 and that was a great combo, we could haul anything with a truck and van!! We sold both when we moved to Korea and bought a $500 domestic car, a 1994 Kia Crapital..er Capital. That car got us from point A to B and back but that was it!

So I don't mind minivans but when we were in the market for a new car in 2009 we wanted to "grow up" and not have a mini van so came the Ford Flex! it is considered to be a "crossover" but in reality it is a STATION WAGON!!! [facepalm] I love it, though.

I think I've mentioned this before, but my parents used to have an Aerostar (the short version as well). We took that thing all the way across country towing a pop up trailer with 6 people in it and it never missed a beat. Living in NY, the salt ate the crap out of the frame and body, but it lasted forever. The old rear wheel drive minivans were beasts. The newer ones are definitely more refined and way nicer on the inside. With all the new tech crammed into them, they can occupy an entire family. Perfect people movers in my opinion. I'm not too much of a fan, but you can not deny the versatility of them for sure.

SWB Aerostars are Tanner Foust approved:

http://mit.zenfs.com/852/2012/03/TG45crop.jpg

I bought a 1997 Grand Caravan as a cheap family hauler, and I freaking love how convenient it is. It was cheap to buy, It's cheap to maintain, has ice cold ac, and sliding doors make getting our 1 & 3 year old in/out super easy. We took the Focus to the Nürburgring (for obvious reasons), and it does fine with a car seat and a booster seat, but the van does better. Plus I can fit my scooter (50cc Peugeot) in the back of the van (upright!) with the 3rd row removed.

Posted via FF Mobile

Its an image thing too. When they were kids that were driven about in wagons,minivans & suv's some adults don't want to driving them. Dodge had a "Man Van" show vehicle recently. chris

Minivans are indeed the most practical for families. And "cool"?
So what?[sleep]

Worst thread ever? lol

My family mover is a 2011 Expedition
It is an amazing SUV on the road very comfortable on road trips
I wanted something I could jump in and move 6 people 2 dogs through any weather in an emergency
I keep the tank full
just in case
you never know in this crazy world we live in
I need to buy one of those roof rack enclosures
[driving]

When my 2 girls were about 3 1/2 and 5 yrs of age respectively (this was around 1993), we had a 1988 Aerostar Eddie Bauer, short version. I absolutely loved that van. It did everything I asked of it. Comfortable, pretty quiet. Just wasn't very fast with the smaller 2.9 V6 (you couldn't get the 4.0 V6 in the short Aerostar, except if it was AWD) Remember taking a trip with the girls (mom had to stay home and work). Traveled all over. Was able to fold down the seats in the back into a huge 'play pen'. They loved it back there. (When traffic was light, I let them out of their seat belts for a while)

I'd like to add that with the Iraq/Afghan conflict, that many troops, like myself are getting paralyzed by IEDs. (though I wasnt) If they become quadriplegic, such as myself, we usually get a mini-man.

I bet a good percentage is from that....

Now, I have a Dodge caravan, and wouldn't mind dropping it on bags like that above....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCBr5rnnOjE

what about the c-max? is that a crossover? i know it doesn't have the sliding door but i always thought it was the europe minivan

Over here there is a C-Max and a Grand C-Max, the Grand having sliding doors & 3rd row...I had a Grand C-Max rental for a few weeks with the 1.6 ecoboost and a six speed manual, it was awesome.

Posted via FF Mobile

This was on my mind last week, actually.

http://www.newsday.com/classifieds/cars/car-nation-1.811928/some-useless-vehicles-or-suvs-for-short-1.3886980

I want to grab an old ford van from the 60's and mod the carp out it. Drop that sucker.

Sent from my HTC PH39100 using Tapatalk 2

If we bought what we needed instead of following the crowd, you’d see many more small hatchbacks on the road (gas prices aside). Then again, if more of us thought for ourselves, we’d change much more about this country than what we drive.

That's why we have a mini-van in the family. It's much more chic than my old utilitarian Aerostar with power sliding doors left and right at the push of a button. It has it's issues though, and that folks is why Ford no longer builds mini-vans. They screwed it up big time- actually Texas Instruments helped screw it up for them big time. You have ABS modules that expand so much from heat that they rip wires loose from solder joints inside. You have a leaky brake fluid level switch that can cause a fire. You have the well known leaky cruise control that can start a fire, and to top it off, northern destination markets have big time issues with lack of rust prevention on the rear axle beams. The final episode of Windstar and Freestar is chocked full of recalls.

