hey i got a question for you guys. now i plan on going to school to work for ford. i love fords mustangs the trucks and the svt focus is my car i actually want this car. but lately ive been dealing with hondas and they are pretty damn nice and fast. now i was wondering do you think its disloyal to work for ford or want to work for them and own a honda or no? and second question actuallly focus svt or honda civic

SVT... dum question...lol

just giving ya a hard time...

their is no disloyalty in owning a honda and working at ford.. if u like to work on fords go for it...

and as for what car to get...

get a honda if you want a car that is cheap and easy to mod but wont hold up in a wreck as well is a focus will...

i love my SVT and i would never give it up for a Civic or any other honda... i have yet to get beat by a N/A honda in my SVT even one with a built motor... and my SVT will smoke SI Civics all day long so ill stick with the SVT but if hondas are what you know. might be what you should stick with...

hey i got a question for you guys. now i plan on going to school to work for ford. i love fords mustangs the trucks and the svt focus is my car i actually want this car. but lately ive been dealing with hondas and they are pretty damn nice and fast. now i was wondering do you think its disloyal to work for ford or want to work for them and own a honda or no? and second question actuallly focus svt or honda civic

Its all a matter of personal opinion.... I think Honda makes a great daily driver but Fords are just a lot more fun to own and drive, especially if you have a performance Ford (ie Lightning, Mustang, SVTF, etc). If you like Hondas, buy a Honda. But I think if you really truly love Ford, your heart should speak to you loud and clear. [8D]

As for the SVTF or a Civic, the SVTF allllllll the way, even over the Si. Why? I not only think it looks a million times better, but the handling, braking and interior space is much better on the Focus, too. The Focus wont be quite as reliable as the Civic, but you only have one life to live, make sure its fun! [headbang]

^^^No Focus comes close to the newer model Si. I had an '08 and if you know how to drive you can get pretty wild in one. There's no comparison. Now, with price factored in, it's a different equation. If you have the money, or want to spend the money, the Si is a better car. That said, my diff was leaking with 3,000 miles on the car, the seats were already showing way too much wear, the interior rattled like an '86 K-Car, the paint was chipping, etc, etc, etc. But, it would smoke any Focus without a ton of mods on it.

^^^No Focus comes close to the newer model Si. I had an '08 and if you know how to drive you can get pretty wild in one. There's no comparison. Now, with price factored in, it's a different equation. If you have the money, or want to spend the money, the Si is a better car. That said, my diff was leaking with 3,000 miles on the car, the seats were already showing way too much wear, the interior rattled like an '86 K-Car, the paint was chipping, etc, etc, etc. But, it would smoke any Focus without a ton of mods on it.

The new Si is pretty quick in a straight line, but the Si is also several years newer than the SVT. And from what Ive seen, the SVT still outhandles it and outbrakes it. And the new Si's interior is about as butt-friggin-fugly as they come, same goes for the exterior which, well, brings me back to my original post. For the money, the SVT is one of the best performance bargains on earth... the Civic Si is definitely not.

^^^No Focus comes close to the newer model Si. I had an '08 and if you know how to drive you can get pretty wild in one. There's no comparison. Now, with price factored in, it's a different equation. If you have the money, or want to spend the money, the Si is a better car. That said, my diff was leaking with 3,000 miles on the car, the seats were already showing way too much wear, the interior rattled like an '86 K-Car, the paint was chipping, etc, etc, etc. But, it would smoke any Focus without a ton of mods on it.

Just to throw out some factual numbers to back up my claim above...

June 2009 Car & Driver Civic Si results (pg 39)

Roadholding: .87 gs
0-60 mph: 7.7 seconds
Braking 70-0: 178'
Emergency lane change: 62.7 mph



SVTF

Roadholding: .91 gs
0-60 mph: 7.7 seconds
Braking 70-0: 170'
Emergency lane change: 74.6 mph


SVTF: From an online Car & Driver SVT test result:
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/comparisons/02q1/ford_svt_focus_vs._honda_civic_si_vw_gti-comparison_tests

Results of the comparo (which included the last gen Si--which the SVT soundly also trounced):
http://www.caranddriver.com/var/ezflow_site/storage/original/application/34ab405774bd2da62d022f3649dfc9a8.pdf


As I stated in my above posts... the SVTF outhandles, outbrakes, and is pretty much in a dead-heat with the Si in acceleration. It costs far less, looks better, offers more interior room/utility and all this with techonology that is several years behind and with 30 less hp. The SVTF is the better of the car if you ask me (minus reliability). [headbang]

The typed results from the last gen Si vs the SVTF (a more fair comparo than an 03 SVTF vs a 09 Si). As you can read, the SVTF is the clear choice for a sporty car, and the fact that it still beats the current Si (see above) in many categories is testament to how well the SVTF really does handle:

"It would be fair to say that the SVT Focus is the ringer of the group. This low-volume car is a more specialized tool than the Si or GTI. But at $19,265 well optioned, the SVT Focus with all the go-faster parts is cheaper than the GTI and on par with the Si.

