Hey All...I don't post on here much anymore. But took a long road trip with the boosted focus last week(2200 miles). Learned a few things about it that I did not know before. Thought I would share some. First the fuel mileage running at a steady 70-75mph with the A/C on constantly was about 27MPG. Secondly Tom tuned the car remotely.....and of course it ran perfect. The temp was 106 outside..no problems with overheating. But I wasn't pushing it. Now for the bad...Once you get west of Missouri...I could not find fuel with an octane over 92. Then the further I got, the worse the octane rating got. The highest I could find in New Mexico was 91..and even that was hard to come by. The car was remote tuned on 93 octane with no ethanol(Pennsylvania). Also when trying to run the cruise control when going up inclines the car would produce boost...which in theory would be good. But in practice is bad. Because it didn't give it enough throttle(in percentage) for the fuel mixture to go rich, only enough to produce boost, and maintain speed. I know this could be fixed in the tune. I'm just passing along information. Nothing other than that...except thanks to Tom, Clint, John and Ray...for helping me make the car run good.[thumb]

what part of eastern pa are you in?

X2^^^

do you have a stock engine with the turbo or did you half to replace a few parts??

what part of eastern pa are you in?

Bethlehem, just east of Allentown.

do you have a stock engine with the turbo or did you half to replace a few parts??

Forged low compression pistons and forged rods. Other than that everything else is stock.

Bethlehem, just east of Allentown.

cool!

Also when trying to run the cruise control when going up inclines the car would produce boost...which in theory would be good. But in practice is bad. Because it didn't give it enough throttle(in percentage) for the fuel mixture to go rich, only enough to produce boost, and maintain speed. I know this could be fixed in the tune.

I've talked to Tom about this probably 100's of times and he still disagrees with me on the matter. At least you know enough about what you're doing to not push it.

Depending on the boost he was making would depend on if he deeded the fuel to go richer , just because you have a few psi boost does not mean you need to leave stoich/closed loop

How much boost was it making ? at what RPM ?

Tom

Depending on the boost he was making would depend on if he deeded the fuel to go richer , just because you have a few psi boost does not mean you need to leave stoich/closed loop

How much boost was it making ? at what RPM ?

Tom

It was running about 2900-3200RPM. The boost got as high as about 7 or 8 psi, when I seen it wasnt getting off of stoich I tapped the brake to turn off cruise. With the lower octane and at that boost level I just didnt want to chance it. I wasnt sure what the limits were with that stuff, but I figured I was too close.

Also just as a side note...Im not complaining about the tune. Im very happy with the way the car ran.[thumb]

I'm thinking you should have a lower octane tune made for trips like this. That way if you have to go from 93 to 91 you can load up your lower octane tune and be fine.

I agree , I can make you a 89 octane tune to make using 87-91 much safer for trips

Shoot me an email (name of last tune) and let me see where I have your tps to open loop voltage set to

I know your happy with your tune or you would of said something by now , I am just trying to make your tune as safe as it can be and if there is an issue I want to correct it

Tom

I'm thinking you should have a lower octane tune made for trips like this. That way if you have to go from 93 to 91 you can load up your lower octane tune and be fine.

I agree, but I actually didnt know you couldnt buy decent fuel in the west...I was shocked to see the difference in fuel as you cross the country.

I agree , I can make you a 89 octane tune to make using 87-91 much safer for trips

Shoot me an email (name of last tune) and let me see where I have your tps to open loop voltage set to

I know your happy with your tune or you would of said something by now , I am just trying to make your tune as safe as it can be and if there is an issue I want to correct it

Tom

Thanks Tom, I just forwarded(emailed) you the last revision of the tune that you sent me.

and it runs smooth eh?

I live in bethlehem haha. small world

and it runs smooth eh?

If you keep your foot out of it, it runs like a stock focus..cruise, a/c. Only noticeable difference would be noise level inside due to exhaust, and VF engine mounts. Neither directly related to the car being turbo charged, just other aftermarket products installed.

