Guy's i Now own a Garret T25 which is mint in every way. she's clean as a wistle too........now suggestions on what to run and where to get good prices, considering the closest dyno is 5000km away........im running stock engine and bosal exhaust...........do how about turbo componets now? plumbing?

bump...


i need input........im not great with turbos, gimme the gear i can install it, done it to a buddies civic, and helped my old man do alot of them when i was in toronto........but i can't run the math to build one, i wann breaka i'd say 200-225? whp....... plus ill be getting stafe 2 cams and full port job done too so that'll help.........

toms kit is really good, www.focus-power.com and you could get a starter set or whatever it's called. however i think his is set up for a T3/T4...

I use a custom T/3 in my kits

Tom

So, you bought the turbo and don't know how to hook it up? Do you have any experience with installing a turbocharger?

well. u need a turbo mani, wastegate, intercooler w/ plumbing, plumbing, oil lines, down pipe, clamps, gaskets, hoses, all kinds of hardware + engine management

i know what im doing, but l want to the best way to go about it hear other ppls opinions.........this wont be my first turbo install. about my? 6th?7th?

ok i have the manifold covered, and a buddy of mine will custom bend the pipes for me.... so should i use the stock wastegate or get something bigger? what should i use to FMU ??? closet dyno is 5k km away......and im running stock motor but i want around 200+ HP, also what about electronic boost controller? Tom can ya help me out? i sent you a message.

come on guys im not getting much help with the Fuel managment? can ya help me out please?

6th or 7th? Uhh, a turbo install is a very long process, atleast a day out of your life to do it, and 6 or 7 are kinda low numbers... I'd think you would be able to decipher how many complete turbo installs you did, which was it, 6 or 7 =0. If you did the install before, you'd know what engine management you'd need, please don't do this install. Have a professional custom build you a kit and have them to the install or you'll end up blowing your engine out of your car and destroying a nice lil' focus.

im not trying to sound like a dick or anything, but i did'nt ask to get flamed about irrelavent things......and jsut ot set the record, i did mostly wrench work and running the oil lines, i have never delt with the fuel management so im a rookie to that, an frankly where i can't get a dyno here in newfoundland, im kind of stumped with tunning it, i have heard pectel has a plug and play unit but i have'nt found much info on it... and the fuel managment tom has on his site is proably fine for what im looking at, but i can't buy it seperately with out buying the starter kit it says.....mmm.... and as for the turbo installs, im not the only one in on this, i have 2 guy's i searched out here that have built numerous kits for 1.6 civics around the city, and are helping me. but on my own im asking for your guy's advice? what am i better off running for a FMU ? can i get some strait suggestions please...

talk to to tom, he can get a fuel management system for u not sure how it will go with the t25. go to www.focus-power.com really outside of standalone, MIC is the only feasable option

yeah Eurozx3 look at the bottom of the MIC kit page and it says this "[:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)]MIC Kit is only available with the purchase of the Starter Kit. MIC Kit is already included in a Complete Turbo Kit. Dyno tuning is recommended to ensure optimal performance."

that sucks, umm there are a few other guys that can do this stuff on the zx3... id have to look around though. see if u can get a hold of focaltech or pm him

im not getting many ideas on helping wit the fuel management, can someone help me out here or wha? thanks for your time

When you say "fuel management" you're talking about adjusting the fuel-air ratio to compensate for a lean or rich condition you anticipate facing post-install with the turbo running, right?

So you need a way to monitor fuel-air ratio while running the car through it's gears, right?

And you have to be able to repeatedly burn chips to make this correction, right?

Is it even possible to do this without a dyno these days? Sorry you're not getting much help here. I doubt many folks have had to do this without a dyno and associated equipment. I've only SEEN this type of tuning in the speed shop, and 1) there were several computers hooked up car 2) which was on a dyno 3) that was in a shop that was an authorized Diablo chip dealer that could burn chips all day long. I have NO idea how you would figure out fuel management after a turbo install without that kind of technical support.

Good luck.

Sincerely,

Beetle

First off not to flame you, but you do not seem to know alot about tuning engines, FI or otherwise.

You cannot use a FMU on a focus. The focus is a completely computer controlled car running a returnless fuel system. This means you cannot use a FMU or fuel pressure regulator, the PCM controls fuel delivery.

So you got a turbo, ok, now you need everything else. Hardware wise, perhaps you should talk to tom about getting his starter kit. If you cannot afford it, stay away from turboing your car b/c the hardware is the easy part.