Even if you exclude price from consideration, the Focus is a winner. After trundling around in the Civic and herding the GTI through the Streets of Willow, we found the Focus to be a revelation. It is simply in a handling class all by itself.
Credit goes first to the tires. The 215/45WR-17 Continentals were the only tires in the group with big, flat tread blocks for maximum grip. (You want winter traction? Get winter tires.)

For the first several laps in the Focus we were turning in way too early for corners, following the line the two other cars demanded. The Focus's aggressive tires brought quickness and conviction to every move of the steering wheel.

But the SVT's handling prowess comes from more than just tires. The SVT folks massaged and recalibrated the strut-front and multilink-rear suspension (including bushings, shocks, anti-roll bars, and springs) of the already fine-handling base Focus to achieve handling character that borders on magical. Suspension tuning is a black art, and SVT Engineering is staffed with wizards. The four-wheel disc brakes (with standard ABS) are strong and progressive, helping the SVT post an excellent 70-to-0-mph distance of 170 feet.

The SVT Focus is the only car here that would have its rear wheels coaxed into a slide. It rotates beautifully and can be set into a steady four-wheel drift at will. Only in extreme situations would this playfulness pose a problem for the injudicious driver. Our emergency-lane-change maneuver is one such situation. The SVT posted the best time through the gates—a significant 5.2 mph faster than the Civic—but it was also the only car that required some countersteer after the first gate to keep from spinning. Given this car's intent, we are not bothered in the least by this.

And although SVT must have spent as much time tuning the engine as the suspension, the results are less impressive. There's nothing terribly wrong with the 170-hp Zetec 2.0-liter. It just wasn't all that stellar an engine to begin with. For SVT duty, the Zetec gets a new dual-stage intake and a new exhaust header, variable intake-valve system, forged steel connecting rods, cast aluminum pistons (bumping the compression ratio up to 10.2:1), and freer-flowing exhaust. You probably couldn't squeeze too much more out of the engine without adding forced induction or adversely affecting drivability. For all that work, though, the Focus is not as fast as you might expect. At 7.8 seconds to 60 mph and 16.1 seconds through the quarter-mile, it's barely quicker than the Honda. The slick-shifting six-speed Getrag manual transmission, which uses a 2.88:1 final drive for first, second, fifth, and sixth gears and a separate 4.25:1 final drive for third and fourth gears, helps keep the engine on the boil. But like its standard-tune brother, this is not an engine that revs easily or quickly.

Our judges unanimously voted the Focus the best-looking of these three. Its subtle roof spoiler, air dam, and handsome five-spoke wheels are the most tasteful add-ons offered on a compact performance car. The roomy interior—thanks in part to the longest wheelbase in the test—is also dressed up with appropriate restraint. The two-tone blue and black sport seats are comfortable and supportive. Even the rear seats have plenty of thigh support, and rear passengers will find ample headroom. White-face gauges, including small SVT-only oil pressure and temperature, add a sporty touch. Our SVT came equipped with the Audiophile sound system, which includes a large subwoofer that steals too much cargo space. Maybe we're getting old, but we'd prefer the utility to thumpin' bass.

Also inside you'll find the first shortcomings of the car. It would be the perfect hot hatch if only for a little more sophistication. The SVT is the loudest of the group. And although the growling exhaust sounds are great when heard from outside, they're grating from inside the cockpit. The aggressive tires also make more noise over varying road surfaces than the more pedestrian rubber on the two other cars. The car we tested felt as if each of its 7000 miles were driven at redline over railroad tracks. One would hope that as production ramps up in Mexico Ford will exorcise the most egregious squeaks and rattles. Even during a steady-state expressway cruise the accelerator pedal and the steering wheel telegraph far too much vibration from the engine and the road. Those pedal vibrations only become more insistent with higher revs.