I live in bethlehem haha. small world

Yes it is. Enjoy the fuel here while it lasts. Shell on Schoenersville....no ethanol and 93..[strongman]...most of country...[nutkick]

Yes it is. Enjoy the fuel here while it lasts. Shell on Schoenersville....no ethanol and 93..[strongman]...most of country...[nutkick][/QUOTE]

Thats the only gas station I go too haha. Maybe I will see you around someday!

Nice info. SO...you really shouldn't go into much boost while in cruise control? I have toms tune as well.

I havn't went on any long trips in my SVT but it's deff. something I wouldn't have thought to much about lol

I set most FI to 400 tps counts to go open loop , yours is set there , If I move it much lower then you will at times when shifting go into open loop

Do you have any idea what the tps was going to or what the AF was

Tom

Nice info. SO...you really shouldn't go into much boost while in cruise control? I have toms tune as well.

I havn't went on any long trips in my SVT but it's deff. something I wouldn't have thought to much about lol

It sounds like that is a matter of opinion. Its not the Cruise itself that had me somewhat concerned and had me turning it off. Its like pushing the car, but not giving it enough throttle to put it into open loop. Which makes it run rich(which is what you need when running boost). When it was only a couple of pounds running up a slight grade. I let it do it...no big deal. But when it started building pressure over 5 psi...it was starting to push me back in the seat starting to make some power, but I could tell by the wideband that it wasnt going rich...then I didnt want to damage anything, and simply took over for the cruise. Maybe I am over cautious, but its my engine..and that is what I thought was correct. I am always open to opinion. And I obviously trust Toms judgement otherwise I wouldnt have had him tune it. He did and is still doing an excellent job with it.

I set most FI to 400 tps counts to go open loop , yours is set there , If I move it much lower then you will at times when shifting go into open loop

Do you have any idea what the tps was going to or what the AF was

Tom

Im sorry Tom, I have absolutly no idea what the TPS was hitting. Is there a max amount of throttle that the cruise will give it? It was pulling hard. The Gauge was still switching between like 14.5...up to about 14.9...it wasnt dropping down like it did if I gave it more throttle. Which is exactly what I would have done, had I had the right fuel in it.

Also I would just like to mention to anyone reading this, and having potentially the same issue, this didnt happen often at all. It was only when pulling a significant grade, and I was cruising between 75 and 80MPH. I just dont want anyone to think this is happening anytime the cruise is on, or anytime you go on a long trip, its only under high load, with cruise on.

If you get in these situations much I can try some things , If not then lets leave it alone

One day when you have some time we can go over user adjustability and remove some global timing and this will allow you to run the 87-91 safely , Your knock sensor the way I have things set took over if needed and kept things safe

You were correct to let off with both low octane and an unsafe A/F , you did exactly what you should of done

Tom

just because you have a few psi boost does not mean you need to leave stoich/closed loop

Tom

I dunno, I'm not sure how I feel about that. By that logic I can run my NA motor at 14.7 always, never have to leave closed loop ever. Which we all know is not the case. But we can certainly agree to disagree here as we have before.

Damage, do you have a 65mm throttle?

For me the OL table ranges from 150 to 200 depending on rpm, meaning about 300-350 absolute counts, and I never ever drop into open loop just cruising. The transition is pretty much at .75-.8 load. And I have some ramp built into the base table on top of that so if it does happen to dip into OL it will still run 14 ish at .75 and high 13s at .8 load.

I really wish Ford just made the OL and base fuel tables load based that would make all this so much more simple, instead we have to futz around trying to map TP to load and whatnot (though I guess we have to do that anyway in the LWFM table)

If you get in these situations much I can try some things , If not then lets leave it alone

One day when you have some time we can go over user adjustability and remove some global timing and this will allow you to run the 87-91 safely , Your knock sensor the way I have things set took over if needed and kept things safe

You were correct to let off with both low octane and an unsafe A/F , you did exactly what you should of done

Tom

No it doesnt happen often, I say we leave it alone. Not a big deal. I have seen how to change global timings in my user adjustability. I just didnt know how much to change or alter it. With the way you have my engine tuned. How much do you recommend dropping the timing when having to run lower octane fuel. And how can I determine if it is enough? I would assume I would do a hard pull with prolink hooked up and make sure it isnt pulling more timing? Is this correct?