Tuning, you currently have 2 choices, a chip or a stand alone module. A stand alone system will run you $ 1500+ and is complicated to install and use. Look at vashs ordeal for example.
Next is a chip, you would need to contact a reputable focus tuner, very few around. Then you need to go there for tuning, chip reburning and dyno tuning.

These cars are not hondas, there is no comparison.

i ahve decided to use wbo2 and mega squirter, there's hardware and programs that will endable me to tune the car with out a dyno, should lookinto it if anyones interested......friend of mine is using it and has had no problems....

Dude, wtf are you talking about?

Have you ever heard of them? ......hang on ill post a website with info on them....DIY-WB is a true wideband oxygen sensor setup just like they use at dyno shops, not the fake 3 or 4 wire NB oxygen sensors that are claimed to be WB. Nowadays, techedge wbo2 can be purchased cheap and assembled, AEM also has assembled, affordable setup....http://wbo2.com/

i know you all definately think im on crack or something, but with this assembly and the right sfotware, which i also have i can do this.....when the project succeeds ill post all the details for you to see. cause i know all of you think that's the focus will just go BOOM....but she wont......

Did you even read the sites info. It is a WB o2 sensor setup, this allows you to monitor, not change anything.

but the hardware/software with megasquirt allows you to change a the air/fuel..... buddie of mine is mechanical engineer. im sure will get by safely and promising.

so your saying that with all the trouble that everyone else who has tried to build their own setup, and had their own tuning done has had, that you will not have the same problems? so your a mechanical engineer, what do you know of the Focus specifically, i think you should do alot more research on it, there is only one programthat i have seen offered for home tuning (superchip/fordchip), and it hasnt been released yet, for the focus anyway, and you still need a dyno, not sure it would even work for turbo tuning

i know you all think im diving into the turbo. but im taking my yime and looking at every possible problem.....the reason why i will be able to tune with the wideband is because if i replaced the injector line from the computer to the injecter with the wide band the computer will think that everything is still fine, and i will be able to run the pulse of them etc....be able to edit my rev limiter, and also even get rid of the govonor providing it is based to cut off's at the fuel pump and not in the computer.....if you guy's could bare with me and answer the scatter questions i have about the focus it would be great. ill keep ya up to date on this.....

The problem is that the focus PCM will NOT let you do any of this with the software you are talking about.

The focus computer is not plug and play, why do you think so many tuners are having a big problem with it. Only the Pectel T2 and one or two other stand alones can even be made to work on the focus.

Alright Focaltech, and everyone thank's for the info, im gonna look into it a bit more, far as i found noone has trade this hardware/software.....not to say they havent tried this but jsut saying i ahvent found anything on anyone using on a zetec......but also this caught my eye...http://www.pectelusa.com/new_products.html
a PLug and Play Focus kit.... look and gimme some more input

also has anyone tried the AEM plug play unit with the wideband uego??

Please post pics when your engine explodes.

I'm the buddy Nick is talking about....

Megasquirt
http://www.bgsoflex.com/megasquirt.html
http://members.shaw.ca/megasquirt/manual/mtabcon.htm

Tuning performed using a wideband o2 sensor

Can't ask for much better fuel setup in my opinion, especially for the price.

yeah, it may just work fine on a focus...I'm still making sure, there are a few loose ends. I DO actually know what I'm doing though, and NO he won't blow up his engine. C'mon guys, do you have to be so hard on someone who's asking for help????

HOWEVER, the question is, with stock ign timing and excellent fuel control (perfectly tuned) can one run 8psi safely and reliably with just 91-92 octane premium fuel. I doubt we'll have any problems, I bet there are many of you out there with less sophisticated fuel setups then the megasquirt and stock ign timing doing the exact same thing....please speak up!

Thanks
Ben

To answer your question NO it is the timing ,to small of an injector that is the down fall of the Zetec

What you are doing is only addressing fuel and that can be done with the Pro-M tweeker for 185.00

The timing on the Focus Zetec is very aggressive and will not take ANY boost

Tom

We were planning on running 42lb Injectors. But Tom, what can be done about the timing? get a timing retard? ... say a "MSD DIS Ignitions DIS-2" or a "MSD DIS High Output -DIS-2" from seanhylandfocus.com?

If that' won't handle it then All im looking for is you Fuel Management kit you have at focus-power.com. That' would take care of what i want, would it not? But you wont/dont sell that separte will/do you?