Then again, if you're working up there around the 7000-rpm power peak, you're probably having too much fun anyways!"

the idea of being loyal to a car company.................geez

If you are serious that you want to work for Ford in some capacity, then yes, you should have some Ford in your stable. A 'project' SVT Focus would look real good on your resume'. Are you going for an engineering position? If so, some kind of personal project is almost mandatory - sort of a 'thesus' for auto engineers. You could do a kit car, or maybe even design and build you own. Start networking now to develop the resources you'll need to get a project like that done. Take welding courses, autobody courses, etc......

most of us on here would never trade a civic over a focus, at least not live to tell about it!

The typed results from the last gen Si vs the SVTF (a more fair comparo than an 03 SVTF vs a 09 Si). As you can read, the SVTF is the clear choice for a sporty car, and the fact that it still beats the current Si (see above) in many categories is testament to how well the SVTF really does handle:

"It would be fair to say that the SVT Focus is the ringer of the group. This low-volume car is a more specialized tool than the Si or GTI. But at $19,265 well optioned, the SVT Focus with all the go-faster parts is cheaper than the GTI and on par with the Si.

Even if you exclude price from consideration, the Focus is a winner. After trundling around in the Civic and herding the GTI through the Streets of Willow, we found the Focus to be a revelation. It is simply in a handling class all by itself.
Credit goes first to the tires. The 215/45WR-17 Continentals were the only tires in the group with big, flat tread blocks for maximum grip. (You want winter traction? Get winter tires.)

For the first several laps in the Focus we were turning in way too early for corners, following the line the two other cars demanded. The Focus's aggressive tires brought quickness and conviction to every move of the steering wheel.

But the SVT's handling prowess comes from more than just tires. The SVT folks massaged and recalibrated the strut-front and multilink-rear suspension (including bushings, shocks, anti-roll bars, and springs) of the already fine-handling base Focus to achieve handling character that borders on magical. Suspension tuning is a black art, and SVT Engineering is staffed with wizards. The four-wheel disc brakes (with standard ABS) are strong and progressive, helping the SVT post an excellent 70-to-0-mph distance of 170 feet.

The SVT Focus is the only car here that would have its rear wheels coaxed into a slide. It rotates beautifully and can be set into a steady four-wheel drift at will. Only in extreme situations would this playfulness pose a problem for the injudicious driver. Our emergency-lane-change maneuver is one such situation. The SVT posted the best time through the gates—a significant 5.2 mph faster than the Civic—but it was also the only car that required some countersteer after the first gate to keep from spinning. Given this car's intent, we are not bothered in the least by this.

And although SVT must have spent as much time tuning the engine as the suspension, the results are less impressive. There's nothing terribly wrong with the 170-hp Zetec 2.0-liter. It just wasn't all that stellar an engine to begin with. For SVT duty, the Zetec gets a new dual-stage intake and a new exhaust header, variable intake-valve system, forged steel connecting rods, cast aluminum pistons (bumping the compression ratio up to 10.2:1), and freer-flowing exhaust. You probably couldn't squeeze too much more out of the engine without adding forced induction or adversely affecting drivability. For all that work, though, the Focus is not as fast as you might expect. At 7.8 seconds to 60 mph and 16.1 seconds through the quarter-mile, it's barely quicker than the Honda. The slick-shifting six-speed Getrag manual transmission, which uses a 2.88:1 final drive for first, second, fifth, and sixth gears and a separate 4.25:1 final drive for third and fourth gears, helps keep the engine on the boil. But like its standard-tune brother, this is not an engine that revs easily or quickly.

Our judges unanimously voted the Focus the best-looking of these three. Its subtle roof spoiler, air dam, and handsome five-spoke wheels are the most tasteful add-ons offered on a compact performance car. The roomy interior—thanks in part to the longest wheelbase in the test—is also dressed up with appropriate restraint. The two-tone blue and black sport seats are comfortable and supportive. Even the rear seats have plenty of thigh support, and rear passengers will find ample headroom. White-face gauges, including small SVT-only oil pressure and temperature, add a sporty touch. Our SVT came equipped with the Audiophile sound system, which includes a large subwoofer that steals too much cargo space. Maybe we're getting old, but we'd prefer the utility to thumpin' bass.

Also inside you'll find the first shortcomings of the car. It would be the perfect hot hatch if only for a little more sophistication. The SVT is the loudest of the group. And although the growling exhaust sounds are great when heard from outside, they're grating from inside the cockpit. The aggressive tires also make more noise over varying road surfaces than the more pedestrian rubber on the two other cars. The car we tested felt as if each of its 7000 miles were driven at redline over railroad tracks. One would hope that as production ramps up in Mexico Ford will exorcise the most egregious squeaks and rattles. Even during a steady-state expressway cruise the accelerator pedal and the steering wheel telegraph far too much vibration from the engine and the road. Those pedal vibrations only become more insistent with higher revs.