I dunno, I'm not sure how I feel about that. By that logic I can run my NA motor at 14.7 always, never have to leave closed loop ever. Which we all know is not the case. But we can certainly agree to disagree here as we have before.

Damage, do you have a 65mm throttle?

For me the OL table ranges from 150 to 200 depending on rpm, meaning about 300-350 absolute counts, and I never ever drop into open loop just cruising. The transition is pretty much at .75-.8 load. And I have some ramp built into the base table on top of that so if it does happen to dip into OL it will still run 14 ish at .75 and high 13s at .8 load.

I really wish Ford just made the OL and base fuel tables load based that would make all this so much more simple, instead we have to futz around trying to map TP to load and whatnot (though I guess we have to do that anyway in the LWFM table)

No, the stock throttle plate is being used.

ok then you wouldnt need a transition as low as 150-200 relative counts like mine, but if you care enough to change this I think you guys should be able to map a certain throttle counts to 1.0 load. just go do a log holding steady at 300, 325, 350, 375, 400 RELATIVE TP counts through the rev range each time and see where your load is at for the various relative TP's and RPM's, you can build a good transition table and base fuel table ramp off of that. Plus you could get the LWFM table in better shape doing this which would help improve transient events.

BTW I keep saying relative because I have found that all of these tables run off relative TP counts, not absolute, and I have datalog proof of that fact on three different Focus ECU strategies.

Not saying Tom is doing anything wrong just trying to help and explaining what has worked really well for me. There are many different means to an end in tuning and I'm sure Tom's tune runs perfectly safely (as it has been shown by 100's of builds around here). It's just not how I would do things.

If going to 87 just take out 4 deg global 2-6000rpm, the knock sensor the way I have it set will allow for much much more then that , I wouldnt do this to make hard long WOT pulls but for crusing and playing you should be fine

If you see this happening again and you have the global timing out then just ease into the throttle slightly till you see it go rich and hold till you over the hill .400 is 40% throttle and just before half way

Tom

There is no need in changing the load with failed maf tables , he isnt having any tip in issues or hesitation

You allways seem to go to the extreem with things that just dont need to be changed , why change 5 things when changing 2 or 1 will do the same thing

His tune has been doing fine , he went into conditions he never tryed before and some adjustment could be made to help his issues by lowering the tps to open loop , thats an easy fix no need to complicate it by making a bunch of changes that have nothing to do with the issue he is having or that would help it any more then the switch to go OL

Tom

just so you guys know a factory turbo car will do just the same as tom's tune. my focus tuned by tom and my sti were pretty much identical with the amount of throttle required to come out of closed loop and both build boost while using cruise and climbing hills at stoic.

Well I did need to change all of those things to get my car to run right. Like I said, different means to an end. I prefer to use the ECU as Ford intended it, you just have a different way around it.

I DO use the ECU as ford intended it to be used , a lot of what you feel YOU NEED to change are caused by other things you have changed that actually dont need to be , Like smokey said "If it makes you feel better then do it" If it works for you then do it , I dont feel or see the need to

Tom

smokey uniq(sp)??

Smokey Yunick , A very smart man when it came to engines , I am honored to of had the time to talk to him over the years . I learned a lot from him , when he passed the world lost one of the slyest and smartest Mechanics the world has known

Tom

just did some reading up on him, seems like a really cool dude would have been nice to meet him. You're lucky Tom [:)]

I herd about him when I was taking mechanics in high school. My shop teacher had the chance to meet the guy once and I had herd a lot about him.

Very very smart guy


My shop teacher told me once when Smokey was racing (way back when), rules were you could only have so big of a fuel tank. well Smokey just ran longer fuel lines throughout his race car, he was still racing while everyone else was making pit stops for fuel haha it wasn't cheating at the time because they hadn't made rules about that YET... until he did it Lol very sly.