The good? Plenty there too. Here's a funny thing to look up- the 96-00 Windstar has the same engine as the V6 Mustang, but makes 25hp more. Whaaaaaaaat? Yep, check it out- until IMRC was added to the 6 popper Stang, it was a weakling compared to the Windstar motor. I wouldn't really call what it IMRC, it's more like a second intake port that opens at X rpm so the engine can breathe easier. Not exactly SVT, but it does what it was designed to do- as long as the electric motor controlling it works.

Some people let their things own them. I buy things to use no matter what it is. I personally can't see purchasing a daily driver like a Fiat 500 over something like a Corolla. At least your passengers can fit more comfortably in the boring Yota. It's definitely not stylin, but when the police are looking out.....who wants to blend in? Back to the mini-van, I never got a ticket in any of my vans. Not that I didn't speed, but it seems like I was just ignored.

I'd love to hot rod the Windstar, but that would just take away from it. It would be cool to have a total sleeper van though. Send the transmission to Lentech, get a 4.4 stroker kit from Morana V6 Racing (http://www.moranav6racing.com/), a Whipple, and work to manage some 255s up front. That might surprise a few ricers, but hell, my old 4.0 Aerostar already surprised some sans mods in Corinth MS- shamefully too. I'm fairly certain that the Windstar is faster than the old Aerostar. The 3.8 is a better engine than the 4.0 OHV, but each has it's place.

To each his own. Yeah, Transit Connect, nice try Ford, where's my TDCI? DuraTorq? Duratorq + Electric?

Prior to buying my HHR, I came pretty close to buying a 2005 Mercury Monterey. Test drove it. 4.2 V6. Lots of power, smooth and quiet.

It would be nice to see minivans take a chunk out of the sea of poser suv's out there. The SUV rose to fill the place of the minivan but didn't do it as well.

I think it would be pretty hard to make a mini van "cool." Somebody should try a roof chop job on one.

What I would like to see is the return of the wagon in the small or mid size segment. Seats 5 or 6 and has 6ft long cargo area in back.

Posted via FF Mobile After all the problems the windstar had, do you really think Ford would be able to sell more mini vans? Hell they just bought back tens of thousands of them. One of the reasons we dont have ours anymore. It was a pretty great family hauler, but after we found out that it had become unsafe to drive (as per Ford), bye bye.

Posted via FF Mobile After all the problems the windstar had, do you really think Ford would be able to sell more mini vans?

Nope, but Honda, Toyota, and Nissan make some fairly nice ones. All the Kia Sedonas I've seen have been near breaking. I remember riding around with the wife in the Windstar, she had wanted me to purchase a Kia mini-van, then we saw like 3 on the side of the road in the same day. Now she understands why we didn't get the newer YM Kia over the old Ford.

I didn't know they bought some back. I know the axle rusting was a big problem up in the salt belt, and yes, very dangerous. Southern vans have ABS problems thanks to TI. Our ABS light is on all the time, and I know it's not the wheel sensors.

Some people let their things own them. I buy things to use no matter what it is. I personally can't see purchasing a daily driver like a Fiat 500 over something like a Corolla. At least your passengers can fit more comfortably in the boring Yota. It's definitely not stylin, but when the police are looking out.....who wants to blend in? Back to the mini-van, I never got a ticket in any of my vans. Not that I didn't speed, but it seems like I was just ignored.


My uncle had an 03 Windstar up here in the salt belt...the whole rear subframe was a mess. He wound up buying a Santa Fe after that, I think (he needed something big, he transports medical supplies).

The minicars like the 500 worry me. Sure, I bet they have tons of air bags and great crash tests ratings, but you can't defy physics. I'm sure you've seen the video from a few years back when Mercedes did a frontal offset crash with a C Class and a ForTwo? The Smart held up alright, but it was punted and spun around. Who's to assume another car couldn't come along and hit it again after that?

Re: blending in - I completely agree. I sped just about everywhere in my old car, and I was never pulled over for it. Come to think of it, I was only pulled over twice in five years, and the first time was because it was 2AM on a January night and I had my windows down. I always blended in. Even now in the Focus I'm pretty invisible and I like it that way.

I break the laws in my loud, look-at-me-blue GTO with impunity. [:D][poke]

About the 500, I would like the Abarth or the new in between 500 Turbo... but for myself. I wouldn't put my family's life on the line (if I had a family).

Posted via FF Mobile

One thing that makes me happy about mini-vans on the used market is that those are still cheap compared to original sale price. You can pick up an Odyssey or Sienna a 3-4 yrs old for about half price if you can afford the payments. The same goes for the Nissan. What I totally fail to understand is the lack of column shifters. What is with the stupid looking and obstructive floor shifters mounted on the dash? With electronic transmissions, I've also failed to understand why there aren't many more pushbutton transmissions- similar to what BMW, Audi, and MB are doing in the higher end cars.

