Ford Focus Forum, Ford Focus ST Forum, Ford Focus RS Forum - View Single Post - How-To flush ATX fluid and change filter
View Single Post
Old 02-06-2013, 06:52 AM   #76
Focus Jr. Enthusiast
200two-zx3's Avatar
Join Date: Jan 2013
Fan#: 108491
Location: between the lakes, MI
What I Drive: 2002 blue zx3

Posts: 42
FF Reputation: 2 200two-zx3 Good Standing Member
Buy-Sell-Trade Rating: (0)
Originally Posted by amc49 View Post
I've fixed enough transmissions to know that you can add up those particles and not get .002" out of them, the clutch packs will not work with that small an amount of thickness increase. Get a micrometer and measure the fluid if you will (pretty funny), or the trash in pan. The clutches have to wear relatively GREAT amounts to begin to slip, say .003" to '005" clearance each disc when loose on maybe 8 discs (steels and frictions together) that's .024" to .040"(close to or over one sixteenth inch) thick of wear there at slip time. That's after YEARS of wear. You would have to lose particles that big (small gravel size) to start slipping, at that point the clutch stack is too thin for the designed in clutch engagement distance. Even with only 6 discs there and thinner stack it's impossible. The TOTAL height of the clutch stack is what gets small enough to slip. 90% of the wear has to be there before the slip actually begins, there is NO WAY the fluid is going to carry that amount of thickness in particles, it would not be fluid but more like particle paste. Also draining the oil will still leave much of those steel particles stuck in discs to work like you say, BUT, they are too thin. They embed in the soft material to lose effective thickness too. Your 'little bit' of tolerance decrease won't do it, or if it did, the car only has another twenty minutes or so of movement left in trans.

Build a trans and measure some clutch packs going back together, they have to be anywhere from around .030" to .100"+ loose depending on model to be right and not seize while slipping with clutch not energized. You're saying .002" or so is going to make that trans jump up and live again? I don't think so. Like I said if so then trans was going to break in the next 5 minutes anyway.

I said I could do the work not that I would, you misconstrued the english there. I also never said one should change the fluid, just that doing so wouldn't and couldn't cause trans to fail by and of itself. I would be more in the line of 'get a new trans, no sense hoping your lack of competence is not going to hurt you now'. People who treat vehicles like that deserve to walk for a while to teach themselves a lesson.

I have heard all this many times before yet I still see no reason why the trans can fail with new oil in it unless it was due for failure shortly. Incompetence fostered that old wives tale, the incompetence that got the vehicle that way to begin with. So please don't go telling your friend with the shop that I said he was incompetent, because that is not so.

You'll love this one. Today brother in law calls crying about his Dodge 3500 Cummins ATX quit. Help he says. I have never worked on one or seen trans (48RE) before today. He says a ' reputable' (we'll not say who) transmission shop wants big bucks, $4000 quote) to R&R, trans is worn out according to them. They looked at it early in the day. I spent 2 hours on the web researching it, even found a factory service manual, Two parts bought later and trans is fixed, working perfectly. Cost around $135. I told him jokingly that he owned me close to $4k for 2 hours work.................

I own a Tempo that started slipping in mid '90s, on a whim and just for fun I took it to AAMCO, 'new transmission time' they told me, 'they all do that, it's dead man'. I looked up factory service manual at the public library and figured out how to fix the slip with a thirty cent washer, the car still runs fine with no slip today.

And people wonder why I am the way I am.
I didn't twist ur english if u read back to the orig post I said most people will trust shops instead of dropping 20k on a machine then ur next response you say u would be capible of doing the work which wasn't part of the convo anywho...

I'm not saying ur wrong but every trans has drasticly different tolerances, also you say flushing the trans won't reove sludge if you look at most trans "quick fixes" they are just thicker oil with most of its sole purpose of taking up space, I've rebuilt3only 4 transmissions in my life so I'm no proclaimed pro but I do know what I'm talking about, I'm not saying you don't however...

Good discussion...
Claim not, dynos prove all!
200two-zx3 is offline  
    Reply With Quote