Originally posted by 1turbofocus
To answer your question NO it is the timing ,to small of an injector that is the down fall of the Zetec

What you are doing is only addressing fuel and that can be done with the Pro-M tweeker for 185.00

The timing on the Focus Zetec is very aggressive and will not take ANY boost

Tom

Tom, though I'm sure you know what you're talking about (so please point out where I've gone wrong), I find it VERY hard to believe that an engine with a nice hemi chamber/4 valves with a relatively low 9.6:1 comp ratio which is supposed to run on 87 octane fuel CANNOT take ANY boost with 92 oct...that seems very odd to me. From my limited experience (and admittedly not with a focus, but lets be honest, it isn't stock running 92 oct with comp ratio of 11:1) most low tuned engines have no problems whatsoever with no mods to the ign timing, only adequate fuel, with low boost, say 6psi. And I've seen them run with niether good fuel OR ign management!

I'm just looking for a bunch of examples of people blowing up their engines from stock ign timing, NOT inadequate fuel....most people can't even get the fuel correct for crying out loud!

And my fuel solution doesn't use the stock MAF sensor, though it is kept running for the PCM to use engine load for ign timing, and I would no doubt have to limit the voltage out of the MAF so the PCM doesn't go all "fuel cut/too much air/abort abort!" on us. But I haven't even looked into that yet, I'll have to get intimate with focuses...it would be nice to get rid of the MAF system completely.

And obviously, we would use big honking injectors...

if the MSD DIS-2 has proven to work on focuses (people have only used them successfully on obd1 saturns), then perhaps we have to go down that road as well. But for the price of an MSD-DIS2 thingy, I can probably implement a completely programmeable ignition setup as well.

Ben

Ben you cant have your cake and eat it to QUOTE "And my fuel solution doesn't use the stock MAF sensor, though it is kept running for the PCM to use engine load for ign timing,"

You have to use it or not use it but you cant do both,If you just leave it pluged in for the ECU to read than when the RPM goes up and it does not see a load (air moving) this will ADD TIMING ,Load vs RPM is where it looks for timing ,,This is why doing larger injectors and recal mass air ADDS TIMING

Now there is no way to unhook it other than a stand alone

And the DIS-2 is worthless on the Focus

All i can say is NO boost is safe on the Focus Zetec with out addressing the timing

The stock injectors and mass air will be at 5 volts and 100% dutyclcle in no time and stop adding fuel yet your RPM will still go up
So larger injectors are needed this in turn calls for a Recal. mass air but this also ADDS TIMING to an allready aggressive timing table and will spk knock with 55gal of fuel going in it

Tom

I don't think you understand how the MS is implemented, it is a FULLY PROGRAMMEABLE FUEL STANDALONE using speed density. Yes, you can keep the stock MAF running for the stock ECU, though the MS has its own MAP sensor and operates the injectors instead of the stock ECU (wires from the injectors to stock ecu are CUT). The stock ECU doesn't realize it isn't controlling the injectors. The MAF remains connected, and the ECU still thinks its controlling fuel, but it isn't physically wired to the injectors anymore. Then you can run any injectors you'd like and have complete control over them with the stock ecu doing everything else as it used to.

By keeping the stock MAF, we retain the stock ignition timing. And we'd probably have to limit the max voltage out of the MAF in case the ecu does things to ign as well when the MAF voltage is pegged.

I appreciate your advice, I will definitely look into the stock ign timing and setup on the zetec engine

Ben

Tom, what about your engine management kit, what's the spec reall on it... the 42lbs injectors, the maf and chip... but is the maf programmed for wha? and also what's the chipped programmed for?

The MAF is Recal for the 42lb injectors and the chip is set for boost and has 4 tuned settings to go to a dyno with and this gives you some tuneability

ben,, I understand how it works and that it is a lot like a standalone but if the MAF has to be plugged in it has to be for a reason if the ECU sees it there and no air going through it that weird thing are going to happen,,If there is air going through it and the ECU sees this and hits the fuel cut and the injectors dont go to fuel cut that it will fall to limp moad

And all this still can be done with a 189.00 Pro-M tweecker and a Recal maf,,The problem is still timing NOT the fuel,,Why not just go with the new superchipsSCT or the new diablo self tuning

Tom

[:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)]* turbo.. way to complicated.. super charger or all motor. lol

been a while, and i've decided to build up the motor, and port polish the head alittle. figured i'd just let you all know. that turbo has been aborted, ill finish building up the motr, and next year get a Supercharger. dont worry you aint gonna see a blown focus from me haha

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