Then again, if you're working up there around the 7000-rpm power peak, you're probably having too much fun anyways!"

7.7 seconds is high. I'd bet you $1,000 I could smoke a stock SVT in my Si, but I don't have it anymore. Now, it cost at least twice what an SVT would cost, so it's not a fair comparison. But to say they are equal is silly even though I respect the SVT very much. The Si's engine and tranny are just sick. The rest of the car sucked.

ok thanks guys and blackoutsvt what do you have in your engine

I have to agree with some people. I by no means am strictly loyal to any brand. I pick cars for how good they are regardless of the make. As vin diesl put it. I appriciate a fine body regardless of the make. There is nothing wrong with you buying a Honda. Bt if you love fords so much and wanna be involved in their company as a career I'd have to agree that you should be driving a ford. It's like homework. You gotta study ford and their products and test them and show your support for the company. You say you've been around hondas and think they are nice. Get back around fords, check out their new products lots of awesome ones like the svt raptort the 2010 fusions the new mustang the tuarus sho. Check out the upcoming models like the fiesta. Check out the new tech like ecoboost and their powershift duel clutch transmissions. Honda is a good company but fords about tho kick their ass. They have many things Honda can't even touch and are coming out with some great technology.

I have to agree with some people. I by no means am strictly loyal to any brand. I pick cars for how good they are regardless of the make. As vin diesl put it. I appriciate a fine body regardless of the make. There is nothing wrong with you buying a Honda. Bt if you love fords so much and wanna be involved in their company as a career I'd have to agree that you should be driving a ford. It's like homework. You gotta study ford and their products and test them and show your support for the company. You say you've been around hondas and think they are nice. Get back around fords, check out their new products lots of awesome ones like the svt raptort the 2010 fusions the new mustang the tuarus sho. Check out the upcoming models like the fiesta. Check out the new tech like ecoboost and their powershift duel clutch transmissions. Honda is a good company but fords about tho kick their ass. They have many things Honda can't even touch and are coming out with some great technology.

Word.

They have many things Honda can't even touch

Yeah, TORQUE. [headbang]

It's sort of an unwritten rule that you should drive a Ford if you work there. My dad works at Wayne Assembly, and they have a parking lot for Fords and a separate lot quite a distance away for other brands. You can drive something else, but you'll be walking a long way to work.

Also, my uncle was a welding engineer at Ford straight out of college in the early '80s. He drove an old VW bug when he started, and someone "suggested" that he trade it in. He drove a base-model 1984 Mercury Topaz for a few years until he could afford something nicer.

Drive whatever you like, man. Loyal to a car company?
You have the right and freedom to drive whatever you want. I thought freedom was a big deal in the U.S.

And about all this "buy american" stuff. The fact is that it's ancient history. Japanese and European cars are also built in the US, and parts are made all over the world for "american" cars. Hell, the U.S. National Guard sponsors a 350z and a Suzuki GSXR bike and the coast guard runs small boats on Honda and Yamaha powerplants. Think about it.

I have to agree with some people. I by no means am strictly loyal to any brand. I pick cars for how good they are regardless of the make. As vin diesl put it. I appriciate a fine body regardless of the make. There is nothing wrong with you buying a Honda. Bt if you love fords so much and wanna be involved in their company as a career I'd have to agree that you should be driving a ford. It's like homework. You gotta study ford and their products and test them and show your support for the company. You say you've been around hondas and think they are nice. Get back around fords, check out their new products lots of awesome ones like the svt raptort the 2010 fusions the new mustang the tuarus sho. Check out the upcoming models like the fiesta. Check out the new tech like ecoboost and their powershift duel clutch transmissions. Honda is a good company but fords about tho kick their ass. They have many things Honda can't even touch and are coming out with some great technology.

Well said, and agreed.

I agree with brand loyalty, but it should not be forced upon anyone. I think that to be loyal, you must know what else is out there and understand the underpinnings of why you like what you do.

I think that if you go out and buy a Honda while working at Ford, it is your duty to say why you like that model, and what Ford could have done that Honda does. If it is speed or handling, comfort, or looks, it should be drilled into Ford that they did not do what you wanted them to! If they don't like what you did simply based upon emotion, they're not worth your time.