The world would be a better place without minivans.

The world would be a better place without minivans.

They're useful as people carriers, though.

A mini van wouldn't replace my SUV.

That's why we have a mini-van in the family. It's much more chic than my old utilitarian Aerostar with power sliding doors left and right at the push of a button. It has it's issues though, and that folks is why Ford no longer builds mini-vans. They screwed it up big time- actually Texas Instruments helped screw it up for them big time. You have ABS modules that expand so much from heat that they rip wires loose from solder joints inside. You have a leaky brake fluid level switch that can cause a fire. You have the well known leaky cruise control that can start a fire, and to top it off, northern destination markets have big time issues with lack of rust prevention on the rear axle beams. The final episode of Windstar and Freestar is chocked full of recalls.

The good? Plenty there too. Here's a funny thing to look up- the 96-00 Windstar has the same engine as the V6 Mustang, but makes 25hp more. Whaaaaaaaat? Yep, check it out- until IMRC was added to the 6 popper Stang, it was a weakling compared to the Windstar motor. I wouldn't really call what it IMRC, it's more like a second intake port that opens at X rpm so the engine can breathe easier. Not exactly SVT, but it does what it was designed to do- as long as the electric motor controlling it works.

Some people let their things own them. I buy things to use no matter what it is. I personally can't see purchasing a daily driver like a Fiat 500 over something like a Corolla. At least your passengers can fit more comfortably in the boring Yota. It's definitely not stylin, but when the police are looking out.....who wants to blend in? Back to the mini-van, I never got a ticket in any of my vans. Not that I didn't speed, but it seems like I was just ignored.

I'd love to hot rod the Windstar, but that would just take away from it. It would be cool to have a total sleeper van though. Send the transmission to Lentech, get a 4.4 stroker kit from Morana V6 Racing (http://www.moranav6racing.com/), a Whipple, and work to manage some 255s up front. That might surprise a few ricers, but hell, my old 4.0 Aerostar already surprised some sans mods in Corinth MS- shamefully too. I'm fairly certain that the Windstar is faster than the old Aerostar. The 3.8 is a better engine than the 4.0 OHV, but each has it's place.

To each his own. Yeah, Transit Connect, nice try Ford, where's my TDCI? DuraTorq? Duratorq + Electric?

I never got a ticket in my Windstar, either but maybe we weren't ignored per se but more like the cops felt sorry for us. [:p]

I had no idea about the Windstar engines! I had 2000.

The world would be a better place without minivans.

I don't mind them, I even drive them (for work). What I do mind is they tend to be driven by people who are oblivious... sorry to say that, but I call it like I see it, and that's the way it is here in CA. And yes, the next step vehicles like small car-based SUVs are driven by just as many oblivious people.

I've never been ticketed for speeding in a minivan (to the best of my recollection?).

"Vans are cool! When you're driving and you get hungry you slam on the brakes and something hits you in the head!" - Gallagher

Minivans are great for what they are built for, and nothing can really compete. A Dodge Grand Caravan has more space then an Explorer or a Durango, maybe even an Expedition. You can get one for like 22-24 brand new, and you can add in a ton of options (back up camera, DVD system, power out lets etc) and still keep the price less then a base explorer. They are worth their money, but it's the social stigma attached to it that hurts it.I've never sold a minivan that someone has been unhappy with, although they may have been unhappy before they got it.

Growing up we always had a minivan. They where very handy, my dad would use as a pick up truck and go to lowes and pick up supplies, on long trips my sister sat in the middle and watched TV and I stayed in the back and played on the laptop or game boy or w/e we had a inverter, and we had a 12 V outlet back there as well. When we got the stow-n-go we used to put coolers with drinks/sandwiches/snacks etc in the empty space below.

Also motion sickness pills basically will knock me out for like 12 hrs. So I used to buy some of that, take 2 and sleep for like 12 hours in the back, it was almost like having a bed.

For ultra long trips we'd take out one of the middle seats and had a little potty for my sister, and we had a mat for the dog. If I ever start a family on kid number 2 we will purchase a mini van.

O yea when I moved out of the house my dad said he'd keep his windstar with 225,000 miles until it became to expensive to own. At 260,000 miles it crapped out it was going cost us like $1,500 to fix so he traded it in for a pick up truck. (we also own an Escape)

They're useful as people carriers, though.

Buy a wagon. Or an SUV. Minivans are hideous.

I've never been ticketed for speeding in a minivan (to the best of my recollection?).

Probably the one good thing about them is that you blend right in lol.

Suburban camoflauge.